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Post by crusader1970 on Jan 27, 2022 9:25:20 GMT -5
After reading all the posts on the American game last night, it appears that many of us are close to throwing in the towel on the entire men's basketball program.
The general sentiment on CROSSPORTS has clearly shifted from "somewhat hopeful" to "totally hopeless situation" .
That is scary because we are the most avid and loyal supporters of HC basketball.
But we need to know that there is change in the air.
Coach Brett Nelson is way over his head and in 2 1/2 years he has taken a once proud basketball program that was struggling and driven it clearly into the gutter.
He has to go and none of us can stand to think that we may have to endure another season of Coach Nelson.
So......the ball is now in Kit Hughes' court. The situation is worse than any of us could have imagined. He was there last night. Does he understand this?
If not, how do we get our total frustration through to him?
Any AD worth his salt would already be compiling a list of coaching candidates to be pursued aggressively after firing Nelson on March 2nd.
Let's hope Kit is as concerned as we are.
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Post by lou on Jan 27, 2022 9:45:03 GMT -5
Agree, except for "entire [men's] basketball program."
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Post by crusader1970 on Jan 27, 2022 10:06:04 GMT -5
Agree, except for "entire [men's] basketball program." Excellent edit.
Made the change,
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Post by hc17 on Jan 27, 2022 10:21:47 GMT -5
Draw up the shortlist and get the new coach and staff through the door ASAP. How can anyone have confidence in this program at any level?
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Post by hchoops on Jan 27, 2022 10:50:25 GMT -5
Does Kit have the authority to fire BN and swallow the $$$$ after 2 months?
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Post by purplehaze on Jan 27, 2022 11:04:49 GMT -5
In a totally different world of college bball, Louisville parted ways with Chris Mack this week - Although we are a low major there is a clear advantage to making such a change at HC now - more time to find a new coach, complete recruiting and work the transfer portal (assuming our roster will have some turnover). To wait until March will just make the transition more difficult and perilous if we're serious about a turnaround.
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Post by sader1970 on Jan 27, 2022 11:17:29 GMT -5
1. If Kit doesn't have the authority to fire Nelson, he shouldn't have accepted the job, 2. Despite this and assuming he does have the authority, Kit may still decide not to fire him now. My best guess is Nelson will be gone the day after this season ends. 3. Here's a somewhat disconcerting note, the last time I checked, Kit does NOT have a public email address nor a listed phone number to either email or call him. My hope is despite his sparkling personality and numerous twitter clips that he is not taking a page from Nelson (i.e. anti-fan communication) - here: goholycross.com/staff-directory4. My read on Nelson's lack of fan communication is a crushing lack of self-confidence. He absolutely knows he's been in over his head from day one. Thank you, Marcus! 5 As much as my gut is grinding, I'll stick with my "give him until the end of the season" position.
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Post by hc17 on Jan 27, 2022 11:26:37 GMT -5
Imagine being a D1 Coach and not taking any questions at all from your own department or the local media. Let's face it, Charlie Bare is the one feeding the soft ball questions and Brett cannot spare a moment to do that. My best guess is that he knows he's walking the plank and their isn't a path back for him. As a result, he's just going through the motions until that final game in early March. There have been no signs that he's lost the locker room, but I gotta imagine patience is wearing thin with a lot of the players.
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Post by Sons of Vaval on Jan 27, 2022 11:40:04 GMT -5
There have been no signs that he's lost the locker room, but I gotta imagine patience is wearing thin with a lot of the players. Last night was the first time this season it looked as if the team didn't care to be playing basketball. They were content with watching the clock hit 00:00 and then catching a flight back home. Besides Gates, the team looked totally disinterested. I'm not sure if that's an indication the locker room is lost, or they are so incredibly demoralized and have zero confidence in their coach to steer them in the right direction. Either way, it could not be more plainly obvious that the final ten games of the season should be his last as head coach.
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Post by timholycross on Jan 27, 2022 11:42:36 GMT -5
Imagine being a D1 Coach and not taking any questions at all from your own department or the local media. Let's face it, Charlie Bare is the one feeding the soft ball questions and Brett cannot spare a moment to do that. My best guess is that he knows he's walking the plank and their isn't a path back for him. As a result, he's just going through the motions until that final game in early March. There have been no signs that he's lost the locker room, but I gotta imagine patience is wearing thin with a lot of the players. He's not causing them to play so bad as they played last night, however. If he's somehow retained and a player wants to leave, very, very, very few are creating any kind of resume to land at a better program. If he leaves and the prevailing wisdom of these teenagers is "leave as well"; same as for him staying applies.
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Post by A Clock Tower Purple on Jan 27, 2022 11:56:02 GMT -5
Nelson brought every player on the team here. If they're not good, that's his fault.
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Post by hc17 on Jan 27, 2022 12:04:22 GMT -5
Not to be too critical, but how many of these players have all conference potential? To me, they can all player better with a new coach, but I don't see that level of talent or ability on this roster as I see it today.
