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Post by thecrossisback on Jan 28, 2021 12:37:47 GMT -5
Alright Crucis you are right. But we could still gain some new rivals in the future!
But I still want to win every Ram Crusader Cup that is played for the rest of time! 3 Game win Streak!
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Post by Tom on Jan 28, 2021 13:03:47 GMT -5
It was not the athletes that tested positive and thats why I can't understand why they won't play the games. What if they do test positive next week it makes no sense to cancel games if the team is healthy to play. The positive tests were students on campus. This is the same school that is so concerned about the spread that basketball players are required to "wear" masks on the court
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Post by DiMarz on Jan 28, 2021 13:25:46 GMT -5
It was not the athletes that tested positive and thats why I can't understand why they won't play the games. What if they do test positive next week it makes no sense to cancel games if the team is healthy to play. The positive tests were students on campus. This is the same school that is so concerned about the spread that basketball players are required to "wear" masks on the court I wonder if teams that are on campuses in a city, such as BU is with buildings spread in the city, as opposed to a "closed" campus such as HC, Army and Navy are more likely to have Covid-19 outbreaks....I'd think that additional exposure to a wide number of people would increase the opportunity to get covid....Or is it just a c*$p shoot?
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Post by rgs318 on Jan 28, 2021 13:57:20 GMT -5
I think you are right in pointing out the open nature of BU's urban campus (as opposed to the "bubble" that HC, Army and Navy have going for them...if students follow rules of safety). There is no guarantee, but the odds favor a closed campus.
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Post by Crucis#1 on Jan 28, 2021 14:30:38 GMT -5
To develop a solid rivalry, it would have to be against a school that we play ever year across multiple sports. Football, Basketball, Ice Hockey, Soccer, Field Hockey, Baseball, Softball and Lacrosse. Realistically, that criteria limits the number of schools that are available in New England and the Northeast.
BC and PC are eliminated, so are most of the Patriot League schools except for the possibility of Colgate, but neither students or alumni at HC or Colgate are amped regarding our competitions. As we lost BC as an intense rival, the same can be said at Colgate, as I would doubt that now playing Cornell is as intense as it was 60 years ago.
The college athletic landscape has been dramatically altered from the ‘50s, 60’s and 70’s and the old tried and true teams that we played and enjoyed beating no longer are on our annual schedule. So..... that provides only two D1 schools in New England, that are within two hours drive, that have multiple sports, that HC can possibly schedule on an annual basis. Merrimack and Sacred Heart. Fairfield would have been a natural if they still had Football and Ice Hockey. Some of the old guard shudder in horror, at the suggestion of Merrimack and Sacred Heart, but we can not live in the 20th Century. The college landscape has changed....We have to adjust accordingly.
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Post by Tom on Jan 28, 2021 15:17:53 GMT -5
I guess I'm old guard because I shudder in horror. Merrimack or Sacred Heart will never be real rivals.
I'll give up the proximity to have a member of the same league where rivalry games have implications. Frankly, ooc games are fun but they aren't that meaningful in that they have little to no effect on the post season. Granted they care more about sports than we do, but back before realignment, Oklahoma and Nebraska had a pretty big rivalry and they are farther apart than HC and Bucknell
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Post by timholycross on Jan 28, 2021 15:46:19 GMT -5
I guess I'm old guard because I shudder in horror. Merrimack or Sacred Heart will never be real rivals. I'll give up the proximity to have a member of the same league where rivalry games have implications. Frankly, ooc games are fun but they aren't that meaningful in that they have little to no effect on the post season. Granted they care more about sports than we do, but back before realignment, Oklahoma and Nebraska had a pretty big rivalry and they are farther apart than HC and Bucknell Neither is Jesuit, which to me leaves proximity, which leaves Merrimack.
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Post by HC92 on Jan 28, 2021 15:56:20 GMT -5
Crucis nailed it. We have no rivals. If we get really good at something and one of our league-mates is really good at the same time, we’ll have a temporary rivalry. Don’t see us ever having a sustainable rivalry with anyone.
