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Post by Non Alum Dave on Jan 30, 2017 17:48:28 GMT -5
I wonder.....if, say, we had NCAA wins over Kansas and Arkansas (or Duke) instead of Southern......if we had developed a NBA player.....maybe had road wins at Pittsburgh, Syracuse, Xavier, Arizona, Richmond, DePaul, Vanderbilt......just maybe we'd have a big league game Wednesday against Villanova instead of Colgate.
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Post by cfrivals on Jan 30, 2017 18:18:02 GMT -5
Dave,that used to be the expectation and the desire,but I think after 36 years of missed opportunities, the expectations are so low. We got extatic when we lost 20 games and won the playin game. We make excuses when we lose by teens to Navy. Any major team we play, we lose by 30 and we think that is ok. We have lost to all the top teams in PL, when we should own them. We have been in the bottom half of the PL for a long time. To me, unacceptable. Also the hart BB renovation is not impressive, maybe more to come but the intermission experience is like attending a travel league game. And the on the court action, is boring and at times unwatchable.
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Post by bigfan on Jan 30, 2017 18:37:49 GMT -5
I'm not too concerned with the intermission experience but I am hoping for better results on the court action. Why can't we recruit better athletes, the main reason is the PL. The better athletes want to play in a better league like the A-10 which would be a perfect fit for Holy Cross. The A-10 would be more exciting, bring back the fans and restore HC basketball to where it belongs.
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Post by A Clock Tower Purple on Jan 30, 2017 18:42:33 GMT -5
I wonder.....if, say, we had NCAA wins over Kansas and Arkansas (or Duke) instead of Southern......if we had developed a NBA player.....maybe had road wins at Pittsburgh, Syracuse, Xavier, Arizona, Richmond, DePaul, Vanderbilt......just maybe we'd have a big league game Wednesday against Villanova instead of Colgate. Could be Dave, but a lot simpler route would have been a simple nod to Dave Gavitt about 38 years ago.
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Post by res on Jan 30, 2017 19:23:27 GMT -5
I wonder.....if, say, we had NCAA wins over Kansas and Arkansas (or Duke) instead of Southern......if we had developed a NBA player.....maybe had road wins at Pittsburgh, Syracuse, Xavier, Arizona, Richmond, DePaul, Vanderbilt......just maybe we'd have a big league game Wednesday against Villanova instead of Colgate. Probably not Villanova. Perhaps American.
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Post by Non Alum Dave on Jan 30, 2017 19:25:38 GMT -5
No denying that ACTP....it just seems a tab embarrassing when the PL takes the blame for our woes, when we are aways from being the dominant program in it (now that the playing field has been leveled).
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Post by Non Alum Dave on Jan 30, 2017 19:27:25 GMT -5
I wonder.....if, say, we had NCAA wins over Kansas and Arkansas (or Duke) instead of Southern......if we had developed a NBA player.....maybe had road wins at Pittsburgh, Syracuse, Xavier, Arizona, Richmond, DePaul, Vanderbilt......just maybe we'd have a big league game Wednesday against Villanova instead of Colgate. Probably not Villanova. Perhaps American. Sitting on the 3-1 fastball down the middle, weren't you Res.
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Post by A Clock Tower Purple on Jan 30, 2017 19:37:36 GMT -5
No denying that ACTP....it just seems a tab embarrassing when the PL takes the blame for our woes, when we are aways from being the dominant program in it (now that the playing field has been leveled). The decline of HC hoops can be attributed to 5 things Dave: 1) the creation of the BE 2) HC declining a BE invite 3) RW leaving for L-ville 4) all PL schools offering schollies 5) 2 straight poor coaching hires by DR. It takes a looooong time to bounce back from all this.
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Post by res on Jan 30, 2017 19:46:58 GMT -5
Sitting on the 3-1 fastball down the middle, weren't you Res. I really wasn't, dave. I thought you were making a point that no one else got and I just wanted to let you know that at least someone did.
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Post by cfrivals on Jan 30, 2017 19:49:37 GMT -5
And the choice to not upgrade facilities and leagues in the 2003-2007 era as we were at our peak in the post BE debacle
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Post by timholycross on Jan 30, 2017 19:53:15 GMT -5
No denying that ACTP....it just seems a tab embarrassing when the PL takes the blame for our woes, when we are aways from being the dominant program in it (now that the playing field has been leveled). The decline of HC hoops can be attributed to 5 things Dave: 1) the creation of the BE 2) HC declining a BE invite 3) RW leaving for L-ville 4) all PL schools offering schollies 5) 2 straight poor coaching hires by DR. It takes a looooong time to bounce back from all this. You missed two (between 2 and 3). HC declining an A10 (or whatever it was known at in 1982) invite two or 3 years later The PL morphing from a football league to an all sports conference
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Post by Tom on Jan 30, 2017 19:58:27 GMT -5
Dave,that used to be the expectation and the desire,but I think after 36 years of missed opportunities, the expectations are so low. We got extatic when we lost 20 games and won the playin game. We make excuses when we lose by teens to Navy. Any major team we play, we lose by 30 and we think that is ok. We have lost to all the top teams in PL, when we should own them. We have been in the bottom half of the PL for a long time. To me, unacceptable. Also the hart BB renovation is not impressive, maybe more to come but the intermission experience is like attending a travel league game. And the on the court action, is boring and at times unwatchable. Ecstatic is , a bit of an overstatement. Getting into the field of 64 is always a lot of fun. After 6 years of disappointing results that had a trajectory to perennial middle of the packers in the PL without ever really competing for the top of a low major league, last years late season run was a light at the end of the tunnel. If we were ecstatic, it was about a return of hope, not a PIG win. There is also a difference between making excuses and recognizing Rome wasn't built in a day. I don't like losing by double digits to Navy, but I can be patient as long as there is steady progress. Early indications are that the team is moving forward. As long as this continues that will have to do for the short term
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Jan 30, 2017 20:07:17 GMT -5
No denying that ACTP....it just seems a tab embarrassing when the PL takes the blame for our woes, when we are aways from being the dominant program in it (now that the playing field has been leveled). I recall ADNP saying, early-on, in reply to a question about changing conferences, that before HC could expect an invite from a higher conference, HC first had to be dominant in its own conference. Why would a higher conference want a school that is not successful in its current (lower) conference?
