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Post by Crucis#1 on Jul 2, 2022 15:39:05 GMT -5
Since HC football will play two NEC schools during the season, with a possibility of a third depending on post season seeding, here is a view and a critique of NEC Stadiums.
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Post by bfoley82 on Jul 2, 2022 15:58:40 GMT -5
Since HC football will play two NEC schools during the season, with a possibility of a third depending on post season seeding, here is a view and a critique of NEC Stadiums. Last year I saw a guy at CCSU puke all over the camera equipment bag of the Columbia staff. Security is very laxed down there. FYI, Holy Cross only plays ONE NEC school this year in Merrimack. Bryant is in the Big South. |
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Post by longsuffering on Jul 2, 2022 16:05:04 GMT -5
I love this stadium tour series. These stadiums are modest in size but extremely sensible and the way the host uses Google earth to portray them, very attractive. They look low maintenence and well kept with many offering some chair back seats and even a few non luxurious luxury suites.
HC has a bargain in Fitton Field because it's paid for and Polar Park because somebody else is paying for it. But these baby stadiums are very efficient and appropriate for FCS.
If any school outgrows their phone booth of a stadium they can expand from strength which is better than paying to build a white elephant and then not needing it.
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Post by bfoley82 on Jul 2, 2022 16:13:43 GMT -5
I love this stadium tour series. These stadiums are modest in size but extremely sensible and the way the host uses Google earth to portray them, very attractive. They look low maintenence and well kept with many offering some chair back seats and even a few non luxurious luxury suites. HC has a bargain in Fitton Field because it's paid for and Polar Park because somebody else is paying for it. But these baby stadiums are very efficient and appropriate for FCS. If any school outgrows their phone booth of a stadium they can expand from strength which is better than paying to build a white elephant and then not needing it. I would expect Bryant to close in their stadium and make it a horseshoe in the next 10-15 years. |
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Post by Crucis#1 on Jul 3, 2022 10:07:31 GMT -5
Since HC football will play two NEC schools during the season, with a possibility of a third depending on post season seeding, here is a view and a critique of NEC Stadiums. Last year I saw a guy at CCSU puke all over the camera equipment bag of the Columbia staff. Security is very laxed down there. FYI, Holy Cross only plays ONE NEC school this year in Merrimack. Bryant is in the Big South. |
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Post by Crucis#1 on Jul 3, 2022 10:15:18 GMT -5
With the musical chairs that is now being played, it seems it is a year by year realignment within each conference. I forgot that Bryant is now in the Big South For Football, and the America East for Basketball.
The change must have occurred after this stadium review package was created, as it was one of the most recent in the series released regarding football stadiums.
It seems that only the Patriot and Ivy Leagues are the only ones that is status quo regarding membership. There is something to said regarding stability. Others would say stagnation..
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Post by longsuffering on Jul 3, 2022 10:52:52 GMT -5
Adam Sandler would say stagnation because he likes those "ion" words but I say stability because I like the schools in PL FB right now. Three out of seven are Jesuit and the other four are all fine Institutions.
Regarding competitiveness, other than GU, they are all a Chesney, Carter or Duffner away from challenging for the FCS top 25. Can't imagine they all aren't trying for that with each head coach they hire.
And I value five OOC games more than what adding a Bryant, Merrimack or Stonehill to the league would achieve.
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Post by nycrusader2010 on Jul 3, 2022 11:05:16 GMT -5
With the musical chairs that is now being played, it seems it is a year by year realignment within each conference. I forgot that Bryant is now in the Big South For Football, and the America East for Basketball. The change must have occurred after this stadium review package was created, as it was one of the most recent in the series released regarding football stadiums. It seems that only the Patriot and Ivy Leagues are the only ones that is status quo regarding membership. There is something to said regarding stability. Others would say stagnation.. Tough to call the Ivy "stagnant" since the perceived eliteness of their academic brand is directly tied to the name of the athletic conference their teams play in. Not so much for the PL. Adding Bryant as a football affiliate wouldn't devalue the academic reputation of any of the member schools but we'dall get the benefit of playing in a stronger conference. So I would conclude that the PL exhibits BOTH stability and stagnation. |
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Post by longsuffering on Jul 3, 2022 11:16:19 GMT -5
You have a future in politics.🙂 A stronger league might mean fewer playoff seasons, but I see the point that Bryant has made more progress in FB since joining D-1 than some of our current PL members who have been D-1 for eons. How would Bryant maintain that progress with the restrictions of the AI?
