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Post by clmetsfan on Jul 16, 2020 11:22:54 GMT -5
And I was going to type "higher up the totem pole" but changed my mind. Honestly. Good, because the bottom of the totem pole was actually the most prestigious spot. Yet another example of our country's collective ignorance about First Nations culture.
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Jul 16, 2020 11:32:45 GMT -5
Yeah, with half of our citizens not knowing what we celebrate on July 4, when the Civil War took place, and who were our Allies in WWII, we should be allocating time to educate our students about totem poles.
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Post by clmetsfan on Jul 16, 2020 11:56:38 GMT -5
Yeah, with half of our citizens not knowing what we celebrate on July 4, when the Civil War took place, and who were our Allies in WWII, we should be allocating time to educate our students about totem poles. Wow, congrats on fitting multiple strawmans into one sentence while ALSO arguing against cultural education. Just a bang up job, KY!
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Post by Tom on Jul 16, 2020 12:38:11 GMT -5
Yeah, with half of our citizens not knowing what we celebrate on July 4, when the Civil War took place, and who were our Allies in WWII, we should be allocating time to educate our students about totem poles. I really hope this is hyperbole. I could get over some people not knowing exactly when the Civil War was (hopefully the same people who don't know when Lincoln was Pressident). More important to know what it was about, etc. However I would expect 90 percent of the people to know who were our WWII allies (smaller percentage likely to remember Italy switched sides and joined the Allies). I would expect 99.99 percent of U.S. citizens over the age of 10 to know what we celebrate on the 4th of July - and for the others, one of George Patton's grandchildren should slap that person in the face
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Post by Sons of Vaval on Jul 16, 2020 13:04:28 GMT -5
Yeah, with half of our citizens not knowing what we celebrate on July 4, when the Civil War took place, and who were our Allies in WWII, we should be allocating time to educate our students about totem poles. Sadly, the narrative is now becoming our forefathers stole this land we should be ashamed to celebrate the 4th given we are largely doing so on native land.
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Jul 16, 2020 13:42:53 GMT -5
Yeah, with half of our citizens not knowing what we celebrate on July 4, when the Civil War took place, and who were our Allies in WWII, we should be allocating time to educate our students about totem poles. Wow, congrats on fitting multiple strawmans into one sentence while ALSO arguing against cultural education. Just a bang up job, KY! "strawmans" Wouldn't it be "strawmen"? I think you use that argument in most of your postings and use it correctly on the rare occasion. In this case you are the one using the straw man argument in that I have never argued against cultural education and am not doing so here
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Jul 16, 2020 13:51:42 GMT -5
Yeah, with half of our citizens not knowing what we celebrate on July 4, when the Civil War took place, and who were our Allies in WWII, we should be allocating time to educate our students about totem poles. I really hope this is hyperbole. I could get over some people not knowing exactly when the Civil War was (hopefully the same people who don't know when Lincoln was Pressident). More important to know what it was about, etc. However I would expect 90 percent of the people to know who were our WWII allies (smaller percentage likely to remember Italy switched sides and joined the Allies). I would expect 99.99 percent of U.S. citizens over the age of 10 to know what we celebrate on the 4th of July - and for the others, one of George Patton's grandchildren should slap that person in the face I'm confident that you would be keenly disappointed if there were an accurate number on this. While my "half" is an exaggeration I'd bet money that it's closer to my number than to your 99.99% on July 4th. Jay Leno used to mine this vein on a regular basis (not specifically July 4, but general knowledge of history and politics), and Jesse Watters does so today, and I know one can do great things by editing out the responses you don't like. Still, when the broadcast shows, say, 5 ignorant responses (e.g. we fought the Revolutionary War against France) and 1 correct one, I don't think the producers had to ask 500 people the question to extract the five dopey answers.
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Post by clmetsfan on Jul 16, 2020 14:07:54 GMT -5
Wow, congrats on fitting multiple strawmans into one sentence while ALSO arguing against cultural education. Just a bang up job, KY! "strawmans" Wouldn't it be "strawmen"? I think you use that argument in most of your postings and use it correctly on the rare occasion. In this case you are the one using the straw man argument in that I have never argued against cultural education and am not doing so here Oh please, that's exactly what you're doing when you mock the importance of educating people about native culture. And it is a strawman because I never once said or implied that it should take priority over US political history. Imagine a world where we can educate the next generation about multiple aspects of our country's history!
