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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Dec 21, 2018 7:05:38 GMT -5
I looked at HC's endowment relative to the other four PL football schools. To expand the sample, I also looked at the endowments of five New England liberal arts colleges. Unless noted, the endowment values are taken from the audited financial statements.
Six year change in endowment value between July 1 2012 and June 30 2018Bowdoin +85 percent from $902 million to $1628 million Wesleyan +73 percent from $616 million to $1065 million Bucknell +42 percent from $599 million to $851 million Lafayette +42 percent from $682 million to $968 million (The $968 million value is from Bloomberg. The June 30, 2017 value was $833 million, or +22 percent) Colby +38 percent from $600 million to $828 million Colgate +34 percent from $699 million to $935 million Holy Cross +33 percent from $590 million to $783 million Smith +33 percent from $1410 million to $1875 million Lehigh +31 percent from $995 million to $1302 million Middlebury +16 percent from $973 million to $1124 million I excluded Williams and Amherst from the comparison because they are 'too rich'. Source: investment.williams.edu/files/investment_report_2018_FINAL2.pdfAn interesting, graphics-rich report illustrating the growth in Williams' endowment, largely through shrewd investing. (HC's endowment would need to be $3 billion to equal $1 million per student.) Amherst's return on investment in fiscal 2018 was over $240 million. ___________________ For the several posters here who believe HC could have done much better by putting its money in index funds: www.nytimes.com/2018/12/13/business/ivy-league-endowments-investments-portfolio.html _____________________________________________ As for the HC endowment providing 'nice things' for HC in the near future, probably not. S&P 500 Close2423 Jun 30 2017 2718 Jun 29 2018 +12.1 percent for the HC fiscal year 2467 Dec 20 2018
Change in endowment value July 1 2017 - June 20 2018+4.5 percent HC +5.8 percent Colgate +6,4 percent Bucknell Many chief executives foresee a recession in 2019. From a Yale CEO summit ten days ago. som.yale.edu/faculty-research-centers/centers-initiatives/chief-executive-leadership-institute/programs/ceo-summit |
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Post by sader1970 on Dec 21, 2018 7:29:55 GMT -5
Interesting that HC has the smallest endowment of the listed PL schools. Just surprised that Phreek did not do some analysis per student as he usually does.
For the record, a number of posters continue to think the HC student body is sub 3,000. It is not. The official full time student enrollment is listed as 3,102, in part due to the last class ('22) enrolling 868 freshmen.
Certainly Phreek's unstated purpose for his post is to show and reinforce what he often posits that there are real limitations to the many things that posters here think HC should do with all that endowment money.
Phreek, in your opinion, should HC's Chief Investment Officer be getting that large salaries and large bonuses?
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Dec 21, 2018 9:25:11 GMT -5
Interesting that HC has the smallest endowment of the listed PL schools. Just surprised that Phreek did not do some analysis per student as he usually does. For the record, a number of posters continue to think the HC student body is sub 3,000. It is not. The official full time student enrollment is listed as 3,102, in part due to the last class ('22) enrolling 868 freshmen. Certainly Phreek's unstated purpose for his post is to show and reinforce what he often posits that there are real limitations to the many things that posters here think HC should do with all that endowment money. Phreek, in your opinion, should HC's Chief Investment Officer be getting that large salaries and large bonuses? HC still has the second highest endowment per student among Catholic colleges and universities. Notre Dame is so far ahead that the Irish can't see HC in the rear view mirror. Among the PL schools, just from eyeballing, Lafayette and Colgate have a significantly higher endowment per student than HC does. HC is a bit ahead of Bucknell, And Lehigh trails Bucknell, largely due to Lehigh having about 7,000 students in total. GU, Loyola, Fordham, BU, and AU trail HC. (BU's enrollment is about 35,000, its endowment $2.2 billion.) Michael Lockheed, who previously was at HC, announced thar BC's endowment had grown by 10.7 percent in fiscal 2018. As for compensation, one would have to see what performance targets were set for the highest paid employee at HC, and how actual performance compared to the target. Certainly, if he was the hoops coach, and he received a performance bonus for winning 12 games last season, I would be sorely disappointed at such a payout.. |
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Post by sader1970 on Dec 21, 2018 9:37:24 GMT -5
1. Phew! I feel better already. Was concerned for you that you might have lost your "$ per student" way.  2. I sure hope the expectation bar has not been set too low for the CIO (as in "investment" not "information"). Too many folks in the academic world don't get paid what they are worth to have some money guy doing "meets" performance get paid a half mil a year. That'd pay for 2-3 professors. Or, if you prefer, a top-flight head coach or AD.  |
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Post by alum on Dec 21, 2018 10:19:08 GMT -5
