|
Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Oct 4, 2021 18:30:15 GMT -5
How did Camp Granada fare? Off the charts. Punishment for not masking up at Camp Granada was a compulsory swim with the alligators in the lake.
|
|
|
Post by Tom on Oct 5, 2021 7:30:12 GMT -5
Unfortunately in their quest for fun, this past summer, it never stopped raining
|
|
|
Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Oct 8, 2021 15:35:54 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by hcpride on Oct 9, 2021 8:59:33 GMT -5
Today's COVID update from the college indicates that there were 6,605 tests done Oct 2-8. No positive cases during this seven day period. The last student positive was on Sept. 30. The isolation quarters in Loyola are nearly empty. I was interested to see whether there would be an outbreak emanating from the Oct 1 concert on Freshman Field. Only HC students were invited, and nearly all are fully vaccinated. From video clips and photos of the concert, good luck finding anyone in the screaming, shouting, jammed-together multitude with a mask. Even VR is maskless. And absolutely no social distancing! news.holycross.edu/blog/2021/10/06/fall-concert-2021/From the photos, for a few/some/many?, the concert may be the highlight of their four years on campus. _____________________________ The new study, one of the largest and longest to track the effectiveness of a vaccine in Americans, found that the vaccine’s ability to protect against infection stood at 88% in its first month, then fell to 47% after just five months. www.latimes.com/science/story/2021-10-04/pfizer-covid-vaccine-waning-not-deltas-fault
For those who like empty gestures, it is also true that 100% of those who have been fully vaccinated (whether or not those vaccines currently protect the holder from becoming infected and/or infecting others) have vaccine cards. Given the reality (as opposed to the emotion) of kids on campus and Covid, not sure this sort of data will have any effect on the Covid vaccine policies/rules at HC. I think the fear is that infected folks, vaccinated or not, can pass Covid on to a vulnerable person. (It is also true, although irrelevant to infection and transmission statistics, that the vaccinated are highly unlikely to wind up in the hospital or die of Covid.)
|
|
|
Post by sader1970 on Oct 9, 2021 9:05:59 GMT -5
May well be true that Pfizer drops to high 40% effectiveness after 5 months. That's why folks are getting the booster. Let's try to remember how really effective these Covid vaccines are. Initially in the 90+% range. Here's how effective flu shots are per the CDC:
|
|
|
Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Oct 9, 2021 10:21:12 GMT -5
The link is to an excellent article in the New York Times published several weeks ago looking at the decline in effectiveness of Pfizer's vaccine, while Moderna's has held steady, and offers several explanations for such. (E.g., Modern'a vaccine shot was 'juiced' more than Pfizer's, and the shots were spaced over a longer period.) www.nytimes.com/2021/09/22/health/covid-moderna-pfizer-vaccines.htmlThis decline in effectiveness is limited, presently, to symptomatic infection. Both Moderna and Pfizer continue to be highly protective (>90+ percent) against infections progressing to hospitalization and death. Massachusetts is the only state that I know of that separately tracks tests and infections in higher education. The state does this because of the volume of testing being done by colleges and universities: e.g., 257,000 tests in the seven days ending October 7. HC's testing constituted about 2.5 percent of this total. One third of the 30 million PCR tests to date in Massachusetts was done by a college/university. Currently, the seven day positive test rate for higher education is 0.13 (HC is 0.0); the seven day positive test rate for everyone not being tested by higher ed is 2.7%. The state reports a positive test rate of 1.80 percent, a value which combines the two test datasets. A significant percentage of the positive tests in higher ed are likely of asymptomatic, fully vaccinated individuals, given the number of mandatory testing programs. Fully vaccinated people infected with COVID are less likely to spread the virus to others than are unvaccinated people. However, over time, these vaccinated individuals may become as contagious as an unvaccinated person, though there is some thought that the increased contagion could be associated with the decline in effectiveness of the Pfizer vaccine., and that a booster would reverse the decline.
