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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Sept 15, 2016 9:59:32 GMT -5
This is spending by sport for 2014-15, compared to PL schools. (USMA and USNA excluded.
Baseball, fourth of four, at $400K, about $125K less than the median
Basketball (M/W), first of eight, about $700K more than the median
Field Hockey, sixth of seven, about $130K less than the median
Football, fifth of seven, about $500K less than the median
Golf (M), sixth of six, about $10K less than the median
Golf (W), fourth of four, at $60K, about $42K less than the median
Ice hockey (M/W), third of three, $1.6 million less than the median (Colgate)
Lacrosse (M), sixth of six, $480K less than the median
Lacrosse (W), sixth of seven, $535K less than the median
Rowing (M), second of four, at $275K, about $1.5 million less than Boston University (highest)
Rowing (W), third of six, about $65K more than the median
Soccer (M/W), fourth of eight, about $45K more than the median
Softball, fifth of six, about $200K less than the median
Swimming (M/W), eighth of eight, about $500K less than the median
Tennis (M/W), seventh of seven, about $230K less than the median
Track & Field. X -country (M), fourth of seven, about $11K more than the median
Track & Field, X country (W), third of eight, about $480K above the median
Volleyball, seventh of seven, about $125K less than the median
__________________________________________________________
Men's basketball spending at $2.6 million is half of what Fordham spends, and a quarter of what Georgetown spends.
Women's basketball spending at $1.6 million, is third of eight in the PL.
On men's ice hockey, Merrimack spent $1.9M, Quinnipiac $2.3M Northeastern $2.5M, Providence $3.3M, , BostU $3.3M, BC $3.7M, Notre Dame $4.7M (HC $1.2M)
On total ice hockey, Merrimack $1.9M, Northeastern $4.3M, Notre Dame $4.7M, Providence $5.1M, BC $5.3M, BostU $5.4M. (HC $1.8M)
Excluding ice hockey, HC would need to spend nearly $2.9 million additional on those sports below the median in 2014-15 simply to bring them up to the PL median.
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Edited to add all track combined. Loyola only runs cross country.
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Post by HC1843 on Sept 15, 2016 11:49:59 GMT -5
and from this you want us to deduce.....
Cheers.
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Sept 15, 2016 13:56:12 GMT -5
and from this you want us to deduce..... Cheers. You could conclude that ADNP prioritizes his spending on the HC sport that this board considers the most important. Going years back on the old board, I maintained that HC's indirect expenses were inordinately high, when compared to other schools. At HC, indirect expenses represent about 30 percent of total spending. At BC, Fordham, Georgetown, Northeastern, Providence, Richmond, and Villanova, indirect expenses represent between 20.5 and 22 percent of direct expenses. Boston University is 17.5 percent, and the other PL football schools (Lehigh excepted*, Fordham, and Georgetown, see above) are all 17 percent or lower. * Lehich's indirect expenses are not understood. If ADNP reduced the indirect expenses to the levels comparable to the other PL schools, he could have about $3.5 million to add to the spending on all sports. a.) Bringing the many sports where spending lags below the median up to the median would consume most of the $3.5 million, b.) Bringing M/W ice hockey to the average spending of BC, BU, Northeastern, and Providence would consume even more of the $3.5 million. If ADNP only managed to reduce the indirect spending to 20.5 percent, that would provide about $2.8 million, enough for a.), but not b.) |
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Sept 15, 2016 14:01:12 GMT -5
Please explain "indirect expenses"
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Sept 15, 2016 14:35:01 GMT -5
Please explain "indirect expenses" These are all expenses not allocated to a specific sport. The general categories of expenses that are allocated to a sport include: athletically-related financial aid, coaches' compensation, recruiting expenses, and operating expenses (sometimes referred to as 'game day' expenses). Examples of indirect expense would be conference memberships, medical insurance and medical care, administrative staff and support. For example, in 2013 Penn State paid $2.8 million for medical care and medical insurance. That spending was not allocated by sport. In 2013, Penn State paid $15.8 million for facilities maintenance and upkeep that was not allocated by sport. _______________________ Edited to add that $3 million would pay for about 50 full scollies. |
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Sept 16, 2016 6:58:58 GMT -5
Of the 45 institutions in Divisions I-AA and I-AAA that play M/W lacrosse, HC spent the third lowest amount in 2014-15.
