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Post by Ignutz on Aug 5, 2021 11:29:27 GMT -5
I just noticed on the CBS Sports College Football page that HC has popped into the top-25. Apparently up three spots from the previous poll(s). The only opposing team on this year's schedule that shows in the Poll or Others Receiving Votes is Monmouth at #10. Let's use that as a jumping off point to a steady climb! www.cbssports.com/college-football/rankings/fcs-coaches-poll/ |
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Post by HC92 on Aug 5, 2021 12:23:55 GMT -5
No Ivies in the Top 25 or even in the others receiving votes. Will be interesting to see how they do in the OOC after not playing any football since November 2019.
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Post by Chu Chu on Aug 8, 2021 16:56:19 GMT -5
Sacred Heart #22 ?
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Post by jkh67 on Aug 8, 2021 19:38:01 GMT -5
A good start! Let's build on it, starting with UConn.
Seven eastern teams in the top 25, 4 of them CAA. As noted, not an Ivy in the bunch. Not good, considering our long-term "affiliation" with the Ancient Eight...something we want to retain. Forget about Monmouth, Sacred Heart, Merrimack, Central Connecticut State, et al. More CAA games are a must. Aside from UNH, I'd be looking at Villanova and Delaware, both of whom we've played in the past.
My ideal schedule? A combination of one service academy (or other lower level FBS school...no BC!), 2/3 Ivies, 2/3 CAAs, 6 PLs.
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Post by nycrusader2010 on Aug 8, 2021 20:27:22 GMT -5
A good start! Let's build on it, starting with UConn. Seven eastern teams in the top 25, 4 of them CAA. As noted, not an Ivy in the bunch. Not good, considering our long-term "affiliation" with the Ancient Eight...something we want to retain. Forget about Monmouth, Sacred Heart, Merrimack, Central Connecticut State, et al. More CAA games are a must. Aside from UNH, I'd be looking at Villanova and Delaware, both of whom we've played in the past. My ideal schedule? A combination of one service academy (or other lower level FBS school...no BC!), 2/3 Ivies, 2/3 CAAs, 6 PLs. The reason no Ivies are ranked is because none of them played in 2020. I don't think it's so much that the pollsters think the Ivy will be down so much that they don't have enough information to project who the top teams in the "Ancient Eight" will be. There will almost undoubtedly be a couple of Ivies that end up in the Top 25. CAA games are always something to get excited about for sure. But Monmouth, SHU and CCSU are not the same programs they were in 2005 -- all three are formidable opponents for a Patriot League team. Monmouth is likely the best team on our 2021 Fall schedule, if the so-called experts are correct. I believe they are ranked #12 in pre-season. |
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Post by nycrusader2010 on Aug 8, 2021 20:34:03 GMT -5
No Ivies in the Top 25 or even in the others receiving votes. Will be interesting to see how they do in the OOC after not playing any football since November 2019. My prediction is they'll be fine. While the Ivies didn't play at all, a number of schools in our region barely played any games either. URI and UNH both folded the tent on the spring season early on, as did Colgate. Plenty of other squads only managed to play 2-4 games because of constant cancellations and schedule roulette. Another thing I've noticed about the top Ivies is that they never seem to be behind the curve despite always starting the season 2 and sometimes 3 weeks behind everyone else. The HC-Harvard game during my time always seemed to be our third game but Harvard's first game. And they never seemed to come out flat. Also, remember that spring football brought about in a lot of cases injuries that may not have time to heal by fall. Ivies do not have this problem. Our friends at South Dakota State lost their star frosh QB in the 1st quarter of the national championship game and he will be out for the fall. |
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Post by DFW HOYA on Aug 8, 2021 21:48:43 GMT -5
Not good, considering our long-term "affiliation" with the Ancient Eight...something we want to retain. I understand the Ivies are considered a benefit for Holy Cross, but there are other PL teams where there is no particular interest or rivalry developed with these schools -- Bucknell, Georgetown, and Fordham (outside a game with Columbia). If the PL dropped the Ivy League for CAA teams, the league would not wobble off its axis and might actually elevate it in the process. |
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Post by bfoley82 on Aug 8, 2021 23:34:57 GMT -5
A good start! Let's build on it, starting with UConn. Seven eastern teams in the top 25, 4 of them CAA. As noted, not an Ivy in the bunch. Not good, considering our long-term "affiliation" with the Ancient Eight...something we want to retain. Forget about Monmouth, Sacred Heart, Merrimack, Central Connecticut State, et al. More CAA games are a must. Aside from UNH, I'd be looking at Villanova and Delaware, both of whom we've played in the past. My ideal schedule? A combination of one service academy (or other lower level FBS school...no BC!), 2/3 Ivies, 2/3 CAAs, 6 PLs. Neither Delaware or Villanova need an OOC game in New England against a Patriot League team. Villanova hasn't scheduled Holy Cross since 1989. Delaware has played Holy Cross once since 1983 during the 2005 season in Newark. |
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Post by bfoley82 on Aug 8, 2021 23:35:52 GMT -5