|
|
|
Post by hcpride on Oct 9, 2021 11:18:49 GMT -5
The new study, one of the largest and longest to track the effectiveness of a vaccine in Americans, found that the vaccine’s ability to protect against infection stood at 88% in its first month, then fell to 47% after just five months. www.latimes.com/science/story/2021-10-04/pfizer-covid-vaccine-waning-not-deltas-faultA couple of implications for this new stat (Pfizer folks agree with it and, in fact, now use it as a marketing aid for boosters): 1. Vaccine cards are useless as a means of separating folks who might be positive/transmit covid from those who are not. Except as a virtue signal. 2. Those who still dream of herd immunity and utilize vaccination percentages for projections regarding their dream will have to rethink (since so many of the vaccinated subsequently test positive and transmit the virus). 3. Logic and a modicum of knowledge suggests that figure of 47% does not apply uniformly across an age spectrum. At all. 4. Although perhaps irrelevant given the science regarding college kids and covid, a college student vaccine rate of 96% might not tell us as much as we thought it did. It might tell us that 96% percent of the college's students will most likely not wind up in the hospital or dead if they are infected by Covid (which may be true with or without a vaccination, BTW) 5. Those who think firing unvaccinated folks on the grounds that they may become infected and then infect others might question an assumption built into that theory. 6. Is it really a 'breakthrough infection' when a fully vaccinated person tests positive four or five (or less) months after a full (two-shot) vaccination? (If breakthrough implies something unusual or surprising and the intent of the vaccine is not to prevent infection but to protect from serious illness and death.) 7. As far as boosters for the Pfizer vaccine go, there is a very serious school of thought that says that if it is protecting you from hospital or death it is working as intended and you do not need a booster. Infection and transmissibility are irrelevant in that sort of analysis. (There are currently quite a bit of complexities and machinations within that very discussion as a public health friend informs me.)
|
|
|
Post by timholycross on Oct 9, 2021 16:49:29 GMT -5
Moderna will my booster or nothing at all. Pfizer were first two.
|
|
|
Post by Chu Chu on Oct 9, 2021 19:39:16 GMT -5
Moderna will my booster or nothing at all. Pfizer were first two. Right now, that is not an option for you and it may well never be. Although both vaccines are mRNA vaccines and work in a similar way, they are not the same and are not interchangeable. Studies have not been done to see if the immunity affect would be additive or if complications might ensue with a Moderna booster given to a person who first had Pfizer-BioNTech. I do not know if such studies are planned, or whether they would even be contemplated. For those who are worried about the Pfizer-BioNTech efficacy against infection decreasing, remember, most vaccines, such as the annual flu shot, often have similar effectiveness in the 40 - 50% range. They are still a phenomenal help in mitigating disease spread and also reducing severity. That is why they have been given for so many years. The Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine still works very well in this regard, even without a booster, but the booster is hopefully going to help prevent vaccinated folks from spreading the disease to others, even while and if they do not feel many symptoms themselves. I just got my Pfizer-BioNTech booster 3 days ago. Piece of cake! I encourage you to do so as well!
|
|
|
Post by sader1970 on Oct 9, 2021 20:19:11 GMT -5
Chu, I have seen CDC Director Walensky and IIRC Fauci on TV say multiple times that they, in fact, are doing studies of "mixing and matching" (my words, not theirs) the 3 different vaccines. However, whenever they say this, they emphasize two things: 1. the first priority is to get people to get the first vaccinations before being concerned about boosters and 2. at this point they feel it is wisest to stick with the same vaccine. news.yahoo.com/cdc-starting-to-see-mix-and-match-data-for-covid-19-vaccines-director-131034795.html?guccounter=1 Edit: The above link is not where I saw Walensky and Fauci so this is not my source from my memory banks. Think I saw one or both of them on the Sunday morning news shows (Meet the Press, Face the Nation, etc.) making these comments. Again, from memory, they've said this more than once and on more than one venue.
|
|
|
Post by timholycross on Oct 9, 2021 21:08:35 GMT -5
My understanding is J&J doesn't mix with the other two.