Mercer (GA) $894K
Brown $913K (does not include any financial aid)
HC $968K
(Yale, which also does not include fin aid, spent $1260K)
________________
Of the 18 institutions in Div I-AA and I-AAA that play M/W ice hockey, HC spends the fourth lowest amount.
Brown $1337K (does not include fin aid)
Princeton $1443K (does not include fin aid)
Sacred Heart $1709K (cost of attendance is appreciably lower than at HC)
HC $1801K
_______________
The Dept of Education's database has been completely re-done, so searches are much easier and more productive in terms of the data generated. The results of a similar search for tennis can be found in the tennis thread in the other sports subforum.)
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Post by purplehaze on Sept 16, 2016 8:59:04 GMT -5
one of the sports I just don't understand is the futility in swimming, especially the men's team. I'm not talking about $ here, but how can you sponsor a sport which gets embarrassed annually against all levels of competition ? I would expect the 'full-time' coach who has been the coach for 30 someodd years to bring in more than 'two' frosh, but that's all there is on a 20 man roster this season. Inexcusable.
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Sept 16, 2016 10:45:11 GMT -5
one of the sports I just don't understand is the futility in swimming, especially the men's team. I'm not talking about $ here, but how can you sponsor a sport which gets embarrassed annually against all levels of competition ? I would expect the 'full-time' coach who has been the coach for 30 someodd years to bring in more than 'two' frosh, but that's all there is on a 20 man roster this season. Inexcusable.I am tempted tpo I am nearing the point of succumbing to the temptation of comparing HC with Division III schools. For swimming, 107 institutions in Div I-AA and I-AAA have a swimming program. Thirty of the institutions have only a women's program, two have only a men's program. Of these 107 institutions, HC spends the third lowest amount: $188K. VMI (M/W) spends the least ($153K) and Pepperdine spends the second least: $169K on its women's team. (Cost of attendance at VMI for instate students is about half that of attending HC, so HC may actually be spending less (on a per swimmer basis) than VMI.) Villanova spends 10x what HC does on swimming. Bucknell spends $1.6 million. _________________________ I am not faulting ADNP for these spending levels, as the 2014-15 budget was pretty much cast in stone by the time he arrived. But he ' owns' the 2016-17 budget, and the references to the low number of freshmen in several sports suggest the budget for these sports is not growing much. |
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Sept 16, 2016 11:42:48 GMT -5
Baseball
181 institutions in Div I-AA and I-AAA play baseball. HC spent the 10th lowest amount in 20124-15.
The lowest 10, dollars in thousands
Mississippi Valley State 225 (lowest)
Coppin St 229
Univ of Arkansas Pine Bluff 273
Delaware State 341
University of Maryland Eastern Shore 353
Penn 356 (no financial aid)
Grambling 366
Brown 393 (no financial aid)
Mt St Mary's 393
HC 397
Of these 10, six are state universities. Of the four private institutions, two offer no financial aid. In effect, this really leaves HC and Mt. St. Mary's fighting for the bottom rung of the ladder when it comes to spending on baseball in all of Division I.*
* 114 institutions in Div I-A play baseball. Utah State reported it only spent $117,000, but that likely is a data entry problem. Most I-A schools are well into the seven figures, two spent more than $5 million.
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Sept 16, 2016 12:30:49 GMT -5
What is 1-AAA?
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Post by purplehaze on Sept 16, 2016 12:42:33 GMT -5
it's the ncaa's designation for d.1 schools that do not sponsor football, i.e. fairfield, siena, etc.. at 1-AAA
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Post by purplehaze on Sept 16, 2016 12:44:46 GMT -5
the baseball stats provide evidence of the great job coach dicenzo is doing with the baseball program. the nine recruits in this year's frosh class are impressive.
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Post by hchoops on Sept 16, 2016 13:05:44 GMT -5
the baseball stats provide evidence of the great job coach dicenzo is doing with the baseball program. Except for bunting ad nauseam. |
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Sept 16, 2016 13:50:08 GMT -5
By happenstance, I discovered how easy it was to manipulate (positive sense) the Title IX database to sort and array data. So I'm like a kid with a new toy.
For a somewhat brighter picture,
Football There are 45 private institutions in FCS (Div I-AA); -- ten spend more than HC on football. Dollars in millions.