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Post by Tom on Jan 30, 2017 20:22:53 GMT -5
I'm not too concerned with the intermission experience but I am hoping for better results on the court action. Why can't we recruit better athletes, the main reason is the PL. The better athletes want to play in a better league like the A-10 which would be a perfect fit for Holy Cross. The A-10 would be more exciting, bring back the fans and restore HC basketball to where it belongs. A-10 is only worthwhile if HC could be reasonably competitive. I would prefer Willard-esque PL success (going to the league championship basically every year) versus the Fordham model of being in the A-10 cellar for 20 consecutive years. Last place year in year out doesn't bring back fans. No point in talking about playing in a big boy league (or even a middle boy league) until you've proven you've outgrown your own league
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Post by cfrivals on Jan 30, 2017 20:38:14 GMT -5
Problem is we did outgrow this league and didn't do anything about it and have fallen into a deeper hole this time around. I would rather take lumps in A10 then in PL We have a uphill battle in our current situation. I say start recruiting high conference transfers to try to grow program faster.
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Post by Non Alum Dave on Jan 30, 2017 20:42:17 GMT -5
Sitting on the 3-1 fastball down the middle, weren't you Res. I really wasn't, dave. I thought you were making a point that no one else got and I just wanted to let you know that at least someone did. Gotcha, res.....and you beat 137. . And to extend my point, if I was a make believe Big East poacher, I'd be taking a much longer look at Bucknell right now than Holy Cross.....you guys even have more chairbacks, for crying out loud.
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Post by hc87 on Jan 30, 2017 20:45:10 GMT -5
Men's basketball will nevah be very good as long as we are in the PL......good enough to make the tourney every so often? Sure....but year to year, it won't create excitement with students/alumni/general public. Terrible league for our premiere sport to be in.
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Post by A Clock Tower Purple on Jan 30, 2017 20:53:06 GMT -5
Men's basketball will nevah be very good as long as we are in the PL......good enough to make the tourney every so often? Sure....but year to year, it won't create excitement with students/alumni/general public. Terrible league for our premiere sport to be in. Contradicting yourself within the same post 87. HC WAS very good in the PL, and yes - the PL blows, but lack of fan interest has zero effect on the quality of the team.
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Post by hc87 on Jan 30, 2017 20:57:02 GMT -5
Not really...yeah, we can have halfway decent teams in the PL (and have)....but hardly anyone cares (until the PLT or NCAAs) and it's a league that could cure insomniacs with its gyms/arenas, general passion for the sport within the league etc etc
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Post by joe on Jan 30, 2017 21:02:15 GMT -5
Maybe we can replicate past BB and FB glory by again finding leagues where we can have schollies while no one else does. This way we don't have to sweat the details.
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Post by hc87 on Jan 30, 2017 21:06:17 GMT -5
I don't know how it happens....but we should be like Fordham, Georgetown or Villanova athletically.....football in FCS, basketball at a much higher level.
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Post by joe on Jan 30, 2017 21:12:45 GMT -5
I don't know how it happens....but we should be like Fordham, Georgetown or Villanova athletically.....football in FCS, basketball at a much higher level. I don't know how it happens either but if we are to stick with the whole D1 thing this model should be our goal, along with de-emphasis of all the sports we perennially suck at. And we need to crap or get off the pot with hockey. Alternatively we can be D3, keep all the sports, and have some of the nation's finest facilities at that level and likely do very well.
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Jan 30, 2017 21:27:02 GMT -5
I don't know how it happens....but we should be like Fordham, Georgetown or Villanova athletically.....football in FCS, basketball at a much higher level. How would we succeed at a higher level if we cannot be dominant in the PL? How would Holy Cross succeed where Fordham has failed so miserably?
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Post by hc87 on Jan 30, 2017 22:12:33 GMT -5
We are bad/poor/average (pick your poison/adjective) because we are in the PL for basketball. We are not going to "play our way out of this league"....impossible to do so given the recruiting limitations of the PL....has to be a "clean break" somehow.
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Post by bison137 on Jan 30, 2017 22:17:08 GMT -5
I'm not too concerned with the intermission experience but I am hoping for better results on the court action. Why can't we recruit better athletes, the main reason is the PL. just curious. Why are other PL teams able to recruit better athletes?
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