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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Sept 8, 2022 11:15:55 GMT -5
For the enrolling class of 2025 at HC, a standardized test optional school meaning one doesn't need to submit one's scores to be considered and admitted,
SAT verbal score Between 200 and 299: 0.3 percent (of a class numbering 821) Between 300 and 399: 1.2 percent Between 400 and 499: 0.9 percent
SAT composite scores 400-599: 0.9 percent 600-799: 4.9 percent 800-999: 2.2 percent
For the class of 2025 at Georgetown, standardized tests required: SAT Composite scores: 400-799: 0.0 percent 800-999: 0.3 percent
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Sept 8, 2022 11:21:26 GMT -5
I just cannot comprehend that HC would have any students with an SAT composite below 800, never mind 5.8%.I'mguessingthat the % refer tothebase of students who submitted SAT's. Are these low scorers likely recruited athletes as they (I think) are required by the NCAA to submit SATs?
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Sept 8, 2022 11:46:47 GMT -5
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Post by sader1970 on Sept 8, 2022 11:49:32 GMT -5
1. Tom Gilmore told me years ago when HC went SAT optional that it made no difference for HC athletes because the NCAA required them and overruled any HC policy for athletes. 2. Ann McDermott, say what you want about her (met her only once when she was assistant Admissions and much younger and was not arrogant then), but the criticism from the coaches was that her standard was too high, not that she was letting in stupid people/athletes. 3. As I've posted many times before, Frank Vellaccio personally told me on more than one occasion that no student-athlete could be admitted to HC without his prior approval (i.e. he was the guy, not Ann McDermott, who should catch the slings and arrows for any athlete who wasn't admitted to HC but went to another PL school). 4. We can't criticize (fairly, anyway) Ann for both letting in dopes and having too high a standard for potential athletes. 5. Finally, admissions is not a black and white decision (like NFL final cuts watching Dan Campbell and his GM making tough Lions' decisions). Our alma mater, years ago, decided SATs weren't the be-all, end-all and chose to make more subjective decisions. Not sure if that was an Ann Mc initiative (suspect it was). It seems many more colleges are trending towards us than away from us on this. Now, whether we are getting better quality students, I'm not qualified to say, but I will say over the last 20 +/- years I've been visiting the campus and meeting students and student-athletes, they haven't seemed to have missed a beat and as I like to tell the newbies "I couldn't get into Holy Cross now." Once HC went co-ed, it cut the number of men roughly in half and I was bottom half, no question about it.
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Sept 8, 2022 12:05:26 GMT -5
For the class of 2024, no enrolling student had a SAT composite score below 1,000. The class of 2025 was Ann's last class, Maybe she was being nice to the legacies. I dunno.
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Post by longsuffering on Sept 8, 2022 15:30:15 GMT -5
In a defense of sorts of TPTB, when HC started to get passed in the rankings by other schools I didn't immediately think of the admissions dept. I had to be educated on Crossports that Admissions is also Marketing. My first thought was about the product, not the selling of it but you learn a lot reading Crossports.
I realize now how much outreach has to be done to compete and the targeting and framing of that outreach is critical.
HC might have had high ranking administrators and trustees who were slow understanding that they were salespersons as much as academics..
I and possibly TPTB understood the need to sell HC to generate donations and grants, but not how critical selling the college is to generate the best applicants.
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Post by sader1970 on Sept 8, 2022 19:15:37 GMT -5
I can tell you from direct, personal conversations that I had with Fr. McFarland that he didn't give the proverbial rat's patoot about rankings in general and USN&WR in particular. He didn't have Fr. Brooks' "Ivy Envy" maybe because he was a Cornell Ivy Leaguer himself? [And for those who don't know, Fr. McF was a high school classmate of one of my HC Classmate buddies who said he was a "certifiable genius" and graduated from Cornell in 3 years, so '69 rather than '70]
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Sept 9, 2022 12:32:35 GMT -5
Fr. McF would have been far better off heading a computer sciences institute at Santa Clara,
Ask why two of the 11 Jesuits in the current Holy Cross community are physicians. I believe one of the other Jesuits is an oceanographer. As the ranks thin, skill sets and capabilities seem increasingly misplaced. -------------- The sexual misconduct report lays bare the historic inability of the college, until recently, to keep up with the times. The Title IX office was not established until 2015, and was functionally unstable for several years thereafter, I remember in the case of Cooper discovering there basically was no policy manual / guidelines for investigating her (and her fellow player's) complaints. Those came after.
The report also describes how DeLoite was recently hired to create a management structure for the college. I have a growing sense that Fr. B. told the BoT not only was he the last Jesuit, but that the college needed to put an organizational and management structure in place for the next President. Decisions would no longer be made over meals in the Ciampi dining room. In retrospect, there was too much ambiguity over responsibilities, and thus no real accountability. The BoT has taken the reins and is now running the college.