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Post by Crucis#1 on Jan 28, 2021 16:02:13 GMT -5
There are 389.31 miles from Lincoln to Norman in south direction and 455 miles (732.25 kilometers) by car, following the US-81 route.
There are 277.37 miles from Worcester to Lewisburg in southwest direction and 338 miles (543.96 kilometers) by car, following the I-84 and NY 52 W route.
Rivalry requires the intense cultural conflict between two institutions regarding perceived superiority of each school. Nebraska and Oklahoma had it in the 60’s and 70’s. Not sure if it still exist under the current conference alignment.
Other than the intense basketball battles between Willard and Flannery teams, I am not seeing a sustainable emotional conflict that we had 10 years ago that creates a rival with Bucknell. The two schools view each other with mutual respect, not intense dislike. Other than being in the Patriot League, and sharing Doggie Julian, the schools are as different culturally as grapes and oranges.
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Post by hchoops on Jan 28, 2021 16:02:18 GMT -5
Until BC comes to the PL
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Post by Tom on Jan 28, 2021 16:41:51 GMT -5
There are 389.31 miles from Lincoln to Norman in south direction and 455 miles (732.25 kilometers) by car, following the US-81 route. There are 277.37 miles from Worcester to Lewisburg in southwest direction and 338 miles (543.96 kilometers) by car, following the I-84 and NY 52 W route. Rivalry requires the intense cultural conflict between two institutions regarding perceived superiority of each school. Nebraska and Oklahoma had it in the 60’s and 70’s. Not sure if it still exist under the current conference alignment. Other than the intense basketball battles between Willard and Flannery teams, I am not seeing a sustainable emotional conflict that we had 10 years ago that creates a rival with Bucknell. The two schools view each other with mutual respect, not intense dislike. Other than being in the Patriot League, and sharing Doggie Julian, the schools are as different culturally as grapes and oranges. Proximity does not equal rivalry. At least that basketball spark from 10 years ago was a spark For starters you need to play every year. There are zero non-PL schools HC has played in each of the last 5 years. That's the way the world works. You set up a home and home and move on to someone else. Rivalries spring up from frequent opponents and develop over time. Bucknell or Colgate will probably never develop into rivals because there's not much passion for athletics at all. However, They're both a lot more likely to become rivals than Merrimack or Sacred Heart, schools sometimes we play and sometimes we don't. If somehow you got all the coaches from the major sports to agree to long term agreements to have annual OOC games to create an artificial rivalry, it wouldn't stick. Right now there is no real rivalry. The only prayer is if something happens like that 2005-2007 window pops up and sustains long enough that it might be a good homecoming draw for an alum. Once again not likely, but a hundred times more likely than some contrived thing with some random school that happens to be in New England
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Post by HC92 on Jan 28, 2021 17:25:51 GMT -5
This thread made me look up Pat Flannery. He’s still only 63 years old and, if you believe Wiki, still doing fundraising at Bucknell. Awesome coach. Hope his health is and remains good.
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Post by A Clock Tower Purple on Jan 28, 2021 17:33:26 GMT -5
Any shot HC had at a long, sustained rivalry with anyone evaporated when Fr. Brooks said no thanks.
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Post by bison137 on Jan 28, 2021 17:38:04 GMT -5
This thread made me look up Pat Flannery. He’s still only 63 years old and, if you believe Wiki, still doing fundraising at Bucknell. Awesome coach. Hope his health is and remains good. Yes, he's still working as a Senior Development Officer. I see him frequently around campus. His wife still works in Admissions, as well, working with children of alums. She is also an alum. Pat's health has been good in recent years. It was always good when he wasn't coaching. But I think he's realized that if he started coaching again, the same health issues would reappear. When he had the problems twice while coaching, nothing showed up on the battery of medical tests. The problems only appeared during the stress of games.