Not good, considering our long-term "affiliation" with the Ancient Eight...something we want to retain. I understand the Ivies are considered a benefit for Holy Cross, but there are other PL teams where there is no particular interest or rivalry developed with these schools -- Bucknell, Georgetown, and Fordham (outside a game with Columbia). If the PL dropped the Ivy League for CAA teams, the league would not wobble off its axis and might actually elevate it in the process. But would the CAA teams even want to play the Patriot League? |
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Post by hcpride on Aug 9, 2021 5:52:12 GMT -5
I understand the Ivies are considered a benefit for Holy Cross, but there are other PL teams where there is no particular interest or rivalry developed with these schools -- Bucknell, Georgetown, and Fordham (outside a game with Columbia). If the PL dropped the Ivy League for CAA teams, the league would not wobble off its axis and might actually elevate it in the process. But would the CAA teams even want to play the Patriot League? Good point. I can see the attraction of a nearby NEC or PL for the northern CAA schools given their tough conference games but I can’t imagine a general preference for PL over NEC in terms of their scheduling. I’d like to see HC schedule 2-3 CAA games per year as we look to strengthen our program and national ranking but, as they say, it takes two to tango. |
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Post by nycrusader2010 on Aug 9, 2021 6:51:53 GMT -5
A good start! Let's build on it, starting with UConn. Seven eastern teams in the top 25, 4 of them CAA. As noted, not an Ivy in the bunch. Not good, considering our long-term "affiliation" with the Ancient Eight...something we want to retain. Forget about Monmouth, Sacred Heart, Merrimack, Central Connecticut State, et al. More CAA games are a must. Aside from UNH, I'd be looking at Villanova and Delaware, both of whom we've played in the past. My ideal schedule? A combination of one service academy (or other lower level FBS school...no BC!), 2/3 Ivies, 2/3 CAAs, 6 PLs. Neither Delaware or Villanova need an OOC game in New England against a Patriot League team. Villanova hasn't scheduled Holy Cross since 1989. Delaware has played Holy Cross once since 1983 during the 2005 season in Newark. This is exactly right. Because these schools have to play 1 or 2 away CAA games in New England already, I don't think theres much of an appetite to make another such road trip to face a PL team. Villanova would much rather schedule Lehigh, Lafayette, Bucknell or Fordham. And they usually play one of these teams every year. |
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Post by Ignutz on Aug 9, 2021 7:46:15 GMT -5
No Ivies in the Top 25 or even in the others receiving votes. Will be interesting to see how they do in the OOC after not playing any football since November 2019. My prediction is they'll be fine. While the Ivies didn't play at all, a number of schools in our region barely played any games either. URI and UNH both folded the tent on the spring season early on, as did Colgate. Plenty of other squads only managed to play 2-4 games because of constant cancellations and schedule roulette. Another thing I've noticed about the top Ivies is that they never seem to be behind the curve despite always starting the season 2 and sometimes 3 weeks behind everyone else. The HC-Harvard game during my time always seemed to be our third game but Harvard's first game. And they never seemed to come out flat. Also, remember that spring football brought about in a lot of cases injuries that may not have time to heal by fall. Ivies do not have this problem. Our friends at South Dakota State lost their star frosh QB in the 1st quarter of the national championship game and he will be out for the fall. I always hated the fact that Harvard's first game was often our second, or more typically, third game. They would have seen us play, they would likely be at or near 100% healthy, and, more often than not, the games would be in their yard. I wonder what the outcomes would have been over the years if these factors were reversed. I wouldn't hesitate to bet that their willingness to playing HC required the outlined scenario.. |
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Post by longsuffering on Aug 9, 2021 8:15:20 GMT -5
Don't forget that Harvard coach Tim Murphy is 178-81 at Harvard, has won nine Ivy Titles, a Yankee Conference title at Maine and turned around the Cincinnati program from 1-9-1 and 1-10 his first two years to 8-3 in his fifth and final year before taking a pay cut to come home to Mass. to coach the Johnnies.
He was matched up against TG for many of his contests against HC. While I remember one close game that HC pulled out at the end, in general I thought that Murphy, a Springfield College grad, had a higher football IQ as far as game management goes than Gilmore, a very bright Computer Science Ivy League grad who I have always been a fan of.
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Post by sader1970 on Aug 9, 2021 8:41:44 GMT -5
I'm not sure how much was TG's vs. Murphy's football IQ. Lots of times it gets down to whether or not you have the horses.
Here's TG's Harvard record:
'04 - L35-0 (A)
'05 - L 31-21 (H)
'06 - L 31-14 (A)
'07 - W 31-28 (H) * (season record: 7-4)
'08 - L 25-24 (A) * (season record: 7-4)
'09 - W 27-20 (H) * (season record 9-3)
'10 - L 34-6 (A)
'11 - W 30-22 (H)
'12 - L 52-3 (A)
'13 - L 41-35 (H)
'14 - L 41-18 (A)
* = Dom Randolph captained teams
From '07 to '11, the record was 3-5 and one loss (away in '08 was a one point game). I don't put much stock in the first 1 or 2 seasons as TG was rebuilding a program. No question our competition went south the last 3 years with the biggest rout in '12.
