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Post by Ignutz on Feb 28, 2022 9:16:32 GMT -5
This was the first time since I can't remember when that I did not attend Winter Homecoming. I could post a number of reasons why, but ordinarily I would suck it up, make the drive, and be glad that I did.
A question for those in attendance: Was there a halftime introduction of former MBB players? That was always a staple of Winter Homecoming - as was a reception before the game for those players. If there's one thing that BN has NOT done, it's make a connection with the hoops alumni. I bet he'd have a hard time picking almost any former player out of a police lineup. Carmody wasn't great at it, but was okay. Really no significant outreach since Ralph, and no one in my experience has connected (and stayed connected) as much as George Blaney.
The next guy (or BN in a big hurry) needs to know how important it is to have former players involved.
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Post by sader1970 on Feb 28, 2022 10:00:44 GMT -5
Nelson had no prior connection that I know of to Holy Cross and even a name like Ralph Willard likely got a "WHO?" from him. Even in his first press conference, it came across as insincere when he talked about the great basketball history of Holy Cross. Like someone fed him. Nothing that I've heard or seen has convinced me that my first impression was incorrect that his attitude was that this was his first head coaching job that he expected would be the proverbial "drink of water" before he went on to bigger and better things. So, if you're just passing through, why bother digging deep into the history and culture of a place? Waste of your valuable time.
Perhaps the basketball alums' feelings are more hurt than the rest of us alums/fans/supporters/students(?). I've seen absolutely no personal outreach from him to any Crusader constituencies. Maybe his players . . . . maybe.
But if he doesn't give a dime about us, why should we care about him? I don't mean as individuals, I mean collectively.
As for the "Chalk Talks," interesting that they came about after Kit came on board. A bit of outreach to the season ticket holders which was delegated to Kennedy & Evans. In fairness, Ralph did the same but you could email or talk to Ralph. Sean and Milan actually came to some of these meet & greets. Being honest, I can't recall, despite being relatively recent, what Carmody's connections were but Barbara was in the stands chatting it up with NAD, Tom and others. Bill was accessible by email or just running into him on campus (and a painfully honest guy). He was always on the downslope of his coaching career once he got to Holy Cross.
So, whether Nelson stays or gets hit in the a$$ by the door on the way out after this season, I don't care anymore.
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Post by WCHC Sports on Feb 28, 2022 10:05:19 GMT -5
All fair points... from my perspective, even if he was using HC as a stepping stone to bigger and better things, but could coach, inspire, improve, guide, overcome, recruit, then I wouldn't care. I'd take advantage from him just as much while he was in the building and enjoy the wins. Except we haven't won. We haven't improved. We haven't inspired. We haven't overcome. And it's been short, but as evidenced by my long post months back, we haven't recruited well across several coaches now (no first team all-PL players for the most part across a decade +).
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rose22
Climbing Mt. St. James
Posts: 54
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Post by rose22 on Feb 28, 2022 10:19:12 GMT -5
This was the first time since I can't remember when that I did not attend Winter Homecoming. I could post a number of reasons why, but ordinarily I would suck it up, make the drive, and be glad that I did. A question for those in attendance: Was there a halftime introduction of former MBB players? That was always a staple of Winter Homecoming - as was a reception before the game for those players. If there's one thing that BN has NOT done, it's make a connection with the hoops alumni. I bet he'd have a hard time picking almost any former player out of a police lineup. Carmody wasn't great at it, but was okay. Really no significant outreach since Ralph, and no one in my experience has connected (and stayed connected) as much as George Blaney. The next guy (or BN in a big hurry) needs to know how important it is to have former players involved. So having former players serve as mentors to the current players isn’t having alumni involved.
