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Post by unhfan on Mar 1, 2017 14:51:50 GMT -5
Biggest problem New England is a pro sports region compared to down here in the South! I'm vacationing here in Naples and I can count on one hand the number of Pro Sports references I've seen here. Now I've seen hundreds of college sports references in supermarkets, bumper stickers, team gear etc. Just a completely different sports atmosphere here vs New England.
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Post by ncaam on Mar 1, 2017 15:26:09 GMT -5
Naples has almost no college sports buzz unless you are a Gator.
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Post by unhfan on Mar 1, 2017 15:42:59 GMT -5
Naples has almost no college sports buzz unless you are a Gator. [ I've seen a variety of Gators, Hurricanes and Seminoles.
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Mar 1, 2017 17:52:33 GMT -5
I am going to draw a comparison between Greater New York and Massachusetts. If one draws boundaries to leave out New Brunswick, and West Point, only St. John's and Seton Hall draw any sort of respectable attendance in a metropolitan area with over 15 million people.
IMO, when it comes to attendance and interest, pretty much all the air has been sucked up by the professional teams. I also think the scandals of 50+ years ago put the kibosh on NYC having a rivalry competition similar to the Big Five in Philadelphia.
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Post by bikeman on Mar 1, 2017 18:09:17 GMT -5
I wonder if HC were ever relevant again it would boost interest in all of New England for college bball like it did in the 70's.
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Mar 1, 2017 19:44:51 GMT -5
I wonder if HC were ever relevant again it would boost interest in all of New England for college bball like it did in the 70's. The short answer is, 'No'. Attendance-wise, college basketball was not big in the Northeast in the late 1970s. Top 100, average home attendance in 1978Providence #32, 9,168 Syracuse #37, 8,605 Rutgers #68, 6,107 UPenn #82, 5,106 URI #93, 4,801 St. John's #98, 4,627 ----------------------- HC #125, 3,891 ______________________________________________ In 2016, rankings of top 100 Providence #44 (9,703) Syracuse #2 (21,592) Rutgers, not ranked (4,653) UPenn, not ranked (3,213) URI not ranked (4,717) St. John's #71 (6,944)
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Post by cmo on Mar 1, 2017 19:49:29 GMT -5
Obviously hypothetical, but what would HC's attendance have been in '78 if they had played in a bigger arena. Everyone always mentions how tickets to the Hart were tough to come by during those years.
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Post by bikeman on Mar 1, 2017 20:19:03 GMT -5
I would guess easily 7-8000. The home schedule was sold out before the season began.
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Post by DiMarz on Mar 1, 2017 20:34:19 GMT -5
So many small schools...Nothing like the size of the big guys!
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Mar 1, 2017 20:35:29 GMT -5
Obviously hypothetical, but what would HC's attendance have been in '78 if they had played in a bigger arena. Everyone always mentions how tickets to the Hart were tough to come by during those years. As you say, a hypothetical. Two factors that would affect attendance. 1.) How many students who could easily walk to the Hart for a game wouldn't go to the DCU. 2.) Atmosphere. How many of those attending wanted to be at a packed Hart because the atmosphere was so great. That atmosphere is likely lost at the DCU. My brother is a big hoops fan, he always wanted to attend an ACC game at Cameron. Finally, he was able to get tickets from an ACC team (not BC) visiting Cameron, so he sat behind their bench. As he said afterward, 'was worth every minute'. I'm sure if he lived in Raleigh he'd have season tickets. Yet he had little interest in watching Duke play @ BC, would rather watch it on TV.
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Mar 1, 2017 21:07:33 GMT -5
So many small schools...Nothing like the size of the big guys! Exactly. Small enrollment, small alumni base, largely dispersed elsewhere. And perhaps most importantly, most opponent schools have little/no fanbase in Worcester. Georgetown discovered this when Syracuse and UConn were sent packing from the BE. Creighton and DePaul and Xavier are simply not the draw that those two schools were. St. Mary's, current record is 26-3. A school, that in some ways is an analog for HC. Attendance 2016-17, selected games (5 of the 8 games are Bay area teams. St. Mary's @ Stanford 4079 BYU @ St Mary's 3500 St. Mary's @ Santa Clara 2707 St. Mary's at USF 2456 Portland @ St. Mary's 2813 USF @ St Mary's 3233 Gonzaga @ St. Mary's 3500 Santa Clara @ St. Mary's 3500 Seems to me that one game, Gonzaga, might merit playing in a bigger venue.