Liberty 9.9
Villanova 6.7
Richmond 6.5
Fordham 6.5
Samford 5.7
Furman 5.6
Lafayette 5.5
Bethune Cookman 5.4
Colgate 5.3
Lehigh 5.3
HC 4.77
However, other than Bucknell at, IIRC, about $3.9M, there is a significant drop-off on spending below HC. Schools are playing in conferences with substantial caps on the number of scollies, or don';t allow scollies. (Georgetown plays in a conference that allows scollies, but football players receive need-based aid only, and, like the Ivies, this aid is not included in the spending totals.)
M/W basketball for these 45 institutions, HC ranks #9 in spending. Dollars in millions.:
Georgetown 13.0
Villanova 10.7
Fordham 8.2
Dayton 7.3
Richmond 6.9
Duquesne 5.4
Liberty 4.8
Univ of San Diego 4.6
HC 4.18
(The eight Ivies are included in the 45, but as their spending does not include financial aid, they are not among the top ranked in spending. Columbia, for example, spent $3.3 million on football, without scollies. 63 scollies at $60K would represent an additional $3.7 million in spending at Columbia. That would bring Columbia up to Villanova's level.) ..
________________________
There are datasets that can give a glimpse at whether a school has low amounts of scollie aid included.
For example, there are 13 FCS schools that play ice hockey (all are M/W). Six of these are in the Ivy League. Of the 13 schools, for women's ice hockey, Sacred Heart spends the least, $312K, Next lowest is HC, spending $517K, and all the others spend more. The highest spender is UNH at $1.7M, followed closely by Colgate at $1.5M, then by the University of North Dakota. The differences between HC and the 11 higher spenders suggest no scollie aid for women's hockey at HC, though there undoubtedly is need-based aid.
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Sept 16, 2016 14:12:22 GMT -5
the baseball stats provide evidence of the great job coach dicenzo is doing with the baseball program. . Yes--this nonsense must stop. It is absolute insanity |
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Sept 17, 2016 7:32:03 GMT -5
Field Hockey
HC's spending on field hockey in 2014-15 ranked 22nd of 49 institutions in Divisions I-AA and I-AAA, which is slightly above the median.
M/W Golf
In Div I-AA and I-AAA, 135 institutions have M/W golf teams. (An additional 57 institutions have either a men's or women's team). Of the 135 institutions, HC is tied with Prairie View for third lowest spending. Mississippi Valley State is lowest, spending $48K, nearly $100K less than HC and Prairie View.
M/W Soccer
As nearly every school plays soccer, the dataset was limited to private institutions in Div I-AA and I-AAA. There are 86 such institutions playing M/W soccer. HC's spending ranked it 39 of 86, and slightly above the median for private institutions.
Softball
184 institutions in Div I-AA and I-AAA play softball. HC's spending is ranked 98 of 184. slightly below the median
Volleyball
For women's volleyball, HC is ranked 148 of 206 institutions in Div I-AA and I-AAA playing the sport..
Rowing and track and field
Rowing will not be analyzed as one would need to bring in NCAA divisions other than I-AA and I-AAA.
Track and field is too complex and time-consuming, as spending can be categorized across three categories, all track combined, indoor track, and outdoor track, plus cross country.. HC would probably fare pretty well, particularly in women's track.
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M/W Basketball
If HC were in Div I-AAA, HC's spending on basketball would be ranked 26 of 51 private institutions in Div I-AAA Most of the Big East is in this division.
M/W Ice hockey
Seven institutions in Div I-AAA play ice hockey. Five schools spend more than HC, Four (Bost U, Northeastern, Providence, and Quinnipiac) of the five spent at least $4.25 million. The fifth, University of Denver, is men's ice hockey only, and spent $2.6 million.
Canisius and Niagara also have only men's teams, and spent less than HC.
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Sept 21, 2016 8:13:14 GMT -5
There are 86 institutions in Div I with an undergraduate enrollment between 2,000 and 5,000.
Of these 86, the top eight in spending on athletics in 2014-15.
Wake $57.9M (about 4850 undergraduates)
Tulsa $40.3M (about 3,200 undergraduates)
Rice $37.7M (about 3,900 undergraduates)
Providence $29.3M (about 3,700 undergraduates)
Dartmouth $27.3M (excludes financial aid) (about 4,300 undergraduates)
Richmond $27.0M (about 3,000 undergraduates)
Furman $25.9M (about 2,700 undergraduates)
HC $25.7M (about 2,900 undergraduates)
HC is the only strictly undergraduate institution among the eight.
Providence is the only school not playing football. Providence's spending on basketball and ice hockey was $15.1M ($10 million on hoops), or about $4.3 million more than HC spent on football, basketball, and ice hockey.
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