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Post by matunuck on Jul 3, 2022 11:29:52 GMT -5
The most important thing for HC football is maintaining an appealing non-PL schedule. It is what it is but I’m far more interested in those games than ones against our PL foes.
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Post by nycrusader2010 on Jul 3, 2022 12:01:24 GMT -5
You have a future in politics.🙂 A stronger league might mean fewer playoff seasons, but I see the point that Bryant has made more progress in FB since joining D-1 than some of our current PL members who have been D-1 for eons. How would Bryant maintain that progress with the restrictions of the AI? Depends on how much deviation there is between acceptance standards for general student population versus those for student athletes in high visibility sports. If the mid SAT range at Bryant is say 1100 - 1300, but they are accepting football players who barely scrape by NCAA Clearinghouse standards, then they'll have a problem with the AI. If the majority of the football team is within the ballpark of the bottom of that SAT range then they'll be fine. |
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Post by mm67 on Jul 3, 2022 13:36:44 GMT -5
Lehigh, Lafayette, Bucknell were traditionally College Division/ DivII. Post War FU moved from Club Status to Div.III up to FCS/Div. I. GU had been Club before FCS/DivI. Colgate & HC were the only University/DivI programs to move into the Colonial/PL.|
I was surprised. At that time I thought - LU, LC, BU, FU, GU did not cut it. I did not like playing these schools. Who cared about Bucknell. But, the handwriting was on the wall. I was most definitely wrong. Today, I care about playing Bucknell & all the rest.
And, outside the league we played many of the same schools as we had in the past. This did provide some solace. The Colonial/PL was a good landing place.
It turned out to be a wise move.
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Post by DFW HOYA on Jul 3, 2022 13:49:16 GMT -5
Lehigh, Lafayette, Bucknell were traditionally College Division/ DivII. Post War FU moved from Club Status to Div.III up to FCS/Div. I. GU had been Club before FCS/DivI. Colgate & HC were the only University/DivI programs to move into the Colonial/PL. Georgetown and Fordham followed the same path: D-I, dropped in the 1950s, club in the 1960s, D-II (1970-72), D-III, I-AA. Fordham entered I-AA in 1989, Georgetown in 1993. |
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Post by bfoley82 on Jul 3, 2022 13:51:01 GMT -5
With the musical chairs that is now being played, it seems it is a year by year realignment within each conference. I forgot that Bryant is now in the Big South For Football, and the America East for Basketball. The change must have occurred after this stadium review package was created, as it was one of the most recent in the series released regarding football stadiums. It seems that only the Patriot and Ivy Leagues are the only ones that is status quo regarding membership. There is something to said regarding stability. Others would say stagnation.. It is funny they got Stonehill right but not Bryant. |
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Post by mm67 on Jul 3, 2022 14:01:26 GMT -5
Lehigh, Lafayette, Bucknell were traditionally College Division/ DivII. Post War FU moved from Club Status to Div.III up to FCS/Div. I. GU had been Club before FCS/DivI. Colgate & HC were the only University/DivI programs to move into the Colonial/PL. Georgetown and Fordham followed the same path: D-I, dropped in the 1950s, club in the 1960s, D-II (1970-72), D-III, I-AA. Fordham entered I-AA in 1989, Georgetown in 1993. Actually I attended a number of FU home games at the Polo Grounds in the '50's. They were terrible. The Colonial/PL was formed prior to the entry into DivI-AA by these schools. Extremely happy that both joined the PL. Want to see GU field some kick-butt teams. Have some pleasant memories of time spent in the1789(?) |
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Post by timholycross on Jul 3, 2022 16:26:58 GMT -5
Wagner wins because of the view. Remember the TV camera kept showing the Verrazano Bridge backdrop during our game there a few years ago.
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Jul 3, 2022 17:19:11 GMT -5
Wagner wins because of the view. Remember the TV camera kept showing the Verrazano Bridge backdrop during our game there a few years ago. I started to like Wagner after we played them because of an unusual incident. Some will recall that one of our players got hurt in the game at Wagner and was hospitalized in New York. The Wagner coach visited him the next day and brought a pizza.. That's a very classy move in my opinion. |
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Post by timholycross on Jul 3, 2022 18:21:14 GMT -5
One of several Tom Gilmore games that fell into the Casey Stengel "ways to lose I never knew existed" category. (qb keeper trying for a first down late in the game; gets the yardage, doesn't give himself up, gets popped, coughs it up, run back 60 plus yards to set up the gw field goal).
