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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Feb 12, 2022 7:44:56 GMT -5
Are you serious - an associate AD would have more pull than big donor alumni with an athletic focus. Bfoley - that’s plain idiotic. I’m honestly not sure how it went down at HC but if you don’t think big donor alumni have input on this at many schools - you’re out of your mind. I’m still surprised to the extent this happens at schools that one might not expect take football that seriously. For example, a noteworthy HC football alum told me first hand that after his 2nd second consecutive winless Ivy campaign in 2018, the following week a group of about a half dozen football alums asked for a meeting with the Brown AD and President to discuss Estes’ exit. Our alum was in the room (working on staff at Brown) and said the alums had one goal, to get the exact $$ number of Estes’ buyout before leaving.. The meeting took place on a Friday and the following Monday a couple were back with a check in the exact amount (he said if memory served it was ~700k) They said “tell him we are thankful for his 20 years of dedication to this program but it’s time”. It’s not everything or the same at every institution but once you lose the most influential alumni base at most programs, it’s nearly impossible to survive. See also: www.thecrimson.com/article/2011/4/13/harvard-amaker-booster-amakers/ |
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Feb 12, 2022 10:40:27 GMT -5
Bfoley you have no clue who’s has pull and who doesn’t have pull. How can a guy who was hired at Holy Cross (after) Chesney be the guy who hired him at Holy Cross. Why don’t you pay attention to that UNH Wildcat team. They really need your input. We don’t. Well you have been corrected thankfully for how wrong you were on your dates... As I said in the past, I was a supporter of Chesney unlike most of you guys that have jumped on the bandwagon. But go on!
crossports.freeforums.net/thread/1868/coaching-candidates?page=50&scrollTo=52242What do you mean that you were "a supporter of Chesney"? What, you were in favor of him becoming the head coach at a college you hate? Can you please go away-you agg no value to thjis board, unlike the other posters from other colleges |
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Post by sader1970 on Feb 12, 2022 10:51:25 GMT -5
Rightly or wrongly, Foley used to be, if not a Holy Cross supporter, he was at least objective 4+/- years ago when we were looking for a new head football coach.
For his own reasons, he's turned to the dark side. I wish he would just come out and explain to the rest of the board his change of heart. He was definitely not a Holy Cross "hater" in the past. It's up to him to explain why the change.
And as I've posted previously, let's not let feelings about him bleed over and taint UNH.
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Post by cmo on Feb 12, 2022 17:19:03 GMT -5
And another thing. Why do you opine on HC things on this board. I honestly couldn’t care less what happens at UNH. They have success - great; they blow who cares. The last thing on my mind is getting on another schools chat room board where I zero vested interest and giving my opinion. I’m honestly not that busy or important - but the idea of using my time for that - is mind numbing. because it gets a response. If people stop “feeding the trolls” they look elsewhere. Easier said, than done, I’ll admit. |
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Post by dharry13 on Feb 12, 2022 17:50:50 GMT -5
Fair enough - and quite true.
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Post by bfoley82 on Feb 12, 2022 19:44:29 GMT -5
What do you mean that you were "a supporter of Chesney"? What, you were in favor of him becoming the head coach at a college you hate? Can you please go away-you agg no value to thjis board, unlike the other posters from other colleges I was the one on here saying he was a good coach while some of you were saying Holy Cross was better than hiring a D-2 head coach. Guess hiring a D-2 head coach worked out quite well huh? |
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Post by jkh67 on Feb 12, 2022 20:17:47 GMT -5
Are you serious - an associate AD would have more pull than big donor alumni with an athletic focus. Bfoley - that’s plain idiotic. I’m honestly not sure how it went down at HC but if you don’t think big donor alumni have input on this at many schools - you’re out of your mind. I’m still surprised to the extent this happens at schools that one might not expect take football that seriously. For example, a notable HC football alum told me first hand that after his 2nd second consecutive winless Ivy campaign in 2018, the following week a group of about a half dozen football alums asked for a meeting with the Brown AD and President to discuss Estes’ exit. Our alum was in the room (working on staff at Brown) and said the alums had one goal, to get the exact $$ number of Estes’ buyout before leaving.. The meeting took place on a Friday and the following Monday a couple were back with a check in the exact amount (he said if memory served it was ~700k) They said “tell him we are thankful for his 20 years of dedication to this program but it’s time”. It’s not everything or the same at every institution but once you lose the most influential alumni base at most programs, it’s nearly impossible to survive. Some years ago, a Princeton grad was quoted as saying that alumni giving took a quantum leap upward when the Tigers won the Ivy football or basketball title. Yes, indeed. TPTB at HC, take notice! |
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Post by mm67 on Feb 12, 2022 22:11:26 GMT -5
Years ago at a dinner in Florida I heard Fr. Brooks say that it was easier for a college president to raise money from the alumni
when the football team was 10-0 rather than 0-10. In fact he was an avid fan of HC sports.