As I have been saying over many years, the endowment needs to improve a lot more to well over $1billion if HC is going to be able to successfully compete with other high quality academic colleges. Period! Unfortunately the stock market(S&P, DJIA among others) is in a correction and actually down for the year and the outlook is for little if any growth. I hope that our investors have taken a short position and are in bonds on many of the endowment's investments. Period! As the late Fr. Brooks often stated in words to the effect: Money alone does not guarantee a high quality academic institution but without money(and lots of it) it is impossible to be a high quality college. LoveHC The college has generated a number of large gifts in recent years, but they have all been in support of improvements to the physical plant. If I recall correctly, only about $90 million of the campaign was aimed at improving financial aid. If the College could raise the funds to take student loans out of the financial aid package, it would present a great marketing opportunity and would reduce the cost for a lot of middle class/upper middle class kids. |
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Post by matunuck on Dec 21, 2018 10:24:39 GMT -5
We need a Michael Bloomberg  |
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Dec 21, 2018 10:58:21 GMT -5
Roughly, $ of endowment per student. Holy Cross $255,000 Boston College $170,000 HC is 2nd behind ND among the Catholics.. BC is third. Then a big gap, probably to Santa Clara at #4. Fordham's total endowment value is probably less than HC and Fordham has 5x the number of students. A graph showing BC's endowment growth. HC, in 1980, may have had a slightly larger endowment than BC.  |
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Post by hcpride on Dec 21, 2018 12:39:28 GMT -5
Compared to some secular liberal arts colleges as PP illustrates our endowment is smallish but, since we have very little in common with those schools in terms of applicants and potential applicants, I am more concerned with our endowment relative to our competitors. I tend to value the total endowment instead of the per-pupil breakdown. And I tend to want a larger endowment that we can leverage towards increased financial aid for the middle/upper middle class donut-hole kid as well as erasing our 'loans as aid' practice. I believe those were the exact aims of the Bloomberg donation. As another poster noted, we want a Bloomberg.
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Post by sader1970 on Dec 21, 2018 14:49:19 GMT -5
As I think I asked here once before, who is our wealthiest alum? As I recall, we had some discussion about the UHaul guy but we know he’s not turning into a Bloomburg. My guess is that he isn’t the richest alum anyway.
Bloomburg makes Park Smith and the Luths look like pikers by comparison.
But as it says in the Bible, the former mayor was giving from his surplus.
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Post by DFW HOYA on Dec 21, 2018 14:52:59 GMT -5
HC still has the second highest endowment per student among Catholic colleges and universities. Notre Dame is so far ahead that the Irish can't see HC in the rear view mirror. Among the PL schools, just from eyeballing, Lafayette and Colgate have a significantly higher endowment per student than HC does. HC is a bit ahead of Bucknell, And Lehigh trails Bucknell, largely due to Lehigh having about 7,000 students in total. GU, Loyola, Fordham, BU, and AU trail HC. (BU's enrollment is about 35,000, its endowment $2.2 billion.) Endowment per student also counts graduate and professional students, which brings down the ratio for schools with a large presence outside the undergraduate ranks. NYU has a $3.5 billion endowment, for example, yet their endowment per student is $62,000. Brown has a $3.1 billion endowment with an endowment per student of nearly $340,000. |
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Post by rickii on Dec 21, 2018 15:18:44 GMT -5
As I have been saying over many years, the endowment needs to improve a lot more to well over $1billion if HC is going to be able to successfully compete with other high quality academic colleges. Period! Unfortunately the stock market(S&P, DJIA among others) is in a correction and actually down for the year and the outlook is for little if any growth. I hope that our investors have taken a short position and are in bonds on many of the endowment's investments. Period! As the late Fr. Brooks often stated in words to the effect: Money alone does not guarantee a high quality academic institution but without money(and lots of it) it is impossible to be a high quality college. LoveHC The time to short was 3 months ago....and buying bonds ( presume you mean high quality corporates ) in a rising interest rate environment is not recommended. |
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Post by sader1970 on Dec 21, 2018 21:01:08 GMT -5
Haven't seen the numbers of non-Catholic high school admissions lately but believe you are correct whether stated explicitly or implicitly (hey, with no Crusader anymore, those non-Catholic kids might be more willing to come. Now, if we could just change the name of the school . . . .  ) FYI, mm67, here's a link that might answer some of your other questions you are thinking about but haven't asked yet: www.holycross.edu/about-holy-cross/holy-cross-glance |
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Post by rgs318 on Dec 22, 2018 7:29:14 GMT -5
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Post by hcpride on Dec 22, 2018 8:28:18 GMT -5