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Post by hchoops on Feb 28, 2022 10:22:44 GMT -5
Could you give some names , please I presume it is not a secret
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rose22
Climbing Mt. St. James
Posts: 54
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Post by rose22 on Feb 28, 2022 10:28:03 GMT -5
This was the first time since I can't remember when that I did not attend Winter Homecoming. I could post a number of reasons why, but ordinarily I would suck it up, make the drive, and be glad that I did. A question for those in attendance: Was there a halftime introduction of former MBB players? That was always a staple of Winter Homecoming - as was a reception before the game for those players. If there's one thing that BN has NOT done, it's make a connection with the hoops alumni. I bet he'd have a hard time picking almost any former player out of a police lineup. Carmody wasn't great at it, but was okay. Really no significant outreach since Ralph, and no one in my experience has connected (and stayed connected) as much as George Blaney. The next guy (or BN in a big hurry) needs to know how important it is to have former players involved. I assumed this was public knowledge. It started during the Covid season. Someone posted an interview BN did where he discussed zoom meetings he had with former players and how he had plans of getting former players involved in the program. Then I believe it was mentioned during a game on air how some former players were mentoring current players and Torey was in attendance…
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Post by Sons of Vaval on Feb 28, 2022 10:43:05 GMT -5
Sean and Milan actually came to some of these meet & greets. Being honest, I can't recall, despite being relatively recent, what Carmody's connections were but Barbara was in the stands chatting it up with NAD, Tom and others. Bill was accessible by email or just running into him on campus (and a painfully honest guy). He was always on the downslope of his coaching career once he got to Holy Cross. It's pretty crazy to think that of the four coaches we've had since HOFCRW, Milan Brown has been the best one.
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rose22
Climbing Mt. St. James
Posts: 54
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Post by rose22 on Feb 28, 2022 10:43:57 GMT -5
Could you give some names , please I presume it is not a secret I don’t know all of the former players who are involved. I know Torey and Kevin Hamilton are.
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Post by bringbackcaro on Feb 28, 2022 12:35:18 GMT -5
Nelson had no prior connection that I know of to Holy Cross and even a name like Ralph Willard likely got a " WHO?" from him. Even in his first press conference, it came across as insincere when he talked about the great basketball history of Holy Cross. Like someone fed him. Nothing that I've heard or seen has convinced me that my first impression was incorrect that his attitude was that this was his first head coaching job that he expected would be the proverbial "drink of water" before he went on to bigger and better things. So, if you're just passing through, why bother digging deep into the history and culture of a place? Waste of your valuable time. Perhaps the basketball alums' feelings are more hurt than the rest of us alums/fans/supporters/students(?). I've seen absolutely no personal outreach from him to any Crusader constituencies. Maybe his players . . . . maybe. But if he doesn't give a dime about us, why should we care about him? I don't mean as individuals, I mean collectively. As for the "Chalk Talks," interesting that they came about after Kit came on board. A bit of outreach to the season ticket holders which was delegated to Kennedy & Evans. In fairness, Ralph did the same but you could email or talk to Ralph. Sean and Milan actually came to some of these meet & greets. Being honest, I can't recall, despite being relatively recent, what Carmody's connections were but Barbara was in the stands chatting it up with NAD, Tom and others. Bill was accessible by email or just running into him on campus (and a painfully honest guy). He was always on the downslope of his coaching career once he got to Holy Cross. So, whether Nelson stays or gets hit in the a$$ by the door on the way out after this season, I don't care anymore. What a ridiculous post. Between RW, Mark Daigneault, and RJ Evans, there is significant overlap between the Pitino and Billy Donovan coaching trees, where Nelson came from. Hell, he made RJ his first hire. He also spent 4 years before arriving at HC at a Jesuit college. If you think Nelson was blindly connected to this job without a Billy D/RW/Daigneault connection, I’ve got a bridge to sell you. Sorrey, but to me comments like this are just further proof that some seem to have never given Nelson a chance because he has a southern accent and talls different than what HC is used to. A shame.
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Feb 28, 2022 12:41:40 GMT -5
Would you please stop the nonsense about the Nelson Southern accent? Accusing others of bigotry is just so disgusting, and all too often an indication that one has no good arguments to offer.
No one cares how Brett Nelson got connected to this job --we just care about whether he is the right coach for Holy Cross.
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Post by Ignutz on Feb 28, 2022 13:18:32 GMT -5
Could you give some names , please I presume it is not a secret I don’t know all of the former players who are involved. I know Torey and Kevin Hamilton are. I have a very close and decades long relationship with a lot of former players - all very devoted to HC and equally devoted to the MBB program, and I know of NONE who have had ANY meaningful reach-out from BN. As I noted, BC wasn't the best ever at making connections, but there was some effort there - not at the RW level, and certainly not at the GB level. Probably my longest conversation with BC was at the airport in Dublin after an 0-2 tournament showing in Belfast. Despite a poor showing in the first game, and a better showing (with a great comeback) in the second, Bill took the time to discuss what he was seeing and how he thought the team could get better. I don't see that happening with BN - yesterday, today or tomorrow.