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Post by efg72 on Aug 9, 2021 9:00:25 GMT -5
Not sure about the comparison, but like longsuffering, a fan of Murphy and his ability to recruit and develop players over the years
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Post by hchoops on Aug 9, 2021 9:12:57 GMT -5
Before we canonize the guy, wasn’t Murphy a cry baby after at least one loss to HC ?
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Post by longsuffering on Aug 9, 2021 10:00:50 GMT -5
Must have been '07, the game I remember HC winning at the end. Looking at the record I guess there weren't as many close contests where end game strategy won out as I thought. Murphy was kind of a Chesney hire, a young guy who had turned around a program before coming to Harvard. Cincinnati was a 1-A program, but not a distinguished one.
Motivating factors for long term Ivy FB coaches are interesting as they don't get the challenge of competing for a national title.
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Post by hc87 on Aug 9, 2021 10:09:07 GMT -5
My prediction is they'll be fine. While the Ivies didn't play at all, a number of schools in our region barely played any games either. URI and UNH both folded the tent on the spring season early on, as did Colgate. Plenty of other squads only managed to play 2-4 games because of constant cancellations and schedule roulette. Another thing I've noticed about the top Ivies is that they never seem to be behind the curve despite always starting the season 2 and sometimes 3 weeks behind everyone else. The HC-Harvard game during my time always seemed to be our third game but Harvard's first game. And they never seemed to come out flat. Also, remember that spring football brought about in a lot of cases injuries that may not have time to heal by fall. Ivies do not have this problem. Our friends at South Dakota State lost their star frosh QB in the 1st quarter of the national championship game and he will be out for the fall. I always hated the fact that Harvard's first game was often our second, or more typically, third game. They would have seen us play, they would likely be at or near 100% healthy, and, more often than not, the games would be in their yard. I wonder what the outcomes would have been over the years if these factors were reversed. I wouldn't hesitate to bet that their willingness to playing HC required the outlined scenario.. It probably cuts both ways but I've always thought we had the advantage playing an Ivy in their first or second or so week, as opposed to our 3rd or 4th game...in the sense that we had already "worked out some of our kinks etc"....It will be interesting to see how Harvard and Yale look having not played in nearly two years now. |
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Aug 9, 2021 16:47:35 GMT -5
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Post by nycrusader2010 on Aug 9, 2021 18:38:44 GMT -5
I'm not sure how much was TG's vs. Murphy's football IQ. Lots of times it gets down to whether or not you have the horses. Here's TG's Harvard record: '04 - L35-0 (A) '05 - L 31-21 (H) '06 - L 31-14 (A) '07 - W 31-28 (H) * (season record: 7-4)
'08 - L 25-24 (A) * (season record: 7-4)
'09 - W 27-20 (H) * (season record 9-3)'10 - L 34-6 (A) '11 - W 30-22 (H) '12 - L 52-3 (A) '13 - L 41-35 (H) '14 - L 41-18 (A) * = Dom Randolph captained teamsFrom '07 to '11, the record was 3-5 and one loss (away in '08 was a one point game). I don't put much stock in the first 1 or 2 seasons as TG was rebuilding a program. No question our competition went south the last 3 years with the biggest rout in '12. We should've won the game in 2008. Were up 17-6, 1st and goal at the 1, early 4th. Dom fumbled on a naked boot IIRC. Harvard scored a couple plays later. We went up again 24-12 but Harvard scored on next two possessions to win the game. Very tough loss as we played about as good a 1st half as we could've played. Brett McDermott, in his only full game as the HC punter, ran a fake about 40 yards down the sideline for a 1st down. This game was on a Friday night in front of 20K and was absolutely electric. Crazy to think we haven't won at Harvard Stadium in two decades now. |
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Post by sader1970 on Aug 9, 2021 18:51:56 GMT -5
Yes. I was there and really thought this was going to be a "W."
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Post by HC92 on Aug 17, 2021 6:18:24 GMT -5
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Post by sader1970 on Aug 17, 2021 6:45:10 GMT -5
OK but note no PL or IL ahead of us and Harvard and Yale buried way down there and we are only 3 slots from UNH. Win over Monmouth and we're there especially if we beat or have a close loss to UConn.
It's a coaches poll so the question is which coaches?
Another tangential observation: Sac State is ahead of us. The team that dedicated their season to our cancelled '69 hepatitis season; wore our uniforms in their last game of the season; and flew out our co-captains Lamb and Mons for that game and who I tried with a football classmate to broker a game against HC about 15 years ago on our own initiative as were in Sacramento on business. Obviously to no avail though they were interested (HC was not). Think they were a D-2 team in '69 but went D-1AA and have a really nice stadium.
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