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Post by Chu Chu on Sept 9, 2022 13:53:36 GMT -5
Fr. McF would have been far better off heading a computer sciences institute at Santa Clara, Ask why two of the 11 Jesuits in the current Holy Cross community are physicians. I believe one of the other Jesuits is an oceanographer. As the ranks thin, skill sets and capabilities seem increasingly misplaced. -------------- The sexual misconduct report lays bare the historic inability of the college, until recently, to keep up with the times. The Title IX office was not established until 2015, and was functionally unstable for several years thereafter, I remember in the case of Cooper discovering there basically was no policy manual / guidelines for investigating her (and her fellow player's) complaints. Those came after. The report also describes how DeLoite was recently hired to create a management structure for the college. I have a growing sense that Fr. B. told the BoT not only was he the last Jesuit, but that the college needed to put an organizational and management structure in place for the next President. Decisions would no longer be made over meals in the Ciampi dining room. In retrospect, there was too much ambiguity over responsibilities, and thus no real accountability. The BoT has taken the reins and is now running the college. Good news all around. Thanks.
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Post by longsuffering on Sept 10, 2022 12:22:36 GMT -5
Fr. McF would have been far better off heading a computer sciences institute at Santa Clara, Ask why two of the 11 Jesuits in the current Holy Cross community are physicians. I believe one of the other Jesuits is an oceanographer. As the ranks thin, skill sets and capabilities seem increasingly misplaced. -------------- The sexual misconduct report lays bare the historic inability of the college, until recently, to keep up with the times. The Title IX office was not established until 2015, and was functionally unstable for several years thereafter, I remember in the case of Cooper discovering there basically was no policy manual / guidelines for investigating her (and her fellow player's) complaints. Those came after. The report also describes how DeLoite was recently hired to create a management structure for the college. I have a growing sense that Fr. B. told the BoT not only was he the last Jesuit, but that the college needed to put an organizational and management structure in place for the next President. Decisions would no longer be made over meals in the Ciampi dining room. In retrospect, there was too much ambiguity over responsibilities, and thus no real accountability. The BoT has taken the reins and is now running the college. Yeah, all that can be said of 178 years of failed Jesuit leadership is ... "Thanks a Billion." 🤣
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Post by hchoops on Sept 11, 2022 19:33:50 GMT -5
One possible indication of a change in Admission philosophy is a scheduled visit this upcoming week by an HC Admissions counselor to The Westown School, a private, Quaker, high academic school with many international students(and a nationally ranked hoops team) located outside Philly. Now I do not know if Admissions had visited there in the past, but that may be a sign of change.
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Post by longsuffering on Sept 11, 2022 23:46:03 GMT -5
One possible indication of a change in Admission philosophy is a scheduled visit this upcoming week by an HC Admissions counselor to The Westown School, a private, Quaker, high academic school with many international students(and a nationally ranked hoops team) located outside Philly. Now I do not know if Admissions had visited there in the past, but that may be a sign of change. Couldn't hurt. International students and their families have already placed a positive value of living and learning in a new culture so a being a Jesuit College shouldn't be a barrier.
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Sept 12, 2022 11:06:22 GMT -5
One possible indication of a change in Admission philosophy is a scheduled visit this upcoming week by an HC Admissions counselor to The Westown School, a private, Quaker, high academic school with many international students(and a nationally ranked hoops team) located outside Philly. Now I do not know if Admissions had visited there in the past, but that may be a sign of change. Very likely not. HC admissions made few visits to Philadelphia schools. Maybe St. Joe's Prep. Episcopal Academy, several like that. Almost certainly no visits to diocesan high schools. --------- One sign of change. A job opening for admissions counselor at HC lists Mandarin fluency as a plus.
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Post by hchoops on Sept 12, 2022 11:32:52 GMT -5
There are many Chinese students at Westown.
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Post by Crucis#1 on Sept 12, 2022 11:49:46 GMT -5
What was the rationale for not visiting Diocesan High Schools in Philadelphia in recent years?
In the late 60’s there were at least 15 students enrolled per class from the Philadelphia area, St.Joes Prep, Lasalle College HS, Malvern Prep, Cardinal O’Hara, etc.
From discussion with several Alumni, I was told that a number of Diocesan High Schools in NYC also were not visited by HC Admissions.
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Sept 12, 2022 12:18:56 GMT -5
What was the rationale for not visiting Diocesan High Schools in Philadelphia in recent years? In the late 60’s there were at least 15 students enrolled per class from the Philadelphia area, St.Joes Prep, Lasalle College HS, Malvern Prep, Cardinal O’Hara, etc. From discussion with several Alumni, I was told that a number of Diocesan High Schools in NYC also were not visited by HC Admissions. I think in many cities there is a hierarchy of Catholic high schools. For example, here in Louisville St Xavier, Trinity, Sacred Heart, and Assumption would be seen as upscale and academically more distinguished while Mercy, Presentation, Holy Cross, and DeSales would be seen as blue collar or middle class and lower on the academic scale. Likely that holds true in Philly
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