My doctor friends last week seemed to think mixing the other two would prove to be ok. But perhaps that's premature.
|
|
|
Post by longsuffering on Oct 9, 2021 22:44:27 GMT -5
The new study, one of the largest and longest to track the effectiveness of a vaccine in Americans, found that the vaccine’s ability to protect against infection stood at 88% in its first month, then fell to 47% after just five months. www.latimes.com/science/story/2021-10-04/pfizer-covid-vaccine-waning-not-deltas-faultA couple of implications for this new stat (Pfizer folks agree with it and, in fact, now use it as a marketing aid for boosters): 1. Vaccine cards are useless as a means of separating folks who might be positive/transmit covid from those who are not. Except as a virtue signal. 2. Those who still dream of herd immunity and utilize vaccination percentages for projections regarding their dream will have to rethink (since so many of the vaccinated subsequently test positive and transmit the virus). 3. Logic and a modicum of knowledge suggests that figure of 47% does not apply uniformly across an age spectrum. At all. 4. Although perhaps irrelevant given the science regarding college kids and covid, a college student vaccine rate of 96% might not tell us as much as we thought it did. It might tell us that 96% percent of the college's students will most likely not wind up in the hospital or dead if they are infected by Covid (which may be true with or without a vaccination, BTW) 5. Those who think firing unvaccinated folks on the grounds that they may become infected and then infect others might question an assumption built into that theory. 6. Is it really a 'breakthrough infection' when a fully vaccinated person tests positive four or five (or less) months after a full (two-shot) vaccination? (If breakthrough implies something unusual or surprising and the intent of the vaccine is not to prevent infection but to protect from serious illness and death.) 7. As far as boosters for the Pfizer vaccine go, there is a very serious school of thought that says that if it is protecting you from hospital or death it is working as intended and you do not need a booster. Infection and transmissibility are irrelevant in that sort of analysis. (There are currently quite a bit of complexities and machinations within that very discussion as a public health friend informs me.) Yes it is really a breakthrough infection because it broke through the vaccine. It's not meant to mean the same as a breakthrough discovery in science of something which has never happened before. I understand the term is meant to differentiate between infections in vaccinated and unvaccinated people.
|
|
|
Post by hcpride on Oct 10, 2021 9:01:36 GMT -5
/\ Gotcha. Pfizer states the full vaccine is 88% effective v infection at onset and drops down to just 47% v infection at five months so in this case a 'breakthrough' infection certainly does not describe an uncommon event. At all. And experts point out that this is very much to be expected (although the very rapid waning of infection defense is not necessarily ideal) and remind us the primary purpose of the Covid vaccine is to prevent sickness and death. Not infection.
|
|
|
Post by Tom on Oct 17, 2021 9:54:32 GMT -5
Yesterday there was an open practice for the basketball team. Most of the doors were locked so everyone went through one door. Once through the door, ropes channeled people to a check in station where there was a person checking proof of vaccination.
This might be a sneak preview of how things are going to work during basketball and hockey. It will likely need tweaking for larger numbers for an actual sporting event
|
|
|
Post by rgs318 on Oct 17, 2021 10:23:16 GMT -5
It sounds as though it went smoothly.
|
|
|
Post by Tom on Oct 18, 2021 7:50:59 GMT -5
It went very smoothly. Given the approximately 30 non-students in attendance, it probably is not a fair indicator of how things will go when the games begin. Personally, I will try to be at Hart a little earlier this season to allow for delays at the gate. The early arrival for tailgating and the vaccination checks not at the gate have worked well for football. I hope the final hoops plan works just as well
|
|
|
Post by Sons of Vaval on Oct 18, 2021 8:53:10 GMT -5
Curious to see what happens when those with two shots will be considered unvaccinated without the booster. How will HC handle this both for attendees at sporting events and the student body.
Will they mandate proof of booster? What if the booster isn’t readily available for all?
|
|
|
Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Oct 18, 2021 9:17:13 GMT -5
Curious to see what happens when those with two shots will be considered unvaccinated without the booster. How will HC handle this both for attendees at sporting events and the student body. Will they mandate proof of booster? What if the booster isn’t readily available for all? There is no mandate for a booster, at any level. ----------------------- One student tested positive on October 13. It was the first student positive since Sept. 25. The only students being tested last week were those on-campus during fall break, which began on Oct. 8th. It was reported that a member of the men's basketball team was not at the Hart Saturday as he was in the protocol. That member, fully vaccinated, resides in Massachusetts. Dollars to donuts he was not infected on-campus. HC decreased testing last week with fall break. As students are now back on-campus, testing this week should be in the range of 7,500 tests over a seven-day period.
