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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Dec 21, 2019 10:04:21 GMT -5
All-time series is 37-39-4. Clearly Dartmouth has been a great rival for decades and we need to get Dartmouth back on the schedule annually
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Post by HC92 on Dec 21, 2019 10:55:36 GMT -5
I’d rather play Harvard and Yale but I suspect at least Yale will cancel all future games as soon as we start beating them regularly so that will open up a spot.
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Post by hcpride on Dec 21, 2019 10:57:14 GMT -5
I'd certainly rather see Dartmouth or UNH on future schedules than BC/Syracuse. I think I'd prefer Dartmouth/UNH to UMass but that is a closer call. (I know, the kids purportedly love the one-sided FBS exhibitions and they do yield some limited dollars.)
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Post by hcgrad94 on Dec 21, 2019 11:21:09 GMT -5
Syracuse paid us in the $500,000 range. Not limited.
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Post by HC92 on Dec 21, 2019 11:36:54 GMT -5
I'd certainly rather see Dartmouth or UNH on future schedules than BC/Syracuse. I think I'd prefer Dartmouth/UNH to UMass but that is a closer call. (I know, the kids purportedly love the one-sided FBS exhibitions and they do yield some limited dollars.) The minimum for an FBS game is $250K. Some are much higher. That’s real money. And UMass and UConn might well be wins. Definitely not one-sided losses.
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Post by moose1970 on Dec 21, 2019 11:53:26 GMT -5
I'd certainly rather see Dartmouth or UNH on future schedules than BC/Syracuse. I think I'd prefer Dartmouth/UNH to UMass but that is a closer call. (I know, the kids purportedly love the one-sided FBS exhibitions and they do yield some limited dollars.) I know, the kids purportedly love the one-sided FBS exhibitions...
1- FBS games are not "exhibitions". 2- what player/kid "loves" having his team blown away in a non-game that never should have been scheduled and played. ( i know that both players and coaches say they want to play these games and as a player or coach that is the attitude you must take. players and coaches do not have any say on the schedule.) yield some limited dollars.
1- define "limited dollars" 2- what sports program at holy cross is asked to operate in the "black"?
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Post by bringbackcaro on Dec 21, 2019 12:11:59 GMT -5
I’d rather play Harvard and Yale but I suspect at least Yale will cancel all future games as soon as we start beating them regularly so that will open up a spot. Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Penn, Columbia are all more interesting Ivy games than Dartmouth and closer to a lot more alums.
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Post by moose1970 on Dec 21, 2019 12:15:46 GMT -5
I'd certainly rather see Dartmouth or UNH on future schedules than BC/Syracuse. I think I'd prefer Dartmouth/UNH to UMass but that is a closer call. (I know, the kids purportedly love the one-sided FBS exhibitions and they do yield some limited dollars.) The minimum for an FBS game is $250K. Some are much higher. That’s real money. And UMass and UConn might well be wins. Definitely not one-sided losses. IMHO, the FBS tag is misleading. we can never compete v BC/Syracuse type FBS programs that spend many millions, use red shirt players, recruit jc transfers, play home games in large stadiums etc. i do not think that is the profile for every FBS football program that we could schedule. also our year end games v BC were always special. we usually lost but gave them a game and pulled off some upset wins that were sweet. scheduling BC now detracts from what we were able to accomplish "back in the day"
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Post by hcpride on Dec 21, 2019 12:19:17 GMT -5
I'd certainly rather see Dartmouth or UNH on future schedules than BC/Syracuse. I think I'd prefer Dartmouth/UNH to UMass but that is a closer call. (I know, the kids purportedly love the one-sided FBS exhibitions and they do yield some limited dollars.) The minimum for an FBS game is $250K. Some are much higher. That’s real money. And UMass and UConn might well be wins. Definitely not one-sided losses. BC/Syracuse?