Of course he was opposed to the overemphasis of big time sports such as membership in the BE due to the academic costs.
In all likelihood success in the PL will result in increased giving by alums.
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Post by rgs318 on Feb 13, 2022 7:52:45 GMT -5
Increased giving by alums? From your mouth to God's ear.
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Post by midwestsader05 on Feb 14, 2022 12:57:45 GMT -5
Rightly or wrongly, Foley used to be, if not a Holy Cross supporter, he was at least objective 4+/- years ago when we were looking for a new head football coach. For his own reasons, he's turned to the dark side. I wish he would just come out and explain to the rest of the board his change of heart. He was definitely not a Holy Cross "hater" in the past. It's up to him to explain why the change. And as I've posted previously, let's not let feelings about him bleed over and taint UNH. My comment about swapping UNH and Albany was tongue and cheek. I for one am very excited of what I expect will be an increased amount of "home and home" series with CAA schools over the next 5 years. I previously broke it down by most preferred and likely opponents by geography (North and South) but you could also do it by the larger public universities and the more peer like private institutions. As for the publics, URI and UNH are clearly the most likely and make the most sense. Albany likely 3rd and Delaware (while exciting and I'm sure welcomed by many on this board) a distant 4th. As for the privates, Villanova and Monmouth are also the most likely. I would love to have an annual rivalry built over time with Nova' but this might be a challenge given that they tend to play the PA based Patriot League schools (Bucknell and Lehigh last year and I believe at least Lehigh again this year) While longer shots, I do hope we can get a home and home with either Richmond or William and Mary on the books in the foreseeable future. |
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Post by HC92 on Feb 14, 2022 13:00:38 GMT -5
William and Mary would be a fun weekend to plan some alumni events.
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Post by gks on Feb 14, 2022 19:36:41 GMT -5
Rightly or wrongly, Foley used to be, if not a Holy Cross supporter, he was at least objective 4+/- years ago when we were looking for a new head football coach. For his own reasons, he's turned to the dark side. I wish he would just come out and explain to the rest of the board his change of heart. He was definitely not a Holy Cross "hater" in the past. It's up to him to explain why the change. And as I've posted previously, let's not let feelings about him bleed over and taint UNH. My comment about swapping UNH and Albany was tongue and cheek. I for one am very excited of what I expect will be an increased amount of "home and home" series with CAA schools over the next 5 years. I previously broke it down by most preferred and likely opponents by geography (North and South) but you could also do it by the larger public universities and the more peer like private institutions. As for the publics, URI and UNH are clearly the most likely and make the most sense. Albany likely 3rd and Delaware (while exciting and I'm sure welcomed by many on this board) a distant 4th. As for the privates, Villanova and Monmouth are also the most likely. I would love to have an annual rivalry built over time with Nova' but this might be a challenge given that they tend to play the PA based Patriot League schools (Bucknell and Lehigh last year and I believe at least Lehigh again this year) While longer shots, I do hope we can get a home and home with either Richmond or William and Mary on the books in the foreseeable future. IMO...three CAA non-league games, which I assume would be tough to pull off, would be awesome. I'd rather see multiple CAA than multiple Ivies every season. |
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Post by matunuck on Feb 14, 2022 21:02:07 GMT -5
William and Mary would be a fun weekend to plan some alumni events. 100 percent spot on. |
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Post by longsuffering on Feb 15, 2022 0:01:18 GMT -5
My comment about swapping UNH and Albany was tongue and cheek. I for one am very excited of what I expect will be an increased amount of "home and home" series with CAA schools over the next 5 years. I previously broke it down by most preferred and likely opponents by geography (North and South) but you could also do it by the larger public universities and the more peer like private institutions. As for the publics, URI and UNH are clearly the most likely and make the most sense. Albany likely 3rd and Delaware (while exciting and I'm sure welcomed by many on this board) a distant 4th. As for the privates, Villanova and Monmouth are also the most likely. I would love to have an annual rivalry built over time with Nova' but this might be a challenge given that they tend