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Post by longsuffering on Jan 27, 2022 12:04:37 GMT -5
You would think it is safe to assume that a last place college basketball team that transitions coaches would have turnover via the portal in this day and age. But there is no hint any particular player is interested in leaving Holy Cross.
I hope Kit doesn't hire some Rambo to come in and blow up the team. Been there done that and didn't buy the t-shirt in the book store. I think the default from the BOT, President, AD on down should be nobody leaves without a strong retention effort from HC.
What did the exodus before, during and after the past two seasons accomplish?
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Post by Tom on Jan 27, 2022 12:05:20 GMT -5
Imagine being a D1 Coach and not taking any questions at all from your own department or the local media. Let's face it, Charlie Bare is the one feeding the soft ball questions and Brett cannot spare a moment to do that. Nothing to do with product on floor where there's plenty to criticize, but I don't believe that. I can't believe Charles Bare is asking for a post game sit down and Coach Nelson is refusing. I don't think the old theory that there's no such thing as bad publicity applies in this situation. I think athletics doesn't want to be put in a position to ask foolish questions or hard ones that spot light how bad things are. I agree that it is part of a coach's job to deal with the media. I do not think it is part of the coach's job to chase down his department's media relations guy or the ESPN+ announcers requesting they ask him why he just lost
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Post by timholycross on Jan 27, 2022 12:22:45 GMT -5
Nelson brought every player on the team here. If they're not good, that's his fault. Brett Nelson's fault, no matter how accurate you are on that; isn't going to get those players a basketball playing role at some other D1 university.
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Post by hc17 on Jan 27, 2022 12:27:31 GMT -5
Imagine being a D1 Coach and not taking any questions at all from your own department or the local media. Let's face it, Charlie Bare is the one feeding the soft ball questions and Brett cannot spare a moment to do that. Nothing to do with product on floor where there's plenty to criticize, but I don't believe that. I can't believe Charles Bare is asking for a post game sit down and Coach Nelson is refusing. I don't think the old theory that there's no such thing as bad publicity applies in this situation. I think athletics doesn't want to be put in a position to ask foolish questions or hard ones that spot light how bad things are. I agree that it is part of a coach's job to deal with the media. I do not think it is part of the coach's job to chase down his department's media relations guy or the ESPN+ announcers requesting they ask him why he just lost And that's a fair point if the issue is deeper rooted and the department is trying to avoid as much publicity as possible. Still doesn't make sense why Nelson and this department has shown little to no outreach to the remaining supporters of this program. Don't let circumstances dictate the attitude & tone of the program. We all knew this was a developmental year, but I think its fair to say that this program lacks a "growth mindset" when it comes to coaching, development, the fans, etc. What's the vision? I thought we'd have one by now as a steadfast support of this coaching staff. The results of this year has made me rethink a lot of what we know about this program and staff. It's unfortunate and the situation is dire.
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Post by hc17 on Jan 27, 2022 12:30:54 GMT -5
You would think it is safe to assume that a last place college basketball team that transitions coaches would have turnover via the portal in this day and age. But there is no hint any particular player is interested in leaving Holy Cross. I hope Kit doesn't hire some Rambo to come in and blow up the team. Been there done that and didn't buy the t-shirt in the book store. I think the default from the BOT, President, AD on down should be nobody leaves without a strong retention effort from HC. What did the exodus before, during and after the past two seasons accomplish? We cannot afford another exodus. PL winning programs have veteran rosters. Good coaching can maximize what talent we do have and put us back on the right path. Hire someone with experience, charisma, and an ability to sell the college in its entirety.
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Post by longsuffering on Jan 27, 2022 12:43:19 GMT -5
Who are the program and staff? The AD who hired the coach and thus was the architect of the current program is gone. The new AD has no fingerprints on it yet and other than our four year fan to quality player relationship with RJE, we really haven't had much of a chance to get to know the staff or players with Covid and losing being contributors to that.
A positive is that there has been no turnover with any employee or player BN has brought to Holy Cross. Maybe Covid and losing has limited avenues out of Worcester, and maybe the dam is waiting to blow, but that is still a positive at this point.
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Post by Tom on Jan 27, 2022 12:47:57 GMT -5
A positive is that there has been no turnover with any employee or player BN has brought to Holy Cross. Maybe Covid and losing has limited avenues out of Worcester, and maybe the dam is waiting to blow, but that is still a positive at this point. almost no turnover. Joe Reilly was a Coach Nelson recruit
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Post by longsuffering on Jan 27, 2022 12:57:25 GMT -5
A positive is that there has been no turnover with any employee or player BN has brought to Holy Cross. Maybe Covid and losing has limited avenues out of Worcester, and maybe the dam is waiting to blow, but that is still a positive at this point. almost no turnover. Joe Reilly was a Coach Nelson recruit Good catch.
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Post by Ray on Jan 27, 2022 12:59:34 GMT -5
There's no point in making a change this week. It's not like baseball where you can bring in a new manager and change the clubhouse dynamic with a proven winner who's sitting in the MLB Network studio or something. If you make a change, you're giving the team to RJ, which I don't see as a reason to expect things to magically get better.