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Post by Non Alum Dave on Jul 16, 2020 14:29:50 GMT -5
And I was going to type "higher up the totem pole" but changed my mind. Honestly. Good, because the bottom of the totem pole was actually the most prestigious spot. Yet another example of our country's collective ignorance about First Nations culture. No, I'm ignorant, not necessarily the country....but I (taking my mother's example) donate to Indian causes, so hopefully I'll be forgiven someday.
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Post by rgs318 on Jul 16, 2020 14:54:27 GMT -5
If you are ever in Deadwood, SD, stopping at Kevin Costner's Tatanka is a must see. It celebrates the Bison, but also the Lakota Sioux.
0 to 60 million Bison once roamed the Great Plains of North America. By the close of the 19th century, it was estimated that less than 1,000 bison survived. This is their story... "I believe today that this place is bigger than the dream I had for it. What it means to anyone that comes here will be up to them. Tatanka was not designed as the white man’s version of the Native American. Rather it stands as a centerpiece for two cultures, one whose very lives depended on the buffalo and one who saw it as a means to an end. It recognizes and accepts that this is our mutual history. It can also represent the chance to move forward." Kevin Costner, Attraction Founder/Owner
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Post by Crucis#1 on Jul 16, 2020 15:04:02 GMT -5
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Post by clmetsfan on Jul 16, 2020 15:15:14 GMT -5
Good, because the bottom of the totem pole was actually the most prestigious spot. Yet another example of our country's collective ignorance about First Nations culture. No, I'm ignorant, not necessarily the country....but I (taking my mother's example) donate to Indian causes, so hopefully I'll be forgiven someday. Haha no it's definitely most of the country.
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Post by clmetsfan on Jul 16, 2020 15:20:09 GMT -5
If you are ever in Deadwood, SD, stopping at Kevin Costner's Tatanka is a must see. It celebrates the Bison, but also the Lakota Sioux. 0 to 60 million Bison once roamed the Great Plains of North America. By the close of the 19th century, it was estimated that less than 1,000 bison survived. This is their story... "I believe today that this place is bigger than the dream I had for it. What it means to anyone that comes here will be up to them. Tatanka was not designed as the white man’s version of the Native American. Rather it stands as a centerpiece for two cultures, one whose very lives depended on the buffalo and one who saw it as a means to an end. It recognizes and accepts that this is our mutual history. It can also represent the chance to move forward." Kevin Costner, Attraction Founder/Owner The federal government's promotion of bison hunting as a strategy to weaken the native tribes who depended on the herds would be one of the uglier aspects of our history with the First Nations, if only there weren't so many other incidents that were more violent and cruel. Slavery is often cited as the United States' Original Sin, but the systematic extermination of the natives is arguably even worse. And to bring it back to the original topic, this is why so many people find it offensive to name any sports franchises after them, even when done in a respectful manner. R******s is a blatant racial slur and Chief Wahoo is a ugly caricature, so those are easy to identify as insulting. But it's also pretty hypocritical to play games and sell merchandise with native imagery as a way to "honor" a group of people who were victims of genocide at the hands of our ancestors.
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Post by Non Alum Dave on Jul 16, 2020 15:45:14 GMT -5
No, I'm ignorant, not necessarily the country....but I (taking my mother's example) donate to Indian causes, so hopefully I'll be forgiven someday. Haha no it's definitely most of the country. Haha well its definitely possible to be ignorant about something and still care Haha. I'd love to spend more time these days reading up on this kind of stuff, but I admit I spend too much time worrying about whether or not I'll be able to enjoy a few good retirement years before I croak. My mom might not know about the totem pole thing, and at 91 she's not out protesting in the streets, but I'm certain she cares as much about native Americans as anyone on this board. And, gasp, she's not even college educated!
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Post by rgs318 on Jul 16, 2020 16:02:16 GMT -5
If you are ever in Deadwood, SD, stopping at Kevin Costner's Tatanka is a must see. It celebrates the Bison, but also the Lakota Sioux. A major attraction (behind the museum) is a full size depiction of a Lakota bison hunt. There are about 14 full size bronze figures (animals and humans) of Lakota own horseback driving bison over a cliff. That one spot made our trip west worth the time and cost. All of the interpreters are Lakota and they tailor their presentations to the level of understanding shown by the visitors. I will be going again (not on a tour) to spend more time.
"Tatonka" means literally "Great Beast." That is the term the Lakota use to refer to bison. Our main guide was a BIG man who had played football for South Dakota - as did his brothers. He said he was not big...his brothers were Tatanka.