|
|
|
Post by hcpride on Oct 18, 2021 11:54:04 GMT -5
Curious to see what happens when those with two shots will be considered unvaccinated without the booster. How will HC handle this both for attendees at sporting events and the student body. Will they mandate proof of booster? What if the booster isn’t readily available for all? It is worse. Turns out the science ‘experts’ now think J & J should have been a two-shot vaccine. Whoopsie! President Biden's chief medical adviser, Anthony Fauci, said on Sunday that the Johnson & Johnson COVID-19 vaccine likely should have been a two-dose shot instead of a single inoculation.
ABC's Martha Raddatz asked Fauci on "This Week" if the millions of Americans who received the Johnson & Johnson (J&J) COVID-19 vaccine should be concerned after a Food and Drug Administration (FDA) advisory committee voted unanimously to recommend adults receive a booster shot of the vaccine.
"No, not at all, Martha. I think that they should feel good about it because what the advisers to the FDA felt is that, given the data that they saw, very likely this should have been a two-dose vaccine to begin with," Fauci said. thehill.com/homenews/administration/577108-fauci-says-jj-vaccine-should-have-likely-been-two-dose-shotAre all those folks vaccinated via J&J (and with vax passports and vax cards) now kinda half-vaccinated? Or are those vax passports and vax cards some sort of symbolic Kabuki dance in any case? Potemkin Village? Bravo Sierra?
|
|
|
Post by Tom on Oct 18, 2021 12:27:43 GMT -5
Curious to see what happens when those with two shots will be considered unvaccinated without the booster. How will HC handle this both for attendees at sporting events and the student body. Will they mandate proof of booster? What if the booster isn’t readily available for all? As of today, only people over age 65 or with a special need are even eligible for the booster. That rules out most of the student body. In terms of fans at sporting events, I will be stunned if boosters are required until they are approved for basically everyone. Too complicated for the vaccine checkers to be figuring out who is eligible and holding them to a higher standard. I will not be pleased if I get to the gate and the checker says "I know your ID says you're not 65, but you look so horrible you must have underlying conditions so I won't let you in because you have no booster" ------------- Given this is still a new disease and the grand scheme of things, rules change as we learn more and the situation changes. I have zero expectation that the rules for this football season will be the same for next season
|
|
|
Post by hcpride on Oct 18, 2021 12:42:23 GMT -5
Curious to see what happens when those with two shots will be considered unvaccinated without the booster. How will HC handle this both for attendees at sporting events and the student body. Will they mandate proof of booster? What if the booster isn’t readily available for all? As of today, only people over age 65 or with a special need are even eligible for the booster. That rules out most of the student body. In terms of fans at sporting events, I will be stunned if boosters are required until they are approved for basically everyone. Too complicated for the vaccine checkers to be figuring out who is eligible and holding them to a higher standard. I will not be pleased if I get to the gate and the checker says "I know your ID says you're not 65, but you look so horrible you must have underlying conditions so I won't let you in because you have no booster" ------------- Given this is still a new disease and the grand scheme of things, rules change as we learn more and the situation changes. I have zero expectation that the rules for this football season will be the same for next season I was at the SBU game on Saturday and they don't do the vax card or Covid test theatrics at their outdoor football stadium. Can't be for lack of scientific knowledge since the stadium is literally in the shadow of the Stony Brook Medical School. I thought I saw a couple of maskers but, in retrospect, they may have been practicing Jainists and it may have been unrelated to Covid.
|
|
|
Post by Chu Chu on Oct 18, 2021 12:46:51 GMT -5
Curious to see what happens when those with two shots will be considered unvaccinated without the booster. How will HC handle this both for attendees at sporting events and the student body. Will they mandate proof of booster? What if the booster isn’t readily available for all? It is worse. Turns out the science ‘experts’ now think J & J should have been a two-shot vaccine. Whoopsie! President Biden's chief medical adviser, Anthony Fauci, said on Sunday that the Johnson & Johnson COVID-19 vaccine likely should have been a two-dose shot instead of a single inoculation.