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Post by lou on Feb 28, 2022 13:26:45 GMT -5
Carmody also had a great assistant in Coach Scott who was very good at mixing with fans/alums, which I recall he did at the hotel pub in Belfast
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Post by Sons of Vaval on Feb 28, 2022 13:34:19 GMT -5
Nelson might just be uncomfortable conversing with alums. Who knows.
His reluctance to be in front of a camera and not wanting to engage alums is unfortunate.
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Post by Sons of Vaval on Feb 28, 2022 13:35:52 GMT -5
Nelson had no prior connection that I know of to Holy Cross and even a name like Ralph Willard likely got a " WHO?" from him. Even in his first press conference, it came across as insincere when he talked about the great basketball history of Holy Cross. Like someone fed him. Nothing that I've heard or seen has convinced me that my first impression was incorrect that his attitude was that this was his first head coaching job that he expected would be the proverbial "drink of water" before he went on to bigger and better things. So, if you're just passing through, why bother digging deep into the history and culture of a place? Waste of your valuable time. Perhaps the basketball alums' feelings are more hurt than the rest of us alums/fans/supporters/students(?). I've seen absolutely no personal outreach from him to any Crusader constituencies. Maybe his players . . . . maybe. But if he doesn't give a dime about us, why should we care about him? I don't mean as individuals, I mean collectively. As for the "Chalk Talks," interesting that they came about after Kit came on board. A bit of outreach to the season ticket holders which was delegated to Kennedy & Evans. In fairness, Ralph did the same but you could email or talk to Ralph. Sean and Milan actually came to some of these meet & greets. Being honest, I can't recall, despite being relatively recent, what Carmody's connections were but Barbara was in the stands chatting it up with NAD, Tom and others. Bill was accessible by email or just running into him on campus (and a painfully honest guy). He was always on the downslope of his coaching career once he got to Holy Cross. So, whether Nelson stays or gets hit in the a$$ by the door on the way out after this season, I don't care anymore. What a ridiculous post. Between RW, Mark Daigneault, and RJ Evans, there is significant overlap between the Pitino and Billy Donovan coaching trees, where Nelson came from. Hell, he made RJ his first hire. He also spent 4 years before arriving at HC at a Jesuit college. If you think Nelson was blindly connected to this job without a Billy D/RW/Daigneault connection, I’ve got a bridge to sell you. Sorrey, but to me comments like this are just further proof that some seem to have never given Nelson a chance because he has a southern accent and talls different than what HC is used to. A shame. Yeah, it’s definitely the way Nelson talks and not his terrible winning percentage that has most of us not believing he’s the man for the job. Get a grip.
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Post by hchoops on Feb 28, 2022 13:48:26 GMT -5
Caro, You have not commented on losing 5 of our last 6. Why not ?
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Post by rgs318 on Feb 28, 2022 14:03:06 GMT -5
I don't know (or care) about accents. I was born in Texas which some would say makes me a Southerner. I do, however, see in some alums (and Crossports posters) a certainty about their personal views and a tendency to attack (at times) those who disagree with them. That does not happen often - and not at all for many who join in here for discussions. I find that a very positive part of Crossports. Sticking with the W/L record - for a number of years, certainly the last three, it is awful. However, I have seen a change-over of players and I believe the talent level has risen as a result. Next year could be quite different. The team will have the experience that has been missing, and some stars (certainly Luc and Gates) who are among the league's best. I admit I would like to see what the man and staff who put this group together can do with that. One make it or break it season.
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Post by longsuffering on Feb 28, 2022 15:00:06 GMT -5
I thought Coach Brown was uncomfortable and felt a bit inadequate speaking to alums because he mentioned once about HC alums being captains of industry and finance, which is obviously not universal but was his impression to a degree.
But he warmed to the task out of a sense of responsibility and because he had an outgoing personality and grew to enjoy it.
Brett strikes me as shy to begin with but him communicating and meeting with program stakeholders got off to an awkward start with a brand new AD who didn't have HC roots and connections, the 3-29 season that left him like a deer in the headlights, the mass exodus and then the pandemic which curtailed much interaction.