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Jul 16, 2020 16:38:54 GMT -5
If you are ever in Deadwood, SD, stopping at Kevin Costner's Tatanka is a must see. It celebrates the Bison, but also the Lakota Sioux. A major attraction )behind the museum) is a full size depiction of a Lakota bison hunt. There are about 14 full size bronze figures (animals and humans) of Lakota driving bison over a cliff. That one spot made our trip west worth the time and cost. All of the interpreters are Lakota and they tailor their presentations to the level of understanding shown by the visitors. I will be going again (not on a tour) to spend more time.
"Tatonka" means literally "Great Beast." That is the term the Lakota use to refer to bison. Our main guide was a BIG man who had played football for South Dakota - as did his brothers. He said he was not big...his brothers were Tatanka.
There's actually a place named Head Smashed In Buffalo Jump, Alberta, Canada
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Post by rgs318 on Jul 16, 2020 17:03:24 GMT -5
Ya gotta like that name (unless you are perhaps a bison).
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Post by timholycross on Jul 17, 2020 7:33:49 GMT -5
Looks like the team formerly known as the Redskins has more pressing problems than renaming the team.
I hope Snyder is involved some way or another (such as sweeping the matter under the rug) and has to sell.
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Jul 20, 2020 9:44:57 GMT -5
The activists got Trader Joe's in their sights and it didn't take long to get that company to change. This is taken from the local CBS station in Los Angeles. Do you all see the names the company was using as racist? I wonder when Paul Newman Brands will become the target?
MARINA DEL REY (CBSLA) — Trader Joe’s says it is taking action after a Change.org petition called for it to change “racist” packaging.
According to the petition, which has been signed by more than 1,800 people at last check, “the grocery chain labels some of its ethnic foods with modifications of ‘Joe’ that belies a narrative of exoticism that perpetuates harmful stereotypes.”
“For example, ‘Trader Ming’s’ is used to brand the chain’s Chinese food, ‘Arabian Joe’ brands Middle Eastern foods, ‘Trader José’ brands Mexican foods, ‘Trader Giotto’s’ is for Italian food, and ‘Trader Joe San’ brands their Japanese cuisine,” the petition continues.
California high school senior Briones Bridell started the petition, also saying that “The Trader Joe’s branding is racist because it exoticizes other cultures – it presents ‘Joe’ as the default ‘normal’ and the other characters falling outside of it.”
A Trader Joe’s location in Marina del Rey has already appeared to phase out some of the branding the petition pointed to.
The grocery chain released a statement in response to the petition, saying it has been actively making changes.
“While this approach to product naming may have been rooted in a lighthearted attempt at inclusiveness, we recognize that it may now have the opposite effect — one that is contrary to the welcoming, rewarding customer experience we strive to create every day,” company spokesperson Kenya Friend-Daniel said.
The grocery chain is one of several companies that have recently come under fire for branding that critics say promote stereotyping.
Last month, Quaker Oaks said it would retire the Aunt Jemima name and character. The maker of Uncle Ben’s rice said it would update the brand’s character as well, and Eskimo Pie’s leadership team also agreed to change the name.
Trader Joe’s first opened in 1967 in Pasadena and now has more than 500 store locations across the country. The chain’s founder and namesake Joe Coulombe died in February at his Pasadena home.
(© Copyright 2020 CBS Broadcasting Inc. All Rights Reserved. The Associated Press contributed to this report.)
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Post by Sons of Vaval on Jul 21, 2020 18:39:15 GMT -5
Imagine if those who were so offended by Trader Jose at the popular supermarket spent their time volunteering / mentoring instead of being fake mad at the label of a food product.
Embarrassing that TJ’s bent the knee and immediately caved to the mob.
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Post by Tom on Jul 22, 2020 11:13:42 GMT -5
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Post by purplehaze on Jul 22, 2020 11:28:50 GMT -5
Phew ! (Too bad they even had to reply but) Good for ND !
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Post by WCHC Sports on Jul 23, 2020 12:00:24 GMT -5
It's official: the team name for the season will be Washington Football Team. Hearing rumors about Dan Snyder for so many years, I can understand that this would be a name that excites him.
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Post by rgs318 on Jul 23, 2020 12:11:25 GMT -5
What is the over/under on when we see the first anti-Washigton protest (demanding the name be changed)?
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Post by CHC8485 on Jul 23, 2020 12:14:56 GMT -5
Saw this report last weekend. Makes sense to take your time on the change on a lot of levels.
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