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Post by rgs318 on Dec 21, 2019 12:36:59 GMT -5
I'd certainly rather see Dartmouth or UNH on future schedules than BC/Syracuse. I think I'd prefer Dartmouth/UNH to UMass but that is a closer call. (I know, the kids purportedly love the one-sided FBS exhibitions and they do yield some limited dollars.) HC does not play exhibition games (your sarcasm noted). The players do like the challenge an FBS opponent provides and they do not go into those games to roll over for anyone. If the team and recruiting continue to improve, upsets will come to them eventually.
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Dec 21, 2019 12:45:04 GMT -5
We've had a few games against FBS schools and have more scheduled and we've had hundreds of players go through the program. So, we (the coaches) should know by now whether (1) scheduling games against bc, Syracuse, UConn, UMass, Army or Navy has a positive effect on recruitment, as in: "One reason (among many) that I want to go to Holy Cross is to play X FBS team". (2) Whether, having played the games, the players say "Hey, we got whipped but I'm glad I had a chance to test myself against X team in its filled stadium". Of course there won't be unanimity of thought among the players but surely we (the coaches) should know whether there is a benefit to the games beyond the paycheck, whether the pluses outweigh the minuses.
I'd hate to think that ADMB and HCBC would say "The players loathe these games but we need to cash money".
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Post by sader1970 on Dec 21, 2019 13:06:32 GMT -5
You know, I think that we older folks/alums tend to think that all kids nowadays are interested in participation trophies and/or always have to "win."
As I've posted before, in speaking with 2 seniors over the last couple of years on the football team, they really do want to play these games and look at them as challenges. We've had enough "frank" discussions to lead me to believe that they would have told me if they were just toeing the "official line."
Do they want to be in a one-sided loss? Of course not. But these are athletes who go into a game, any game, thinking they have at least a chance of winning. I think too many people here are not giving our players enough credit. If it turns out to be a one-sided loss like Syracuse and BC, they are objective enough to look at the game and ask themselves if they played the best they could and did they learn anything from it. If the answer is affirmative, they move on from there, knowing that the opposing team just had more talent, and play the next game as well as they can.
I don't like us playing more than one FBS game a season but this one was an unusual case and likely Nate Pine felt this was the one chance to get a big payday from Syracuse that won't happen again anytime soon.
UMass and UConn are both winnable or at least competitive opponents though the payout I am sure is much smaller. Buffalo probably closer to those schools than BC or Syracuse.
Anyone want to play Army again for the tradition or are they a bridge too far? I don't think so.
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Post by hcpride on Dec 21, 2019 13:06:42 GMT -5
I'd certainly rather see Dartmouth or UNH on future schedules than BC/Syracuse. I think I'd prefer Dartmouth/UNH to UMass but that is a closer call. (I know, the kids purportedly love the one-sided FBS exhibitions and they do yield some limited dollars.) HC does not play exhibition games (your sarcasm noted). The players do like the challenge an FBS opponent provides and they do not go into those games to roll over for anyone. If the team and recruiting continue to improve upsets will come to them eventually. Not sarcasm. Beyond that, the game v BC was so one-sided the coach of the opposing team had to pull his stars prior to the end of the first quarter. [Star RB AJ Dillon rushed just 6 times for 149 yards and 3 touchdowns before sitting down in the 1st QTR and QB Anthony Brown threw just 2 times for 53 yards before sitting down in the 1st QTR.] That is highly unusual for competitive football - but clearly something many of us (including the BC coach) had anticipated. We were smart enough not to start flinging the ball around the field in a foolish attempt to catch up (after the 1st or 2nd, or 3rd consecutive BC scores - all in the 1st quarter) and win the game. Instead we wisely looked to burn the clock on offense, control the ball if possible by making 1st downs, and essentially exit as quickly as possible. I'll leave it at that. (An ACC v PL football matchup is quite predictable.)