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Post by jkh67 on Jan 28, 2021 17:48:17 GMT -5
True Rivalry is a two way street, across multiple programs where the entire week before competition is one of intensive and guttural disdain for the opposition. When was the last time someone marched to a campus to paint their rival mascot purple? Thinking of stories in front of the eagle at Bapst library. That tradition has long gone away. Neither Harvard or Yale would consider HC a rival in either sport based on conversations with former Yale or Harvard players. Unfortunately, we are seen as a scheduling convenience due to relative proximity really, nothing more. Fordham could be a rival due to institution traditions and overlap. But for them to be a rival, we would need to play them in multiple sports with both Football and Basketball being accentuate as part of Jesuit Spotlight games. With Colgate, due to the long standing nature or play and league affiliation could be, but when was the last time either student or alumni body was amped leading up to the game against each other. Only when the league championship is involved in football. Bucknell was fun when both teams were on top, but it was not a sustainable rivalry. For a rivalry you need student overlap. And you can forget the Turnpike Trophy.....
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Post by trimster on Jan 28, 2021 17:56:01 GMT -5
I would try to develop rivalries with Siena and Bryant. The former is two hours away and travels very well and the latter is 30 minutes away down 146. I might even give some thought to resurrecting the cross-town series with Assumption.
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Post by A Clock Tower Purple on Jan 28, 2021 18:19:10 GMT -5
^ Hard pass on both. And rivalries aren't forced, they are built over decades.
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Post by trimster on Jan 28, 2021 18:27:15 GMT -5
^ Hard pass on both. And rivalries aren't forced, they are built over decades. I don’t see BC, PC, UConn and UMass walking through the doors of the Hart Center any time soon. Also, those were rivalries that had be started by powers that be, at some point. You have to start somewhere.
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Post by hcpride on Jan 28, 2021 18:57:53 GMT -5
If very significant student overlap and geographic proximity are key components of a rivalry, I don't think our fellow Catholic PC should be crossed off the list. (Understanding football will always be missing.)
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Post by trimster on Jan 28, 2021 19:06:16 GMT -5
If very significant student overlap and geographic proximity are key components of a rivalry, I don't think our fellow Catholic PC should be crossed off the list. (Understanding football will always be missing.) Too much for them to lose by playing HC.
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Post by A Clock Tower Purple on Jan 28, 2021 19:10:44 GMT -5
You have to win at least once in a while for it to be a "rivalry", and that ain't happening vs Prov in hoops.
For those desperate for a potential rival that makes the most sense - it's Fordham.
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Post by A Clock Tower Purple on Jan 28, 2021 19:12:09 GMT -5
If very significant student overlap and geographic proximity are key components of a rivalry, I don't think our fellow Catholic PC should be crossed off the list. (Understanding football will always be missing.) Too much for them to lose by playing HC. More like nothing to gain.
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Post by hcpride on Jan 28, 2021 19:17:10 GMT -5
If very significant student overlap and geographic proximity are key components of a rivalry, I don't think our fellow Catholic PC should be crossed off the list. (Understanding football will always be missing.) Too much for them to lose by playing HC. I'm thinking all sports in general (knowing men's hoops is a gross mismatch now and football ain't gonna happen). We did play them in hockey and lax last year as I recall off the top of my head ...and someday we might knock them off in men's hoops. I've always thought it odd we don't have more of a rivalry given the strong student overlap and proximity (and the fact that Providence and Worcester themselves are sort of rivals).
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Post by trimster on Jan 28, 2021 19:43:49 GMT -5
You have to win at least once in a while for it to be a "rivalry", and that ain't happening vs Prov in hoops. For those desperate for a potential rival that makes the most sense - it's Fordham. I was thinking along the same lines. I would take it it a step further and say most games in a rivalry are seen as toss ups.
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Post by longsuffering on Jan 28, 2021 19:56:55 GMT -5
You have to win at least once in a while for it to be a "rivalry", and that ain't happening vs Prov in hoops. For those desperate for a potential rival that makes the most sense - it's Fordham. I was thinking along the same lines. I would take it it a step further and say most games in a rivalry are seen as toss ups. Or if a mismatch then Sports Cliche #9 can be trotted out: "You can throw the record books out for this game boys."
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