to play the PA based Patriot League schools (Bucknell and Lehigh last year and I believe at least Lehigh again this year) While longer shots, I do hope we can get a home and home with either Richmond or William and Mary on the books in the foreseeable future. IMO...three CAA non-league games, which I assume would be tough to pull off, would be awesome. I'd rather see multiple CAA than multiple Ivies every season. Last fall Harvard kicked our butts and Villanova just squeaked by us. How would Nova have fared against the Johnnies? CAA plays quality football but so don't three of our traditional New England Ivy rivals, H,Y & D. I can't recall Brown being good since Joe Paterno played there. The IL doesn't participate in the FCS tournament, which is a shame, but they participate in the rankings all season long so HC still gets a bump when they play an Ivy team with a good record. |
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Post by bfoley82 on Feb 15, 2022 0:14:33 GMT -5
IMO...three CAA non-league games, which I assume would be tough to pull off, would be awesome. I'd rather see multiple CAA than multiple Ivies every season. Last fall Harvard kicked our butts and Villanova just squeaked by us. How would Nova have fared against the Johnnies? CAA plays quality football but so don't three of our traditional New England Ivy rivals, H,Y & D. I can't recall Brown being good since Joe Paterno played there. The IL doesn't participate in the FCS tournament, which is a shame, but they participate in the rankings all season long so HC still gets a bump when they play an Ivy team with a good record. Brown has never been good even with Joe Pa. They won their first Ivy League title in 1976 with the other three in 1999, 2005 and 2008. They did play in the Rose Bowl in 1915. |
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Post by hc87 on Feb 15, 2022 1:11:00 GMT -5
Last fall Harvard kicked our butts and Villanova just squeaked by us. How would Nova have fared against the Johnnies? CAA plays quality football but so don't three of our traditional New England Ivy rivals, H,Y & D. I can't recall Brown being good since Joe Paterno played there. The IL doesn't participate in the FCS tournament, which is a shame, but they participate in the rankings all season long so HC still gets a bump when they play an Ivy team with a good record. Brown has never been good even with Joe Pa. They won their first Ivy League title in 1976 with the other three in 1999, 2005 and 2008. They did play in the Rose Bowl in 1915. Brown was very solid under John Anderson in the mid/late 1970s....one of the bettah Ivy football programs during that time. As you posted, they were also solid undah Phil Estes in the late '90s/'00s. They are a good, local opponent....hope we continue to play them every so often moving forward. |
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Post by gks on Feb 15, 2022 7:16:40 GMT -5
IMO...three CAA non-league games, which I assume would be tough to pull off, would be awesome. I'd rather see multiple CAA than multiple Ivies every season. Last fall Harvard kicked our butts and Villanova just squeaked by us. How would Nova have fared against the Johnnies? CAA plays quality football but so don't three of our traditional New England Ivy rivals, H,Y & D. I can't recall Brown being good since Joe Paterno played there. The IL doesn't participate in the FCS tournament, which is a shame, but they participate in the rankings all season long so HC still gets a bump when they play an Ivy team with a good record. We'll never know because Harvard stays in their little snooty bubble. Want to compete on a national stage....More CAA, less Ivies. |
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Post by hcgrad94 on Feb 15, 2022 7:39:25 GMT -5
Brown has never been good even with Joe Pa. They won their first Ivy League title in 1976 with the other three in 1999, 2005 and 2008. They did play in the Rose Bowl in 1915. Brown was very solid under John Anderson in the mid/late 1970s....one of the bettah Ivy football programs during that time. As you posted, they were also solid undah Phil Estes in the late '90s/'00s. They are a good, local opponent....hope we continue to play them every so often moving forward. No interest. No juice with Brown home or away. |
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Post by mm67 on Feb 15, 2022 7:40:49 GMT -5
One alum's opinion.
CAA? National stage? Really?
HC has a long tradition of playing Ivies. Don't see any benefit loading the OOC schedule with largely anonymous state schools + Villanova. Play one or two occasionally but in my opinion HC should be playing against more Ivies not less. The ending of our long series against Dartmouth was a loss for us.
Our academic philosophy for admitting scholar-athletes has mirrored the Ivies since the mid-50's. IL teams are a natural fit for HC. And, IL competition burnishes our brand - high academic Catholic Ivy whereas CAA competition does very little. Respectfully.
