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Post by timholycross on Nov 17, 2021 17:05:32 GMT -5
Carver's a small high school in Southeastern Mass. (used to be combined w/Plymouth but split off). Division 5, the smallest. Nickname, Crusaders (color maroon, which is only natural considering the town's famous for its cranberry bogs).
The boys soccer team was pretty good during the pandemic year, winning their league, but this year they didn't field a team due to extremely low turnout.
Well, guess what? The rules say if you don't have a boys team, you can play on the girls team. So a league All Star boy from last year is playing for them.
From what I can gather, they were 1-5 at one point, more or less around the time he showed up; and they are now in the state semifinals tonight.
This has pretty much flown under the radar screen. Saw a couple of articles about the team and the boy isn't even mentioned. Maybe hc87's seen something, pretty much in his neck of the woods.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 17, 2021 19:43:00 GMT -5
Im sure the rule stems from someone protesting that their daughter had no team to play on so she was allowed to join the boys team.It just opened the flood gates.
Is it fair never. Different times I guess. Sad
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Post by Tom on Nov 17, 2021 19:49:45 GMT -5
The small town I work in had their girls' soccer team in the tournament. They were knocked off by Carver in the round of 8. Score was 2-1 in overtime. The guy scored Carver's regulation time goal and was the game MVP.
In a related note, as recently as 10 years ago, when this situation occurred (usually field hockey) since the team was effectively playing a co-ed team, the division assignment is based on the the full grades 10-12 population not just the female population. Personally, I don't like the whole thing, but strictly by the rules, it is allowed. However, I would think that Carver should have been bumped up to something bigger than D-5
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Post by longsuffering on Nov 17, 2021 20:25:12 GMT -5
If it was a transgender player there would be satellite trucks surrounding the field and the kid would have to go to the bathroom in the woods.
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Post by timholycross on Nov 17, 2021 20:58:46 GMT -5
Thank goodness they got blown out tonight by Palmer. 6-2. The guy scored one of Carver's goals.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 17, 2021 21:14:34 GMT -5
If it was a transgender player there would be satellite trucks surrounding the field and the kid would have to go to the bathroom in the woods. George Washington in DC had a Trans on the women's BB team a few years back
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Post by alum on Nov 18, 2021 11:13:03 GMT -5
If it was a transgender player there would be satellite trucks surrounding the field and the kid would have to go to the bathroom in the woods. George Washington in DC had a Trans on the women's BB team a few years back Just so we are clear, the player on the GW women's team was assigned female as a gender at birth, competed as a female in HS and at GW, transitioned to male and eventually left the team. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kye_AllumsSo, for those who got worked up about the sprinters in Connecticut, this man is doing exactly what they want--competing on a team for the gender he was originally assigned.
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Post by alum on Nov 18, 2021 11:18:13 GMT -5
Carver's a small high school in Southeastern Mass. (used to be combined w/Plymouth but split off). Division 5, the smallest. Nickname, Crusaders (color maroon, which is only natural considering the town's famous for its cranberry bogs). T he boys soccer team was pretty good during the pandemic year, winning their league, but this year they didn't field a team due to extremely low turnout.Well, guess what? The rules say if you don't have a boys team, you can play on the girls team. So a league All Star boy from last year is playing for them. From what I can gather, they were 1-5 at one point, more or less around the time he showed up; and they are now in the state semifinals tonight. This has pretty much flown under the radar screen. Saw a couple of articles about the team and the boy isn't even mentioned. Maybe hc87's seen something, pretty much in his neck of the woods. I have never heard of a high school being unable to field a boy's soccer team. That is amazing and unfortunate. Does Mass. allow co-op teams between more than one school?