I may be mistaken but it has been my understanding that a goal of the school has been to try to compete with other near Ivy, little Ivy , Ivy and other PL type schools for the same kind of students rather than only/ primarily trying to enroll students who might otherwise go to another Catholic school. In fact the school in the past has adverised that most of the student population was not from Catholic high schools. Is that still true? I thought it was part of the school's progression from "seminary" to quote Sarasota to a diversified high academic and Catholic college. LoveHC To the extent this helps see who is going after the same kids, US News & World Report lists four cross-applicant schools as part of its annual and widely-read ratings each year: Holy Cross: BC, Fordham, Providence, UMass Amherst Boston College: Georgetown, Northeastern, Notre Dame, University of Virginia Fordham: Binghamton (SUNY), BC, BU, NYU Georgetown: BC, Duke, NYU, UPenn Providence College: BC, Holy Cross, Fairfield, Fordham Villanova: BC, Georgetown, Notre Dame, UPenn Colgate (FWIW): BC, Brown, Cornell, Dartmouth Note: The four schools are presented alphabetically by USNWR. This is the 2019 report/survey. I read this as, for example, Holy Cross applicants have tended to apply (at the greatest rate) also to these four other schools. |
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Post by rgs318 on Dec 22, 2018 8:49:30 GMT -5
hcpride...most interesting. Thanks.
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Dec 22, 2018 9:28:37 GMT -5
I may be mistaken but it has been my understanding that a goal of the school has been to try to compete with other near Ivy, little Ivy , Ivy and other PL type schools for the same kind of students rather than only/ primarily trying to enroll students who might otherwise go to another Catholic school. In fact the school in the past has adverised that most of the student population was not from Catholic high schools. Is that still true? I thought it was part of the school's progression from "seminary" to quote Sarasota to a diversified high academic and Catholic college. LoveHC TPTB (which includes the Jesuits in North America) had something in mind when the decision was made to have HC be the only Jesuit liberal arts college in North America (and maybe the world), and to shutter the very small graduate program, And the reference point for such a model are the schools of NESCAC. Decades went by and the 'model' was overtaken by > a changing population demographic, the Northeast growing more slowly than other regions; > a changing cultural demographic, fewer observant Catholics, fewer Catholic high schools with fewer graduates per school; > a declining interest in a LAC education, replaced by rising preferences for degrees that are more 'practical and vocationally mainstream; > escalating costs of attendance, putting HC out of reach for many in the middle class. HC's religious studies department has slightly more faculty than Dartmouth's Department of Religion. Dartmouth's computer sciences faculty number about 25; Williams, 11; HC's computer sciences faculty are four in number. Which major is likely to lead to a high-paying job on graduation? |
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Post by hcpride on Dec 22, 2018 12:32:37 GMT -5
TPTB (which includes the Jesuits in North America) had something in mind when the decision was made to have HC be the only Jesuit liberal arts college in North America (and maybe the world), and to shutter the very small graduate program, And the reference point for such a model are the schools of NESCAC. Decades went by and the 'model' was overtaken by > a changing population demographic, the Northeast growing more slowly than other regions; > a changing cultural demographic, fewer observant Catholics, fewer Catholic high schools with fewer graduates per school; > a declining interest in a LAC education, replaced by rising preferences for degrees that are more 'practical and vocationally mainstream; > escalating costs of attendance, putting HC out of reach for many in the middle class. HC's religious studies department has slightly more faculty than Dartmouth's Department of Religion. Dartmouth's computer sciences faculty number about 25; Williams, 11; HC's computer sciences faculty are four in number. Which major is likely to lead to a high-paying job on graduation? Of course, the liberal arts courses (and majors) were not removed from the other Jesuit (and other Catholic schools). Those stronger academic students today who are eyeballing Catholic colleges and thinking of liberal arts receive a message that there are some very strong undergraduate liberal arts departments at the top Catholic schools (ND, Georgetown, BC, VU, Fordham etc)...and these schools also have some extensive additional options should they want to look at other interests at some point... This is separate from the cohort of strong academic students eyeballing Catholic colleges and thinking engineering, comp sci, etc and wouldn't have HC in their sights in any case. This is one double-whammy that hits us nowadays as far as the stronger academic student eyeballing Catholic college pool of applicants is concerned. |
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Post by sader1970 on Dec 22, 2018 15:02:31 GMT -5
Holy Cross is transitioning it’s pre-business certification program to a business minor but not a major. I am unsure yet when this will be totally accomplished but they are working on it.