He probably never got to a point if someone like Kit didn't step in and create interaction with chalk talk, that he was comfortable initiating interaction.
Not an excuse. He should have known selling the program is a role of the head coach after being in basketball his whole life.
I can't remember if there was a coaches night before his first season when there was no Covid and no losses to apologize for yet. If not, it's probably not his fault. That should be initiated by the Development Alumni Athletic Industrial Complex at HC that is loaded with staff and is supposed to be integrated in advancing HC.
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Post by sader1970 on Feb 28, 2022 15:01:42 GMT -5
Well, thanks a lot, SOV, for posting this comment (I'm being sarcastic) as I have already set the ignore button for this poster.
Let me say that I appreciate the loyalty that BBC has shown to Nelson. Loyalty is an admirable trait.
But, since his latest post was presumably directed at me, let me say that whatever my feelings are towards Nelson has nothing to do with his "southern accent." First, my father was born much further below the Mason-Dixon line than West Virginia. My mother was born in Worcester and so I ended up with an accent that no matter where I've been around the country, people think I talk "funny." I have friends from Texas, Alabama, Mississippi and Georgia as well as other parts of the country. Also, I have had exactly one personal conversation with Nelson the day of his press conference with Marcus. I almost don't know how he speaks and I could care less.
As to "never giving him a chance," I will readily admit as I have in the past that I was and still am very upset with the turnover of players when he started. I fully acknowledge that some, maybe even most of it, was due to factors other than him. But as I've posted, you will have a hard time convincing me that he didn't run off a number of players. That's not how it should be done at Holy Cross. That he wouldn't play Hart for even 30 seconds of a Senior Day game reinforces that belief that I have.
But where the rubber meets the road is that he is spectacularly unsuccessful. And, factually, he has the worst win/loss record in Holy Cross basketball history. And there's little evidence that the future will look any brighter with him as head coach.
Go, ahead, BBC, take your best shot now. I may see what you've written after Easter.
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Post by bringbackcaro on Feb 28, 2022 15:26:00 GMT -5
Would you please stop the nonsense about the Nelson Southern accent? Accusing others of bigotry is just so disgusting, and all too often an indication that one has no good arguments to offer. No one cares how Brett Nelson got connected to this job --we just care about whether he is the right coach for Holy Cross. I was responding to a post that literally accused Nelson of being "insincere" when talking about HC basketball history in his introductory press conference. This accusation was made based strictly off the way he was talking during his press conference.
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Post by Crucis#1 on Feb 28, 2022 16:18:46 GMT -5
No one cares about his speech or dialect.
He could mumble in his conversations like Marlon Brando as Don Corleone in the God Father as long as the team was winning 70% of the games played, and the team consistently put the ball in the basket at crucial times in the game. So far we have seen neither.
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Post by timholycross on Feb 28, 2022 16:32:33 GMT -5
Would you please stop the nonsense about the Nelson Southern accent? Accusing others of bigotry is just so disgusting, and all too often an indication that one has no good arguments to offer. No one cares how Brett Nelson got connected to this job --we just care about whether he is the right coach for Holy Cross. WVa isn't even in the south, is it? Hillbilly bashing, perhaps? Quite honestly, have never heard the man say a word. Not sure if I heard Bill C say any during his tenure at HC (plenty before that).
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Post by trimster on Feb 28, 2022 16:34:53 GMT -5
I could care less about how CBN speaks and fwiw, I don't hear the Southern accent thing. I do care about the product on the floor and how his players represent the college. The latter seems exemplary, the former not so good. I hope the Crusaders finish strong.
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Post by Sons of Vaval on Feb 28, 2022 16:45:00 GMT -5
Are Nelson's players not wearing hats in academic buildings and earbuds in class?
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Post by rgs318 on Feb 28, 2022 16:54:32 GMT -5
Would you please stop the nonsense about the Nelson Southern accent? Accusing others of bigotry is just so disgusting, and all too often an indication that one has no good arguments to offer. No one cares how Brett Nelson got connected to this job --we just care about whether he is the right coach for Holy Cross. WVa isn't even in the south, is it? Hillbilly bashing, perhaps? Quite honestly, have never heard the man say a word. Not sure if I heard Bill C say any during his tenure at HC (plenty before that). Originally part of Virginia (Southern), it was split off during the Civil War because WVa was loyal to the Union (Northern). History is seldom simple.
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