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Post by hchoops on Mar 1, 2017 21:17:07 GMT -5
So many small schools...Nothing like the size of the big guys! Exactly. Small enrollment, small alumni base, largely dispersed elsewhere. And perhaps most importantly, most opponent schools have little/no fanbase in Worcester. Georgetown discovered this when Syracuse and UConn were sent packing from the BE. Creighton and DePaul and Xavier are simply not the draw that those two schools were. St. Mary's, current record is 26-3. A school, that in some ways is an analog for HC. Attendance 2016-17, selected games (5 of the 8 games are Bay area teams. St. Mary's @ Stanford 4079 BYU @ St Mary's 3500 St. Mary's @ Santa Clara 2707 St. Mary's at USF 2456 Portland @ St. Mary's 2813 USF @ St Mary's 3233 Gonzaga @ St. Mary's 3500 Santa Clara @ St. Mary's 3500 Seems to me that one game, Gonzaga, might merit playing in a bigger venue. 1-Gtown would draw more if they were winning] 2-according to your numbers, didn't St. Mary's sell out the BYU and Santa Clara games as well as the one with the Zags ? So a bigger venue was merited for at least 3 games this season
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Mar 2, 2017 8:51:22 GMT -5
hoops, I think the only other venue near Moraga is the Oracle Arena, which seats nearly 20,000. And assuming the Gaels wouldn't play at Cal Berkeley, my point was that only Gonzaga might draw sufficient additional fans above 3,500 to make rental of Oracle worthwhile; marginal cost versus marginal demand.
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Post by hchoops on Mar 2, 2017 8:55:55 GMT -5
IF HC could get to the St. Mary's level of success, we would not have their nearby larger venue problem
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Post by zambonihomie13 on Mar 2, 2017 11:01:27 GMT -5
I wonder if HC were ever relevant again it would boost interest in all of New England for college bball like it did in the 70's. The short answer is, 'No'. Attendance-wise, college basketball was not big in the Northeast in the late 1970s. Top 100, average home attendance in 1978Providence #32, 9,168 Syracuse #37, 8,605 Rutgers #68, 6,107 UPenn #82, 5,106 URI #93, 4,801 St. John's #98, 4,627 ----------------------- HC #125, 3,891 ______________________________________________ In 2016, rankings of top 100 Providence #44 (9,703) Syracuse #2 (21,592) Rutgers, not ranked (4,653) UPenn, not ranked (3,213) URI not ranked (4,717) St. John's #71 (6,944) Another thing to consider is that UConn is one of maybe the top 3-5 programs since 1990, and vaulted into the top 5-8 or so overall programs, and it has not had a similar effect on college basketball in New England. Even in a down year, with a crummy conference schedule, they were 40th nationally in attendance.
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Post by timholycross on Mar 2, 2017 11:10:28 GMT -5
I wonder if HC were ever relevant again it would boost interest in all of New England for college bball like it did in the 70's. The short answer is, 'No'. Attendance-wise, college basketball was not big in the Northeast in the late 1970s. Top 100, average home attendance in 1978Providence #32, 9,168 Syracuse #37, 8,605 Rutgers #68, 6,107 UPenn #82, 5,106 URI #93, 4,801 St. John's #98, 4,627 ----------------------- HC #125, 3,891 ______________________________________________ In 2016, rankings of top 100 Providence #44 (9,703) Syracuse #2 (21,592) Rutgers, not ranked (4,653) UPenn, not ranked (3,213) URI not ranked (4,717) St. John's #71 (6,944) Couple of interesting things there- 1. Syracuse you can throw out as in 1978 they were playing in Manley Field House. 2. URI used to play a 'home' game with PC at the Dunk in those days, maybe another game or two there...I doubt that their average attendance at Keaney Gym was higher than it is at the Ryan Center....not very many attractive opponents wanted to play there. 3. Penn was, as HC87 would say, a "contendah" in those days and Rutgers was a year or two removed from being in the Final 4.
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Post by hchoops on Mar 2, 2017 11:11:20 GMT -5
But i presume Uconn's men's team's attendance is trending downward since the end of their big East days, and heading further down
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Post by zambonihomie13 on Mar 2, 2017 11:53:43 GMT -5
But i presume Uconn's men's team's attendance is trending downward since the end of their big East days, and heading further down For sure. They will need either a long run in March soon, a consistently challenging and interesting OOC schedule, or a life raft from one of the P6 conferences to not only retain their past attendance numbers but perhaps salvage the athletic department as a whole. Otherwise they, just like us and the rest of the Northeast college athletic contingent, will be pining for yesteryear.
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Post by hchoops on Mar 2, 2017 12:04:24 GMT -5
Perhaps excepting Villanova
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Post by ncaam on Mar 2, 2017 17:43:54 GMT -5
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Post by DiMarz on Mar 2, 2017 18:40:11 GMT -5
Interesting piece! Thanks for posting..
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Post by res on Mar 6, 2017 14:11:50 GMT -5
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Post by timholycross on Mar 6, 2017 15:34:11 GMT -5
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Mar 6, 2017 15:45:36 GMT -5
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Post by ncaam on Mar 6, 2017 16:10:49 GMT -5
In 58-59 we played @pitt, @wvu, and two days later to Buffalo to play Niagara. Fwiw
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