ABC's Martha Raddatz asked Fauci on "This Week" if the millions of Americans who received the Johnson & Johnson (J&J) COVID-19 vaccine should be concerned after a Food and Drug Administration (FDA) advisory committee voted unanimously to recommend adults receive a booster shot of the vaccine.
"No, not at all, Martha. I think that they should feel good about it because what the advisers to the FDA felt is that, given the data that they saw, very likely this should have been a two-dose vaccine to begin with," Fauci said. thehill.com/homenews/administration/577108-fauci-says-jj-vaccine-should-have-likely-been-two-dose-shotAre all those folks vaccinated via J&J (and with vax passports and vax cards) now kinda half-vaccinated? Or are those vax passports and vax cards some sort of symbolic Kabuki dance in any case? Potemkin Village? Bravo Sierra? No, not "Whoopsie!" Maybe this is new or unusual for you, but as a physician, I have long experienced that many vaccines over the years have had a changing schedule, or been supplanted by better versions. This occurs because we learn as experience is gained through actual use of the vaccine that cannot be obtained in any other way.
This is not a surprise and it is not a problem. It is just learning from experience. It saddens me to see it commented on in a snide and disrespectful way which could cause harm by causing readers of your words to get disillusioned for no good reason.
|
|
|
Post by newfieguy74 on Oct 18, 2021 12:47:22 GMT -5
When I went to the Dartmouth-Yale football game in Hanover a few weeks ago I checked the Dartmouth web site first. It said that all attendees would be expected to be vaccinated, but it was the honor system. No checking at the gates, very few masks.
|
|
|
Post by Sons of Vaval on Oct 18, 2021 13:10:33 GMT -5
It is worse. Turns out the science ‘experts’ now think J & J should have been a two-shot vaccine. Whoopsie! President Biden's chief medical adviser, Anthony Fauci, said on Sunday that the Johnson & Johnson COVID-19 vaccine likely should have been a two-dose shot instead of a single inoculation.
ABC's Martha Raddatz asked Fauci on "This Week" if the millions of Americans who received the Johnson & Johnson (J&J) COVID-19 vaccine should be concerned after a Food and Drug Administration (FDA) advisory committee voted unanimously to recommend adults receive a booster shot of the vaccine.
"No, not at all, Martha. I think that they should feel good about it because what the advisers to the FDA felt is that, given the data that they saw, very likely this should have been a two-dose vaccine to begin with," Fauci said. thehill.com/homenews/administration/577108-fauci-says-jj-vaccine-should-have-likely-been-two-dose-shotAre all those folks vaccinated via J&J (and with vax passports and vax cards) now kinda half-vaccinated? Or are those vax passports and vax cards some sort of symbolic Kabuki dance in any case? Potemkin Village? Bravo Sierra? This occurs because we learn as experience is gained through actual use of the vaccine that cannot be obtained in any other way.
It's almost like there could be adverse long-term effects due to the vaccine and rolling out to those who are not at risk due to COVID may not be the greatest idea. Protect the vulnerable. Pump them full of the vaccine and boosters. But, maybe it's not prudent to give this stuff to a healthy 25-year old who, statistically speaking, is just about at zero risk.
|
|
|
Post by timholycross on Oct 18, 2021 13:27:33 GMT -5
Curious to see what happens when those with two shots will be considered unvaccinated without the booster. How will HC handle this both for attendees at sporting events and the student body. Will they mandate proof of booster? What if the booster isn’t readily available for all? There is no mandate for a booster, at any level. ----------------------- One student tested positive on October 13. It was the first student positive since Sept. 25. The only students being tested last week were those on-campus during fall break, which began on Oct. 8th. It was reported that a member of the men's basketball team was not at the Hart Saturday as he was in the protocol. That member, fully vaccinated, resides in Massachusetts. Dollars to donuts he was not infected on-campus. HC decreased testing last week with fall break. As students are now back on-campus, testing this week should be in the range of 7,500 tests over a seven-day period. I think discretion is usually the best policy, but in this case, it's pretty clear who the player from Mass was as it was mentioned elsewhere that he wasn't at the event. Only two Mass kids on the team, anyway.
|
|