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Post by Sons of Vaval on Jan 5, 2019 19:21:56 GMT -5
Calhoun at Conn.
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Post by DiMarz on Jan 5, 2019 19:47:40 GMT -5
He just didn't like playing against RW's match-up....and he said he couldn't figure it out so he wasn't going to play HC any more...
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Post by rgs318 on Jan 5, 2019 20:45:33 GMT -5
Fordham said they would not play HC because the Cross was not a real challenge for them...then he lost again to us.
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Post by CHC8485 on Jan 5, 2019 21:02:48 GMT -5
I may be mis-remembering but I think others on the board have recounted an an incident at Fordham in the 70s. May have been pre-Ronnie Perry. Possibly when Digger Phelps was at Fordham?
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Post by hchoops on Jan 5, 2019 21:08:34 GMT -5
It was Michael V. on the opening tipoff vs Fordham’s Daryll Brown, who is still hurting. Well After .Digger.
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Post by CHC8485 on Jan 5, 2019 21:14:59 GMT -5
Was referring to the event mm67 referenced but just found a NYT story on the game at Rose Hill in 1971, the year Digger was at Fordham. The Rams won handily. No mention of an altercation. So, as Emily Litella used to say ... never mind.
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Post by CHC8485 on Jan 5, 2019 21:47:29 GMT -5
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Post by hchoops on Jan 5, 2019 21:54:15 GMT -5
Typical Penders thuggishness and stubbornness Crowley went on to work Final Fours. Tracy was also a NYC ref. I had them both when I coached in the CHSAA. Two good refs. Crowley later was the supervisor of refs in multiple Eastern leagues, inc the PL
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Post by Tom on Jan 6, 2019 10:18:17 GMT -5
We should never let facts get in the way of our opinions. However, it depends on which facts and context is everything. I think Carmody's team plays a beautiful game of basketball.I enjoy watching them play. The great coach, Ralph Willard, I suspect geared his team's style - deliberate offense with a rough, rugged defense - to the kind of talent he was able to get at HC and the teams on his schedule. My friend who was a friend of a coach told me that he was told by said coach that this coach and others did not like playing against Willard's teams because HC was rough bordering on dirty and the coaches were simply concerned about injuries to their players even though they regularly beat HC. Naturally, I responded that I didn't buy it and they should just put on their jock straps, lace up their sneakers, play the damn game and shut the hell up. But then some teams stopped playing us. Hmmn. Does anyone know if there is any truth to what I was told? LoveHC I frequently poke fun at Skinner who said BC wouldn't play HC anymore after Craig Smith (who was built more like a boxer than a basketball player) was getting roughed up by the HC thugs like Alex Vander Baan (who had the build of a cross country runner)
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Post by timholycross on Jan 6, 2019 10:30:37 GMT -5
..so Vicens was gone too, I think Penders' felt RP was being favored by the zebras, which of course, all of us would dispute. They ended up having a few good teams with him as coach, then he moved on to RI and did better there. Can't blame Phelps for moving on- hard to win consistently at Fordham with such poor facilities.
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Post by hchoops on Jan 6, 2019 12:09:35 GMT -5
Those facilities were not that poor then. He was blamed, rightfully, because of all his Fordham bluster about family, loyalty, long term commitment, etc., then saying ND was always his dream job. He was always full of SH..
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Jan 6, 2019 12:40:30 GMT -5
Digger Phelps--a self-important blowhard, just so full of himself.
I remember the PR bit during his Notre Dame years-that he bought a new suit to wear for each nationally broadcast game--yeah, we really care what the coaches wear.
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Post by sader1970 on Jan 6, 2019 12:55:06 GMT -5
Digger Phelps was my earliest memory of a coach who lacked any sense of commitment and loyalty. He basically screwed Fordham by breaking his contract. That Notre Dame would steal him took them from "who cares about the 'Fighting Irish'" to "I can't stand the 'Fighting Irish'" for me. Foisting SK on Holy Cross was the nail in the coffin for me. Many here can't stand BC but for me, it is Notre Dame.
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Post by sader1970 on Jan 6, 2019 13:49:54 GMT -5
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Post by longsuffering on Jan 6, 2019 17:56:16 GMT -5
Jack Donahue is a blast from the past. I hope a good number of season tickets were sold during the brief period of excitement after Jack was hired and before Lew Alcindor announced he would attend UCLA.
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Post by timholycross on Jan 6, 2019 18:07:46 GMT -5
Notre Dame's arena didn't open up until I was a senior in high school, 1969, Prior to that they played in a pit called the Rockne Memorial. Not too many decent teams ventured there. The capacity was in the 3s. I doubt Jack D wanted to play there any more than ND wanted to play in Worcester.
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Post by longsuffering on Jan 6, 2019 20:47:33 GMT -5
I just googled the late Jack Donohue. His record at HC from 1965 to 1972 was 106-66. So he was a good hire even without bringing Lew Alcindor (now Kareem Abdul Jabar) who he coached at Power Memorial Academy with him. We played some D-2 teams like Stonehill then but also many that are in power conferences now, in general probably a tougher schedule.