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Post by princetoncrusader on Jul 3, 2022 20:25:44 GMT -5
"Snatching defeat from the jaws of victory" is another apt description of that game, which I saw in person. Wagner's D3-like stadium does indeed have an amazing view. As I recall, it was not the starting QB who coughed up the ball after a hit but a rarely used reserve. It bounced just right and a Wagner defensive back scooped it up and ran about 60 yards before being caught by an HC wide receiver. In comes Wagner's 25-year old QB (a veteran of minor league baseball), who I think threw a TD pass.
I remember TG after the game graciously shaking hands with Wagner's coach. That must have been a long ride back to Worcester.
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Post by nycrusader2010 on Jul 5, 2022 12:26:05 GMT -5
One of several Tom Gilmore games that fell into the Casey Stengel "ways to lose I never knew existed" category. (qb keeper trying for a first down late in the game; gets the yardage, doesn't give himself up, gets popped, coughs it up, run back 60 plus yards to set up the gw field goal). Pre cursor to the Albany game 2 years later. |
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Post by nycrusader2010 on Jul 5, 2022 12:29:41 GMT -5
"Snatching defeat from the jaws of victory" is another apt description of that game, which I saw in person. Wagner's D3-like stadium does indeed have an amazing view. As I recall, it was not the starting QB who coughed up the ball after a hit but a rarely used reserve. It bounced just right and a Wagner defensive back scooped it up and ran about 60 yards before being caught by an HC wide receiver. In comes Wagner's 25-year old QB (a veteran of minor league baseball), who I think threw a TD pass. I remember TG after the game graciously shaking hands with Wagner's coach. That must have been a long ride back to Worcester. The QB may have been Ryan Laughlin who I believe was a frosh or soph that year. The oft-injured 5th year senior Kevin Watson would've entered the 2012 season as the starter. I think Mark Tolzien had graduated already as he was the rare backup QB who also doubled as a co-captain in 2011. There was another QB in same class as Loughlin who got PT early in his career -- can't remember his name. He could've also been the guy who fumbled at Wagner. Pujals entered the scene the following fall in 2013. |
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Post by timholycross on Jul 5, 2022 12:56:43 GMT -5
From the play by play
2nd & 6 at WAG 21
(2:06 - 4th) Timeout WAGNER, clock 02:06. (their second)
2nd & 6 at WAG 21
(0:55 - 4th) Steven Elder rush, fumbled, forced by Theodore Clohessy, recovered by Wagn Jarrett Dieudonne at the Wagn 10, Jarrett Dieudonne for 66 yards, to the HCrss 34, tackled by Gerald Mistretta out-of-bounds, WAGNER penalty 10 yard holding accepted.
.....so it would have been first down at the 12 or 13 yard line, up 6, w/under 2 min to go. Wagner had one time out left, which I'm pretty sure means "game over". Oh, the humanity!
