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Post by Sons of Vaval on Feb 4, 2023 16:18:44 GMT -5
Nelson defended Deaver straight up the entire game. Unconscionable.
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Post by hchoops on Feb 4, 2023 16:45:53 GMT -5
Though Kenney was in some foul trouble, as the only other big, he should have played more than 13 minutes.
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Post by trimster on Feb 4, 2023 16:55:48 GMT -5
Nelson defended Deaver straight up the entire game. Unconscionable. I know Navy is a very good shooting team but why no double teams in the post like we have seen lately. Especially after the first 15 points Deaver scored.
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Post by newfieguy74 on Feb 4, 2023 17:22:04 GMT -5
In a game we really needed to have to give ourselves a chance at the top half of the league, we lay an egg. All the elements were there for a loss. HC basically played 6 guys, and they looked gassed in the second half. You can't win many D1 games without a center. Gates does his best but he's too short. HC didn't shoot well, didn't rebound well (but not for lack of trying), and at times didn't defend well. It was almost funny to see fifteen dressed Navy players to HC's eight or nine.
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Post by efg72 on Feb 4, 2023 17:24:09 GMT -5
Deaver grew up 2 miles from here/me and tried to get recruited by us/others in the PL/IL
We need a player with his body and rebounding ability-
Future recruiting needs to be more strategic to build a roster
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Post by timholycross on Feb 4, 2023 17:30:52 GMT -5
They played 8 guys until it was garbage time and the 6-7-8 guys totaled 16 minutes. 4 starters played over 30, one played 27.
I'd have to say they broke our will more than they outmanned us. And out-heighted us of course.
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Post by Sons of Vaval on Feb 4, 2023 17:32:05 GMT -5
Outrebounded 46-28. Yikes.
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Post by timholycross on Feb 4, 2023 17:40:59 GMT -5
15-19 from the charity stripe, 79%.
Game would have gotten uglier faster if HC gave its usual free throw shooting performance.
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Post by DiMarz on Feb 4, 2023 17:59:03 GMT -5
Nelson defended Deaver straight up the entire game. Unconscionable. My guess is he decided 2 point field goals are better than 3 pointers....Double down and Navy would have been shooting open 3's all afternoon...Navy is a good team, they space the floor very well and are very physical...Their PG is very good, he is a very intelligent player. They are ranked 123 spots higher than HC.. It appeared to me, HC ran out of gas..Gates didn't have a very good game, and Navy took away Batch. Bo and Joe have to be able to step up..Bo had a few minutes where he took over, he needs to be be more assertive..Navy did a good job overall, they had scouted HC very well and took away what HC wanted to do.. One play Caleb got the ball in the low post, and a Navy assistant jumped up and was calling out, "Take away his left!"
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Post by Sons of Vaval on Feb 4, 2023 18:11:17 GMT -5
If the Navy assistant didn’t know Caleb is a lefty, he wouldn’t be qualified to coach JV high school basketball.
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Post by hchoops on Feb 4, 2023 18:21:30 GMT -5
Nelson defended Deaver straight up the entire game. Unconscionable. My guess is he decided 2 point field goals are better than 3 pointers....Double down and Navy would have been shooting open 3's all afternoon.. I understand what Nelson’s probable strategy was,. But, once Navy was not shooting well from the three, 4-15 for the game, and Gates could not stop Deaver alone, we should have tried to double him to force him to give it up. You cannot presume they would have made threes, especially when they had not shot them well all game.
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Post by alum on Feb 4, 2023 18:26:33 GMT -5
If the Navy assistant didn’t know Caleb is a lefty, he wouldn’t be qualified to coach JV high school basketball. Caleb gave up an easy righty layup to go to his left hand and miss during the second half. That’s a pretty big problem too.
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Post by sader1970 on Feb 4, 2023 18:35:13 GMT -5
Haven't seen the game, even ion tape yet, but probably won't bother. Prior game, I wrote:
According to the box score, Batch was 3/9 from 3 (not horrible but a far cry from the prior game). Octave 2/3 from 3. Excellent but not enough shots.
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Post by sader81 on Feb 4, 2023 19:13:28 GMT -5
Kids played hard but ran out of gas. Not Gates’ best offensive game. Hard to play with only 6 guys. Hard to blame BN for all of this, but he’s captain of the ship (pun intended!)
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Post by efg72 on Feb 4, 2023 19:24:17 GMT -5
The ship is under water
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Post by Sons of Vaval on Feb 4, 2023 19:28:48 GMT -5
Hard to play with only 6 guys. Which Nelson is to blame. Zero depth. Entered the season with 12 scholarship kids and then two quit.
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Post by sader1970 on Feb 4, 2023 19:30:43 GMT -5
Maybe BN can't be "blamed for all of this" but, as you said, he's "captain of this ship" and he picked the crew. No blaming Carmody anymore, which was always specious. (In fairness, I never heard Brett say that)
Lack of accountability always bothers me. It was Covid. It was Carmody's non-D1 quality players. It was the transfer portal. It was the Administration. It was guys who got injured . . . sick . . . quit. At what point is it the coach's fault? Ever? Four years of the worst Crusader basketball in history. "You are what your record says you are" (even playing non D-1 schools).
