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Post by trimster on Feb 17, 2023 12:56:17 GMT -5
I believe the NCAA allowed schools to exceed scholarship limits to accomodate Covid 5th year players the first year. I thought it was a one time exception and going forward, schools were going to have to work the 5th year players into their normal scholarship allotment until the Covid year players were done. In HC's case, I am guessing many of the fifth year players are taking this semester off and returning in the fall. Are the funds that normally would be used for the Spring semester paying for the Fall semester? Otherwise, I don't see how HC could be carrying these kids under the 60 schollie limit. Also, is the max roster of 90 players still in effect?
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Post by dharry13 on Feb 17, 2023 13:17:59 GMT -5
Max roster is not 90 right now. Honestly I’m not sure what it is. Last year 96. Now they have 106 on roster - including incoming Frosh.
Granted it might be a few less of kids don’t come back for Fall. But it appears to be 106 right now. I have no info on what the roster limit is.
Still 60 scholarships.
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Post by hcpride on Feb 17, 2023 14:03:38 GMT -5
One of the well-informed posters on another thread noted that the 5-th years are enrolled right now (spring semester). It is a smaller group than last year FWIW.
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Post by hc6774 on Feb 17, 2023 14:42:56 GMT -5
Max roster is not 90 right now. Honestly I’m not sure what it is. Last year 96. Now they have 106 on roster - including incoming Frosh. Granted it might be a few less of kids don’t come back for Fall. But it appears to be 106 right now. I have no info on what the roster limit is. Still 60 scholarships. based on the above numbers my understanding... NCAA provided a 5th year of eligibility to Covid classes. & that the 5th years don't count against the scholarship limit? so each school can decide whether or not to exceed the scholarship limit with 5th yr Covid players. |
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Post by CHC8485 on Feb 17, 2023 15:41:11 GMT -5
Max roster is not 90 right now. Honestly I’m not sure what it is. Last year 96. Now they have 106 on roster - including incoming Frosh. Granted it might be a few less of kids don’t come back for Fall. But it appears to be 106 right now. I have no info on what the roster limit is. Still 60 scholarships. So I went to the PL Policy and Procedure Manual Good News. Football Specific Section 15.6.a.8.b And further in Article 7 of the Operational Bylaws ( patriotleague.org/sports/2017/9/20/GEN_01202220.aspx ) 7.6.c.2 Did not find anything on non-medical redshirting. |
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Feb 17, 2023 17:09:23 GMT -5
^^^ So 63 full equivalents, up to 85 receiving any amount of fin aid, and no upper bound on roster size. And the NCAA did not increase the caps on the number of scollies that may be awarded because of COVID.
A question that I still have is whether a fourth year or fifth year with a full scollie who then matriculates for only one semester in his senior year and again in his fifth year is counted as a half scollie in each year. The same question would apply to someone who, for example, has a half scollie. As they are not matriculating for a full year, is that half scollie become a quarter scollie?
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Post by gks on Feb 17, 2023 17:31:42 GMT -5
Max roster is not 90 right now. Honestly I’m not sure what it is. Last year 96. Now they have 106 on roster - including incoming Frosh. Granted it might be a few less of kids don’t come back for Fall. But it appears to be 106 right now. I have no info on what the roster limit is. Still 60 scholarships. So I went to the PL Policy and Procedure Manual Good News. Football Specific Section 15.6.a.8.b And further in Article 7 of the Operational Bylaws ( patriotleague.org/sports/2017/9/20/GEN_01202220.aspx ) 7.6.c.2 Did not find anything on non-medical redshirting. Great news. Finally steps being taken to get rid of some of the ridiculous, self-imposed restrictions. Those three scholarships will go a long way. |
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Post by efg72 on Feb 17, 2023 17:37:53 GMT -5
5th year not addressed?
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Post by efg72 on Feb 17, 2023 17:38:56 GMT -5
I believe that will be a deal breaker, as it should be, if not resolved soon.
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Post by efg72 on Feb 17, 2023 17:45:20 GMT -5
Do you do all you can to keep Chesney, and leave the PL to do so, or is the PL the Holy Grail?
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Post by trimster on Feb 17, 2023 17:55:55 GMT -5
So an FCS program that allows for non-medical redshirting has to juggle an extra class, maybe a half-class, into its allotment of 63 full schollies or the 85 equivalents?