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Post by nycrusader2010 on Jul 5, 2022 17:11:31 GMT -5
From the play by play 2nd & 6 at WAG 21 (2:06 - 4th) Timeout WAGNER, clock 02:06. (their second) 2nd & 6 at WAG 21 (0:55 - 4th) Steven Elder rush, fumbled, forced by Theodore Clohessy, recovered by Wagn Jarrett Dieudonne at the Wagn 10, Jarrett Dieudonne for 66 yards, to the HCrss 34, tackled by Gerald Mistretta out-of-bounds, WAGNER penalty 10 yard holding accepted. .....so it would have been first down at the 12 or 13 yard line, up 6, w/under 2 min to go. Wagner had one time out left, which I'm pretty sure means "game over". Oh, the humanity! Elder, that's the other QB I was thinking of -- classmate of Laughlin. Those two got a decent amount of playing time that year (2012) as Watson battled injuries and in the beginning of 2013 until freshman Peter Pujals overtook both of them for the starting job. Both Elder and Laughlin wound up on the bench for 2013 and 2014 with Laughlin ending his career on a nice note by throwing a TD pass on the last snap of his senior season against Georgetown (in a loss IIRC). |
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Post by jkh67 on Jul 5, 2022 20:09:34 GMT -5
With the musical chairs that is now being played, it seems it is a year by year realignment within each conference. I forgot that Bryant is now in the Big South For Football, and the America East for Basketball. The change must have occurred after this stadium review package was created, as it was one of the most recent in the series released regarding football stadiums. It seems that only the Patriot and Ivy Leagues are the only ones that is status quo regarding membership. There is something to said regarding stability. Others would say stagnation.. As for stability as opposed to stagnation, you've got first to decide what the role of football -- men's basketball, for that matter -- should be in the school's external athletic strategy (i.e., as opposed to HC's apparent commitment to providing as many opportunities as possible for students to play other NCAA varsity sports). I start from a certain point of view. To wit, that, starting in the early 20th century, a small college in Worcester has had a phenomenal historical track record in football and basketball that no school in New England...save only Harvard, Yale, Dartmouth, and BC...can even hope to touch. Fitton Field is the physical embodiment of this tradition. It's certainly not the most up to date venue that we might hope it could be, but it is the fourth oldest Division-1 stadium in the land and outdistances most north-eastern football FCS "stadia" by orders of magnitude in seating capacity (excepting only HYP and Penn). I won't even get into the many, many historically significant games that have been played on its grass for more than a century. To me, that pedigree is key. Our combination of the PL, featuring smaller, high academic quality schools like HC, coupled with two or three games every year against the Ivies is as good as it's likely ever to get. We're showing now that we can be nationally successful with that schedule under Coach Chesney (as we were in the '80s and '90s under Carter and Duffner). The PL...just like the Ivies...was always more than the playing field...or basketball court...alone. It was a banding together of like-minded superior academic institutions. HC is moving the PL needle in football and I believe we will do so in basketball in time. Let's not dilute the brand by aligning athletically with schools that bring nothing to the party and will only dilute the brand that we should be happy to enjoy. If not entertaining membership applications from schools in other conferences like the NEC means we're stagnating, I'm happy to stagnate, looking at the greater scheme of things. |
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Post by longsuffering on Jul 5, 2022 21:10:44 GMT -5
With the musical chairs that is now being played, it seems it is a year by year realignment within each conference. I forgot that Bryant is now in the Big South For Football, and the America East for Basketball. The change must have occurred after this stadium review package was created, as it was one of the most recent in the series released regarding football stadiums. It seems that only the Patriot and Ivy Leagues are the only ones that is status quo regarding membership. There is something to said regarding stability. Others would say stagnation.. As for stability as opposed to stagnation, you've got first to decide what the role of football -- men's basketball, for that matter -- should be in the school's external athletic strategy (i.e., as opposed to HC's apparent commitment to providing as many opportunities as possible for students to play other NCAA varsity sports). I start from a certain point of view. To wit, that, starting in the early 20th century, a small college in Worcester has had a phenomenal historical track record in football and basketball that no school in New England...save only Harvard, Yale, Dartmouth, and BC...can even hope to touch. Fitton Field is the physical embodiment of this tradition. It's certainly not the most up to date venue that we might hope it could be, but it is the fourth oldest Division-1 stadium in the land and outdistances most north-eastern football FCS "stadia" by orders of magnitude in seating capacity (excepting only HYP and Penn). I won't even get into the many, many historically significant games that have been played on its grass for more than a century. To me, that pedigree is key. Our combination of the PL, featuring smaller, high academic quality schools like HC, coupled with two or three games every year against the Ivies is as good as it's likely ever to get. We're showing now that we can be nationally successful with that schedule under Coach Chesney (as we were in the '80s and '90s under Carter and Duffner). The PL...just like the Ivies...was always more than the playing field...or basketball court...alone. It was a banding together of like-minded superior academic institutions. HC is moving the PL needle in football and I believe we will do so in basketball in time. Let's not dilute the brand by aligning athletically with schools that bring nothing to the party and will only dilute the brand that we should be happy to enjoy. If not entertaining membership applications from schools in other conferences like the NEC means we're stagnating, I'm happy to stagnate, looking at the greater scheme of things. Bryant as an example is a fine institution. But since we joined the PL as a charter member they have been in the NE-10, the NEC and the Big South. They are still finding themselves and we have found ourself. We can play them often in multiple sports, celebrate the proximity, perhaps award a Blackstone Valley Cup to the school with the best head to head record each year, but let them find their own conference. |
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