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Post by gks on Feb 15, 2022 7:47:46 GMT -5
One alum's opinion. CAA? National stage? Really? HC has a long tradition of playing Ivies. Don't see any benefit loading the OOC schedule with largely anonymous state schools + Villanova. Play one or two occasionally but in my opinion HC should be playing against more Ivies not less. The ending of our long series against Dartmouth was a loss for us. Our academic philosophy for admitting scholar-athletes has mirrored the Ivies since the mid-50's. IL teams are a natural fit for HC. And, IL competition burnishes our brand - high academic Catholic Ivy whereas CAA competition does very little. Respectfully. The current coaching staff could care less about bragging rights at the Country Club. They want to compete on a national stage. No one west of the Hudson River cares about Ivy Football. Want a higher seed? Beat UNH, Delaware, Villanova, Maine, URI, Richmond, etc. FCS Football committee has no respect for the Ivy League. |
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Post by mm67 on Feb 15, 2022 8:03:05 GMT -5
One alum's opinion. CAA? National stage? Really? HC has a long tradition of playing Ivies. Don't see any benefit loading the OOC schedule with largely anonymous state schools + Villanova. Play one or two occasionally but in my opinion HC should be playing against more Ivies not less. The ending of our long series against Dartmouth was a loss for us. Our academic philosophy for admitting scholar-athletes has mirrored the Ivies since the mid-50's. IL teams are a natural fit for HC. And, IL competition burnishes our brand - high academic Catholic Ivy whereas CAA competition does very little. Respectfully. The current coaching staff could care less about bragging rights at the Country Club. They want to compete on a national stage. No one west of the Hudson River cares about Ivy Football. Want a higher seed? Beat UNH, Delaware, Villanova, Maine, URI, Richmond, etc. FCS Football committee has no respect for the Ivy League. Whatever floats your boat. Why your obvious animus agains the IL? These are the finest colleges in the land. HC can only hope to reach their standard of academic excellence and prestige on a national level. No? Actually, the rap on HC has been that it is a snobbish, rich boy country club college. We all know the rap is BS. HC has rich women, too. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Gotta' run. I have a golf date at my club in Palm Beach. HA!!!  Only kidding. Am trying to lighten up. Peace. |
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Post by bigfan on Feb 15, 2022 8:10:38 GMT -5
I would alternate games with Harvard, Yale & Princeton. Also add more CAA games Richmond, Villanova, Delaware & William & Mary and every couple of years add a FBS game with
a good money payment.
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Post by newfieguy74 on Feb 15, 2022 8:18:08 GMT -5
The current coaching staff could care less about bragging rights at the Country Club. They want to compete on a national stage. No one west of the Hudson River cares about Ivy Football. Want a higher seed? Beat UNH, Delaware, Villanova, Maine, URI, Richmond, etc. FCS Football committee has no respect for the Ivy League. Whatever floats your boat. Why your obvious animus agains the IL? These are the finest colleges in the land. HC can only hope to reach their standard of academic excellence and prestige on a national level. No? Actually, the rap on HC has been that it is a snobbish, rich boy country club college. We all know the rap is BS. HC has rich women, too. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Gotta' run. I have a golf date at my club in Palm Beach. HA!!!  Only kidding. Am trying to lighten up. Peace. An alum of Assumption once told me that many at Assumption refer to HC as "the snobs on the hill." |
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Post by sader1970 on Feb 15, 2022 8:47:04 GMT -5
I can't and won't speak for anyone else and I sure can't speak for the FCS selection committee but having lived in Ohio, Big Ten country, and spending 15 years traveling all over the country, the Ivy League is MUCH better known (athletically) than the small state schools that some would like to play. Anyone who's passed basic grammar school geography has heard of Delaware, Maine, New Hampshire, Rhode Island, etc. not because of the state university but because it's a state. Everyone has heard of (and admires or despises, individual choice) the Ivy League, especially Harvard and Yale. And yes, they also know they play football.
Villanova? Yep, they know them - not because of football but because of their basketball team. No Villanova basketball? They'd think it's a "new town" in Italy. Richmond? The history buffs know it as the capital of the Confederacy . . . . . and I've been to Richmond multiple times.
If we play our PL rivals, continue to play (as contracted) Harvard and Yale and possibly Dartmouth or Brown every few years and play at least one FBS team (and win), that'll take care of itself. CAA schools would be nice additions. My preference is UNH and URI for state schools.
Understand, yes we'd (especially Bob Chesney and the players) would like to go deep into the playoffs and maybe become national champs, but for the College, it's just as important that we associate with schools in the IL. Call it reputation. Call it prestige. Call it publicity. Football is not in a vacuum atop Mt. St. James. It's part of a bigger picture.
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Post by HC92 on Feb 15, 2022 9:37:13 GMT -5
We’ve played plenty of Ivies over the last 30 years and our academic reputation has gotten worse rather than better. No college applicant looks at our list of football opponents and says, “Wow, I’ve never heard of that place but they play Harvard in football so I’m going to apply.” We need to do things that cause people to know that HC exists outside of the northeast. I’m not sure that being top 25 in FCS every year will do a lot in that regard but it can’t hurt to try it and see what happens. Being top 25 in hoops every year would be really impactful but don’t think we can get from here to there.
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