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Post by sader1970 on Dec 21, 2019 13:10:39 GMT -5
1. there is no "purportedly," they do want to play these games even if some of the Crusader fans don't.
2, they are not "limited dollars." They significantly close a gap. Do these games pay for all the football expenses? Not even close but they do make a big difference.
Seriously, I would suggest to you that if we don't play these games, you might very well see us dropping football.
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Post by rgs318 on Dec 21, 2019 13:13:39 GMT -5
OK, not sarcasm. It was not an exhibition, so I guess you were just wrong. Sorry, I thought you knew more than that.
Yes, the coach did pull two players in the first quarter - not all his starters as you imply. He may have done to take it easy on HC, to look at the performance of backup players for those two men, or just to avoid injuries to two irreplaceable (at that lev el of play) stars. I'll leave it at that.
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Post by efg72 on Dec 21, 2019 13:31:20 GMT -5
Perhaps with 2 FBS games per season by 2021-one from each group that might look something like this Army, Navy, Air Force, BC(every other year) Rice, Northwestern, UMass, UConn, Rutgers, MAC
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Post by HC92 on Dec 21, 2019 13:49:20 GMT -5
The minimum for an FBS game is $250K. Some are much higher. That’s real money. And UMass and UConn might well be wins. Definitely not one-sided losses. BC/Syracuse? Those are tougher. If we continue to get better and they regress a little (tough to sustain FBS success in the Northeast), those games will be less one-sided. If the kids like them and they help recruiting and we make $500k, I’m fine with those games.
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Post by hcpride on Dec 21, 2019 13:55:36 GMT -5
Perhaps with 2 FBS games per season by 2021-one from each group that might look something like this Army, Navy, Air Force, BC(every other year) Rice, Northwestern, UMass, UConn, Rutgers, MAC I guess if we are guided by the notion that the kids love ‘em, the program is helped, and we need the cash ...might as well go for two. Do I hear a three? 😁
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Post by Chu Chu on Dec 21, 2019 14:16:58 GMT -5
We are getting better, these games will be closer, and I believe we will steal one or two in the future !
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Post by efg72 on Dec 21, 2019 14:20:03 GMT -5
2 games are enough
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Post by rgs318 on Dec 21, 2019 14:21:50 GMT -5
More than enough.
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Post by sarasota on Dec 21, 2019 14:23:29 GMT -5
The idea that we would play a game that there is virtually no chance of us winning for the sake of a financial payoff is reprehensible. Football is a violent game. Every time our players play, they are risking their immediate health, their sports careers and even their health for the rest of their lives. The idea that we make them do so in order for Holy Cross to make some money is disgusting. As I said many times as regards BG's ridiculous obsession about playing UConn Women Bball, such an event is not a game. It is an EXHIBITION. Please stop trying to sugar coat it. It's even worse when you know that UConn Women Bball season ticketholders pay a significant amount of money for their tickets. Games are played only to win. Fans are cheated otherwise. My opinion does not apply to games where we have a reasonable chance of winning.
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Post by rgs318 on Dec 21, 2019 14:34:54 GMT -5
Exhibition games do not count toward the team's record. Call it what you want in terms of quality, but FBS games are simply NOT exhibition games. Calling them that does not make it so.
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Post by moose1970 on Dec 21, 2019 14:37:19 GMT -5
1. there is no "purportedly," they do want to play these games even if some of the Crusader fans don't. 2, they are not "limited dollars." They significantly close a gap. Do these games pay for all the football expenses? Not even close but they do make a big difference. Seriously, I would suggest to you that if we don't play these games, you might very well see us dropping football. Seriously, I would suggest to you that if we don't play these games*, you might very well see us dropping football. * assuming you mean BC/Syracuse type FBS football programs any facts to back up this rather dire prediction? has anyone mentioned dropping the HC football program except on crossports?
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Post by rgs318 on Dec 21, 2019 14:43:21 GMT -5
No. Not that I am aware.
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