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Post by longsuffering on Nov 18, 2021 12:25:20 GMT -5
Carver's a small high school in Southeastern Mass. (used to be combined w/Plymouth but split off).  Division 5, the smallest.  Nickname, Crusaders (color maroon, which is only natural considering the town's famous for its cranberry bogs). T he boys soccer team was pretty good during the pandemic year, winning their league, but this year they didn't field a team due to extremely low turnout.Well, guess what? The rules say if you don't have a boys team, you can play on the girls team.  So a league All Star boy from last year is playing for them. From what I can gather, they were 1-5 at one point, more or less around the time he showed up; and they are now in the state semifinals tonight. This has pretty much flown under the radar screen.  Saw a couple of articles about the team and the boy isn't even mentioned.   Maybe hc87's seen something, pretty much in his neck of the woods. I have never heard of a high school being unable to field a boy's soccer team. That is amazing and unfortunate. Does Mass. allow co-op teams between more than one school? Co-op teams are growing. Probably not enough time to form one for this season for Carver.
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Post by timholycross on Nov 18, 2021 12:27:51 GMT -5
Yes, they do allow co-op teams and given there's a couple of nearby schools, I bet that happens in the future. My guess is Carver got caught off guard by this development. They had a boys schedule and officials assigned to the games then had to back out, not enough time to merge with somewhere else. And, as I mentioned in the original post, they had a decent team in 2020.
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Post by Tom on Nov 18, 2021 12:51:50 GMT -5
Carver's a small high school in Southeastern Mass. (used to be combined w/Plymouth but split off). Division 5, the smallest. Nickname, Crusaders (color maroon, which is only natural considering the town's famous for its cranberry bogs). T he boys soccer team was pretty good during the pandemic year, winning their league, but this year they didn't field a team due to extremely low turnout.Well, guess what? The rules say if you don't have a boys team, you can play on the girls team. So a league All Star boy from last year is playing for them. From what I can gather, they were 1-5 at one point, more or less around the time he showed up; and they are now in the state semifinals tonight. This has pretty much flown under the radar screen. Saw a couple of articles about the team and the boy isn't even mentioned. Maybe hc87's seen something, pretty much in his neck of the woods. I have never heard of a high school being unable to field a boy's soccer team. That is amazing and unfortunate. Does Mass. allow co-op teams between more than one school? Co-op ing does happen in MA. Most common in football where some small schools don't have the numbers to have a football team. I know in the city of Worcester, the public schools all play football, but there is just one city wide hockey team Two thoughts on the Co-Op 1) Carver didn't know they weren't going to have enough guys until late August when there weren't enough kids signing up. I would hope that a proactive AD or coach could have come up with something, but these have to be approved by the MIAA which governs high school sports in MA. Rumor has it that Carver had 9 seniors on the team last year, which could make the numbers tougher 2) As I said, most of these I see are with football, so there is no other option at that school. This different. There is soccer offered at Carver, just not boys soccer. I don't know the Co-op rules that might not be allowed if the sport is actually offered if only for the other gender. About 10 years ago, Shrewsbury MA had a great female golfer (she is currently on the LPGA). Shrewsbury high had boys golf but not girls golf. She was not co-op'd out to a school that had girl's golf - she just played with the Shrewsbury boys.
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Post by rgs318 on Nov 18, 2021 13:04:08 GMT -5
When my bowling team was winning championships, my co-captains were both girls (gender assigned at birth). It was no big deal at all. I did have one coach come over to tell my bowler she couldn't bowl in the girls' state tournament since she had bowled in the boys tournament. We knew that already, so that was not a problem...just with his bypassing me (the coach) and going directly to my bowler. Never had transgender issues at the school.
We also had a boy (from India) who played on the girls field hockey team, since there was no boys' team in that sport.
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Post by longsuffering on Nov 18, 2021 14:22:55 GMT -5
When my bowling team was winning championships, my co-captains were both girls (gender assigned at birth). It was no big deal at all. I did have one coach come lover to tell my bowler she couldn't bowl in the girls' state tournament since she had bowled in the boys tournament. We knew that already, so that was. not a problem...just his bypassing me (the coach) and going directly to my bowler. Never had transgender issues at the school. We also had a boy (from India) who played on the girls field hockey team, since there was no boys' team in that sport. Sports can get petty. Just accidentally drop a bowling ball on the other coach's foot.