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Post by hchoops on Jan 6, 2019 20:49:05 GMT -5
Much tougher
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Post by sader1970 on Jan 6, 2019 21:42:33 GMT -5
Jack was a very good coach but he was an excellent storyteller. Best I ever heard. His "gift of gab" probably helped him in recruiting. I very funny guy. He went on to coach the Canadian national basketball team for years. But I am sure hoops can tell you many more stories. A nice biography was written about him maybe 5-7 years ago.
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Post by hchoops on Jan 6, 2019 21:56:23 GMT -5
Worked his camp and helped him recruit NYC, when that was not against NCAA rules.. Not only funny, but a kind, wonderful man. Too many stories for now Kareem’s eulogy at Jack’s NYC memorial mass was a fitting tribute.
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Jan 6, 2019 22:32:18 GMT -5
I went to a few of Jack’s sessions with students—talked about recent games, players, plans, etc—he was extremely funny. I recall talking with one of our players about his recruitment. He said other coaches who recruited him were serious but that from the minute he got in the car with Jack to go to dinner to the minute jack dropped him off back at home he was laughing the whole time.
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Post by rgs318 on Jan 7, 2019 8:21:20 GMT -5
One of my favorite JD stories was about his recruiting of Calvin Murphy. Jack aid he thought Calvin had great ability on the court (he never referred, that I remember, to Murphy's baton twirling) but he had concerns about the college boards. Calvin replied, "They are no problem. I get right up over the rim on those too." Jack said he knew Calvin ws not HC material and Niagra will probably always be thankful for that.
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Post by sader1970 on Jan 7, 2019 9:32:12 GMT -5
Heard that story too,Rob.
One of my favorites was about an unnamed recruit who was considering another school in the Albany area. He wouldn’t give the kid’s name to protect the guilty. Kid lived in NYC.
Kid was a dead shot but dumb as a doorknob.
So the recruit wanted to go “local” and Jack tried to explain that while Worcester may not have been local, neither was Albany. There was a map on the wall and Jack gets up to the map and points from NYC to Albany and says “How far do you think that is?” The kid in all seriousness says “4 inches.” Jack knew right then he was wasting his time trying to get him to HC.
But what made him funny was what he said next. He said after the kid left the room, he looked at the map and out of curiosity he got a ruler out and, sure enough, it was exactly 4 inches.
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Post by bringbackcaro on Jan 7, 2019 14:51:21 GMT -5
Disclaimer: My opinion based on stats is included below. Please skip if you are too sensitive to read something written by someone who might have a different opinion than you.With the talk in the Navy thread about “ugly” and “pretty” games, and the “grind” of conference games, I decided to take a quick look at the performance of Carmody’s Northwestern teams in road games in the BIG10 conference. The question I was hoping to gain some better insight into was: Does Carmody’s style and system prepare his teams to win tough conference games with any level of consistency? Some stats: - Over 13 seasons, Carmody’s teams were 21-89 (.191) in BIG10 road games
- The highest B10 road win total was 3, achieved two times. In 11 of 13 seasons, his teams won 2 or fewer B10 road games. (7 seasons with 8 road games, 6 with 9 road games). In 6 of 13 seasons, his teams won 1 or 0 B10 road games
- Of the 21 wins those teams accumulated, only 4 (19%) were against teams who finished in the top half of the B10 in that particular season
- The average B10 rank of the teams Northwestern beat on the road was 8.4. (median = 9)
- Of the 21 wins those teams accumulated, only 4 (19%) were against teams who finished with a B10 record of at least .500 in that particular season
- The average B10 winning percentage of the teams Northwestern beat on the road was .342. (median = .313)
- 2010-11 was likely Carmody’s best chance to get a Nortwestern team to the NCAA Tournament (final KenPom rank of 50), but they could only manage a B10 road record of 2-7 (.222).
Carmody has won conference road games at a slightly higher clip at Holy Cross ( 8-21, .276), but the teams have continued to be extremely inconsistent. Based on these data points, I would argue that employing a system that places more emphasis on perimeter shooting than defense and rebounding does not equip a team to win with any type of consistency in conference road games, particularly against the better teams in the league.
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Post by hc80 on Jan 7, 2019 15:26:14 GMT -5
Notre Dame's arena didn't open up until I was a senior in high school, 1969, Prior to that they played in a pit called the Rockne Memorial. Not too many decent teams ventured there. The capacity was in the 3s. I doubt Jack D wanted to play there any more than ND wanted to play in Worcester. Actually, the Irish played in what was generally referred to as the "Fieldhouse" -- the Rock was always built as a rec center for the students -- there was a gym, pool, etc.... Still used for intramurals and general recreation. Had the chance to play in pickup games there few times in the late 70s. After the ACC (now the Joyce Center) was built, the Fieldhouse was used for fine art studios and the like. One of my good friends had his pottery class there as a matter of fact....
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