Kit's following the team on the road is a positive, as he clearly needs to be making an evaluation here. But I don't think that means the die is cast... he is in information-gathering mode.
I'm not at all optimistic about where things go from here, but I think it's reasonable to give Nelson the rest of the season, see if he can show some progress in the second time around the league schedule. Also notably, I think it's important to see what happens with the transfer portal at the end of the season. If, hypothetically speaking, Nelson goes .500 on the second half of the PL schedule, and keeps the roster intact going into next year... is that enough to give him another year? I have my view, but what matters is Kit's. We know how things look now, we don't know for sure how they look in six more weeks.
And frankly, I'm less worried about whether Kit has the authority to make a change and eat the BN buyout, as opposed to whether he's better prepared to make a change and run a search a year from now, vs. right now. Blossom was brand-spanking-new in this gig when he had to replace Carmody, and it looks like he mostly turned it over to a search firm and in the end got it wrong. If it's a choice between getting the right candidate next year vs the wrong candidate this year, I'd be willing to suffer through another year of this malaise.
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Post by longsuffering on Jan 27, 2022 13:17:59 GMT -5
Nothing to do with product on floor where there's plenty to criticize, but I don't believe that. I can't believe Charles Bare is asking for a post game sit down and Coach Nelson is refusing. I don't think the old theory that there's no such thing as bad publicity applies in this situation. I think athletics doesn't want to be put in a position to ask foolish questions or hard ones that spot light how bad things are. I agree that it is part of a coach's job to deal with the media. I do not think it is part of the coach's job to chase down his department's media relations guy or the ESPN+ announcers requesting they ask him why he just lost And that's a fair point if the issue is deeper rooted and the department is trying to avoid as much publicity as possible. Still doesn't make sense why Nelson and this department has shown little to no outreach to the remaining supporters of this program. Don't let circumstances dictate the attitude & tone of the program. We all knew this was a developmental year, but I think its fair to say that this program lacks a "growth mindset" when it comes to coaching, development, the fans, etc. What's the vision? I thought we'd have one by now as a steadfast support of this coaching staff. The results of this year has made me rethink a lot of what we know about this program and staff. It's unfortunate and the situation is dire. Today's sports media has turned how coaches handle being grilled after losses into a morality play and a character issue. They paint someone who absorbs it calmly as a stand up guy and ones that don't as shirking their responsibility to them and the public. Maybe a middle ground in this situation is periodic chalkboard sessions on the website not connected with a particular game that allow Nelson to break down his attack and serve approach and educate fans about the offensive and defensive schemes the team is executing on the court. The team isn't executing well but it would still be helpful to coach and fan for him to try to explain what is being attempted. That might lead to the coach realizing why it's not working. Sometimes when you try to explain an initiative and you can't make it sound sharp and precise to others you realize it needs to be changed.
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Post by trimster on Jan 27, 2022 13:18:41 GMT -5
If there is change made at the top, the search firm should consist of 5 former players and perhaps Ralph if he is interested. Let them rank the candidates and turn it over to KH and VR.
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Post by longsuffering on Jan 27, 2022 13:24:10 GMT -5
There's no point in making a change this week. It's not like baseball where you can bring in a new manager and change the clubhouse dynamic with a proven winner who's sitting in the MLB Network studio or something. If you make a change, you're giving the team to RJ, which I don't see as a reason to expect things to magically get better. Kit's following the team on the road is a positive, as he clearly needs to be making an evaluation here. But I don't think that means the die is cast... he is in information-gathering mode. I'm not at all optimistic about where things go from here, but I think it's reasonable to give Nelson the rest of the season, see if he can show some progress in the second time around the league schedule. Also notably, I think it's important to see what happens with the transfer portal at the end of the season. If, hypothetically speaking, Nelson goes .500 on the second half of the PL schedule, and keeps the roster intact going into next year... is that enough to give him another year? I have my view, but what matters is Kit's. We know how things look now, we don't know for sure how they look in six more weeks. And frankly, I'm less worried about whether Kit has the authority to make a change and eat the BN buyout, as opposed to whether he's better prepared to make a change and run a search a year from now, vs. right now. Blossom was brand-spanking-new in this gig when he had to replace Carmody, and it looks like he mostly turned it over to a search firm and in the end got it wrong. If it's a choice between getting the right candidate next year vs the wrong candidate this year, I'd be willing to suffer through another year of this malaise. I always scratched my head at New General Managers who come in and fire the head coach with years left on his contract immediately. Don't they realize they shot their whole wad during their first hour in the casino?
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Post by longsuffering on Jan 27, 2022 13:32:52 GMT -5
If there is change made at the top, the search firm should consist of 5 former players and perhaps Ralph if he is interested. Let them rank the candidates and turn it over to KH and VR. [/quotaround Maybe VR sent KH to DC as a fact finding trip for KH's report expected on VR's desk this week on how he can help BN turn this thing around before HC has to dig deep and send BN packing. That would be a President who will require an AD to make a thorough sound case before eating salary. Not the same approach as UConn who managed to lose $47 million in the Athletic Dept in the most recent reporting year, plus another $11 million last week.
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