Don't worry. Lent is almost here.
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Post by efg72 on Feb 4, 2023 19:32:32 GMT -5
This should not be a question of blame but an assessment of where we are today and can we make it better with a change or not
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Post by DiMarz on Feb 4, 2023 19:32:55 GMT -5
My guess is he decided 2 point field goals are better than 3 pointers....Double down and Navy would have been shooting open 3's all afternoon.. I understand what Nelson’s probable strategy was,. But, once Navy was not shooting well from the three, 4-15 for the game, and Gates could not stop Deaver alone, we should have tried to double him to force him to give it up. You cannot presume they would have made threes, especially when they had not shot them well all game. Maybe that 4-15 was a result of HC defending the 3...Gates has done a very good job on opposing bigs this season...not so much today..
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Post by efg72 on Feb 4, 2023 19:38:47 GMT -5
No other size or depth on the roster We can’t afford to have him on the bench He is a warrior
This is more about the roster and possibly not recruiting Holy Cross kids but the best available athlete/player
That is a program issue of losing games, more than it is a basketball stafflosing recruiting battles
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Post by classof83 on Feb 4, 2023 19:47:51 GMT -5
We really need a big man - Coulibaly and Rabinovich are listed as a Juniors - and both have hardly played - how much eligibility do they both have left?
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Post by crosspride on Feb 4, 2023 19:48:50 GMT -5
Maybe BN can't be "blamed for all of this" but, as you said, he's "captain of this ship" and he picked the crew. No blaming Carmody anymore, which was always specious. (In fairness, I never heard Brett say that) Lack of accountability always bothers me. It was Covid. It was Carmody's non-D1 quality players. It was the transfer portal. It was the Administration. It was guys who got injured . . . sick . . . quit. At what point is it the coach's fault? Ever? Four years of the worst Crusader basketball in history. "You are what your record says you are" (even playing non D-1 schools). Don't worry. Lent is almost here. 90% of this board say it’s the coaches fault? Do you really not see all the posts saying exactly that? SoV himself has posted that exact sentiment thousands of times (not an exaggeration). “You are what your record says you are” is why Holy Cross basketball will be terrible for another 15 years. Must just be a coincidence that Nelson is the 4th coach in a row where it’s all their fault? Eventually you have to stop shoving the coach out the door before his first recruits are seniors if you want to get out of this death spiral that is Holy cross basketball since 2008.
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Post by efg72 on Feb 4, 2023 20:06:16 GMT -5
How many of his freshman recruits have graduated or still in the program
Portal created major problems, but it treats all schools equally if there is a reason or desire to transfer
make your own assessments
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Post by Sons of Vaval on Feb 4, 2023 20:06:46 GMT -5
It’s possible HC has just hired a series of really bad to average coaches since 2009 - Kearney, Brown, Carmody, Nelson.
Milan got five years. Ample time. Hindsight is 20/20 and maybe he’d actually have begun to find success in years six and seven. I don’t think anyone was clamoring for a sixth year. His first recruits had graduated by the time he left.
Carmody would have gotten a fifth season. He retired. For the best. The program was in disarray with some of the kids he brought in, many of whom didn’t graduate.
We’ve had three bad athletic directors who have made a series of bad basketball hires. Besides Kearney, you absolutely cannot say that any of these other three guys weren’t given a fair shake.
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Post by sader1970 on Feb 4, 2023 20:22:10 GMT -5
Paraphrasing myself, Lent can't come soon enough so I can ignore this board while I'm on hiatus.
Not sure what your point is but my initial take is that you might feel that I am simply regurgitating what others have said. And that might be a fair assessment. Consider putting me on your "ignore" list.
Here's a theory that might be relevant: "Those who can do, those who can't teach" is an old saying.
Now, some might disagree with it and, that's fine on a message board, but probably the best player who has coached at Holy Cross in multiple decades is Brett Nelson. He's turned out to be the worst coach - by far.
While all of our recent coaches played the game, Carmody was no where near the player Nelson was and was a better coach. Milan Brown was probably better than Carmody as a player but nothing compared to Nelson, but he, too, was a better coach. While his classmates here will probably argue against this, I only saw Ralph play one season and he was, IMHO, an average player. Certainly not of the quality of Nelson. Ralph was, by far, the best coach we've had maybe since NIT/NCAA champion days outside of Blaney but Ralph's record was better.
Kearney, don't know his playing background but he may be the exception to the rule and his tenure was short but complicated.
When a team loses for 4 consecutive years, it's the coach. Now, feel free to blame the ADs who hired him/them but we can't get rid of them because they are already gone. Brett happens to be a square peg in a round hole.
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