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Post by rgs318 on Nov 18, 2021 14:26:21 GMT -5
When my bowling team was winning championships, my co-captains were both girls (gender assigned at birth). It was no big deal at all. I did have one coach come lover to tell my bowler she couldn't bowl in the girls' state tournament since she had bowled in the boys tournament. We knew that already, so that was. not a problem...just his bypassing me (the coach) and going directly to my bowler. Never had transgender issues at the school. We also had a boy (from India) who played on the girls field hockey team, since there was no boys' team in that sport. Sports can get petty. Just accidentally drop a bowling ball on the other coach's foot. I can't say it didn't cross my mind.
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Post by ndgradbuthcfan on Nov 18, 2021 15:43:42 GMT -5
Coop HS football: West Boyston/Tahanto Regional.
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Post by longsuffering on Nov 18, 2021 16:42:15 GMT -5
Coop HS football: West Boyston/Tahanto Regional. Catholic Marian High School co-opped with Keefe regional vocational tech in Framingham in football and maybe hockey before Marian "completed it's mission" and closed. No reason why charter, Catholic, Voc or other specialty schools can't cooperate.
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Post by hc87 on Nov 18, 2021 17:57:01 GMT -5
Sorry, I didn't see this until now...and no, I wasn't aware.
I do know that Somerset recently had boys on their field hockey team which raised a bit of a fuss as they were pretty good, state champs or close to it. I believe the boys are restricted from certain postions...are they called "attack?" (front-line etc) My sister played in the 80s (state champs in '85 actually)...but I never could understand some of the rules. I think the same holds for boys playing on girl's volleyball teams...i.e. can't play on the front row etc.
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Post by rgs318 on Nov 18, 2021 18:55:48 GMT -5
How can that be done if they "identify" their gender as female?
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Post by longsuffering on Nov 18, 2021 20:03:52 GMT -5
How can that be done if they "identify" their gender as female? X-rays?
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Post by rgs318 on Nov 18, 2021 20:15:19 GMT -5
Identity has nothing to do with physical biology...it depends on a person's attitude/feelings.
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Post by Wormtown Railers Fan on Nov 18, 2021 22:36:02 GMT -5
Perhaps there should be a rule. Boys play on boys teams. Girls play on girls teams.
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Post by Tom on Nov 19, 2021 8:33:58 GMT -5
This has nothing to do with how people identify.
There is a rule that boys play on boys teams and girls play on girls teams. There is also an exception to that rule that if a school does not offer a particular sport for your gender but does offer it for the other gender, a student is allowed to play on that team. I think the original intention was to open up opportunities for girls because there were more boys sports than girls. Early on you would hear about a girl here or there playing football. Under the category of "what's good for the goose is good for the gander" this rule is being applied both ways. The most common application I am aware of is field hockey which, in this country, is basically only played by girls. This soccer one is rare because there just aren't that many schools that have girls' soccer and not boys' soccer.
I know it would be discrimination to have this exception work only one way. It would never withstand a legal challenge - and someone would challenge. The nature of sports and anatomy gives boys an advantage. I think this scenario is contrary to the spirit of opening up opportunities for female athletes. In addition to the Carver girl that wasn't on the team or wasn't playing because of this guy all star soccer player, Granby, Whitinsville-Christian, and Tahanto were all bounced out of the the state tournament in part, because they had to play a team with a competitive advantage that they did not have access to
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Post by rgs318 on Nov 19, 2021 9:40:29 GMT -5
Tom, I am not sure where you are getting this. Field hockey is played almost exclusively by girls, not boys.
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Post by longsuffering on Nov 19, 2021 10:10:19 GMT -5
The way things work in the world, this thorny issue will be tackled, unfortunately, after a violent death or life altering injury by a girl playing a male sport. Could have happened to a boy, but that won't matter.
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Post by Tom on Nov 19, 2021 10:37:21 GMT -5
Tom, I am not sure where you are getting this. Field hockey is played almost exclusively by girls, not boys. My bad. Brain fart and lack of proof reading. The most common examples of this exception being employed by boys is playing field hockey with girls because there is almost no high school boys field hockey in this country
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