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Post by hcpride on Dec 23, 2018 6:43:38 GMT -5
A business major or minor would seem a wise thing to do.
A whopping 39% of the undergraduates at Providence College are enrolled in the business school. And we are very clear competitors with Providence College:
Holy Cross: BC, Fordham, Providence, UMass Amherst
Providence College: BC, Holy Cross, Fairfield, Fordham
(This is from the info I posted a few posts above and re-post below). It seem we are true cross competitors (a substantial percentage of HC applicants also apply to PC and a substantial percentage of PC applicants also apply to HC). That is almost a unique occurrence on my list (BC/Georgetown are also true cross competitors) . Beyond that we have two additional applicant schools in common (BC and Fordham) and PC/HC are the only two test-score-optionals on my list.
Holy Cross: BC, Fordham, Providence, UMass Amherst
Boston College: Georgetown, Northeastern, Notre Dame, University of Virginia
Fordham: Binghamton (SUNY), BC, BU, NYU
Georgetown: BC, Duke, NYU, UPenn
Providence College: BC, Holy Cross, Fairfield, Fordham
Villanova: BC, Georgetown, Notre Dame, UPenn
Colgate (FWIW): BC, Brown, Cornell, Dartmouth
(Note: The four schools are listed alphabetically by USN&WR)
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Post by DFW HOYA on Dec 23, 2018 18:56:46 GMT -5
Decades went by and the 'model' was overtaken by > a changing population demographic, the Northeast growing more slowly than other regions; > a changing cultural demographic, fewer observant Catholics, fewer Catholic high schools with fewer graduates per school; > a declining interest in a LAC education, replaced by rising preferences for degrees that are more 'practical and vocationally mainstream; > escalating costs of attendance, putting HC out of reach for many in the middle class. The Jesuit model was great for the 19th and early 20th century, but its failure to expand beyond the Northeast and industrial Midwest leaves much of the nation's growth markets without any Jesuit presence. Five of the largest 15 US cities have no Jesuit high schools, for example. Texas, a state of 4.6 million Catholics, has only two Jesuit high schools. Florida, with 2.5 million Catholics? Two. Arizona? One. Georgia? None. These are the growth areas for Catholicism where a Jesuit education would be the "feeder schools" for places like HC, given there are no Jesuit universities in any of these states. I think HC is better positioned for demographic changes in the Northeast and Midwest than others. I think about places like Detroit-Mercy (2,600 undergrads, $51 million endowment) or St. Peter's (2,700 undergrads, $31 million endowment) and wonder if they are preparing for the changes ahead. |
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Post by princetoncrusader on Dec 26, 2018 21:46:24 GMT -5
In November, i had a visit with one of the Development Office folks at HC. She provided me with a brochure with lots of fascinating data, including endowment per student. Based on FY2017 data, HC comes in at $259k, which is slightly behind Trinity and Wesleyan. PL brethren Lafayette and Colgate are both around $300k. Pomona, Amherst and Williams are the leaders by far at roughly $1.2mm each.
HC's endowment at 6/30/18 of $783mm was invested as follows: Equities--48%; Absolute Return Strategies--27%; PE and real assets--20%; Fixed Income--4% and Cash--1%. Return on the endowment is not disclosed. Returns (from Bloomberg) for other schools of note are Princeton (14.2%), Dartmouth (12.2%) and Bowdoin (15.7%). It helps to have Stan Druckenmiller on the board at Bowdoin and Leon Black at Dartmouth.
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