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Post by hcpride on Feb 17, 2023 18:00:56 GMT -5
So an FCS program that allows for non-medical redshirting has to juggle an extra class, maybe a half-class, into its allotment of 63 full schollies or the 85 equivalents? Don't know about juggling as it is routine operations for most FCS schools. We’ve successfully done it the last few years and already had that core competency given our medical redshirt program. |
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Post by efg72 on Feb 17, 2023 18:37:10 GMT -5
If my call, ….Auf Widersehn or Au Revoir to the P L
i do all I can to keep Chesney and hope alive
Take your pick on the expression
A winner vs at best a non existent partner
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Post by longsuffering on Feb 17, 2023 20:33:54 GMT -5
Great news. Finally steps being taken to get rid of some of the ridiculous, self-imposed restrictions. Those three scholarships will go a long way. Kind of amazing that this passed in December and HC hasn’t made a big deal about it given how fans have been so down on these league handcuffs. Perhaps they are planning to tie the expanded scholarships to a fundraising request to pay for them. |
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Feb 17, 2023 20:50:12 GMT -5
I’ll bet that few HC fans outside of the forum have any understanding of the scholarship guidelines (60 vs 63 and 85 players) and roster limits
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Post by longsuffering on Feb 17, 2023 21:06:21 GMT -5
Do you do all you can to keep Chesney, and leave the PL to do so, or is the PL the Holy Grail? Coach Chesney may be a supporter of Holy Cross in the Patriot League. After four straight league championships, two straight FBS wins, two straight seasons with an NCAA win, an upcoming season with the two best FBS opponents imaginable, regular games vs the Ivy League's most highly regarded institutions, he has something to sell every recruit and family. Is a recruit/family impressed with playing and winning FBS games? Got it. Are they impressed with prestigious schools like Harvard and Yale that all their relatives recognize, on the schedule? Got it. Do they want to play North Carolina A&T of the CAA? Don't got it. Do they want to play meaningful league games at home against an ancient Jesuit rival in front of 17,000? Got it. Or do they prefer to tailgate on the alcohol free campus of Baptist Campbell University of the the CAA, again in North Carolina? Don't got it. I wonder if people close to Coach and the program know if Chesney considers Patriot League Football a part of "You can have it all at Holy Cross," or if he is pining to jump leagues? |
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Post by alum on Feb 17, 2023 21:18:47 GMT -5
Max roster is not 90 right now. Honestly I’m not sure what it is. Last year 96. Now they have 106 on roster - including incoming Frosh. Granted it might be a few less of kids don’t come back for Fall. But it appears to be 106 right now. I have no info on what the roster limit is. Still 60 scholarships. So I went to the PL Policy and Procedure Manual Good News. Football Specific Section 15.6.a.8.b And further in Article 7 of the Operational Bylaws ( patriotleague.org/sports/2017/9/20/GEN_01202220.aspx ) 7.6.c.2 Did not find anything on non-medical redshirting. Someone is looking at primary source materials!😀 |
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Post by efg72 on Feb 17, 2023 21:21:48 GMT -5
Do you do all you can to keep Chesney, and leave the PL to do so, or is the PL the Holy Grail? Coach Chesney may be a supporter of Holy Cross in the Patriot League. After four straight league championships, two straight FBS wins, two straight seasons with an NCAA win, an upcoming season with the two best FBS opponents imaginable, regular games vs the Ivy League's most highly regarded institutions, he has something to sell every recruit and family. Is a recruit/family impressed with playing and winning FBS games? Got it. Are they impressed with prestigious schools like Harvard and Yale that all their relatives recognize, on the schedule? Got it. Do they want to play North Carolina A&T of the CAA? Don't got it. Do they want to play meaningful league games at home against an ancient Jesuit rival in front of 17,000? Got it. Or do they prefer to tailgate on the alcohol free campus of Baptist Campbell University of the the CAA, again in North Carolina? Don't got it. I wonder if people close to Coach and the program know if Chesney considers Patriot League Football a part of "You can have it all at Holy Cross," or if he is pining to jump leagues? My point was if fifth year eligibility was critical to him do we support his wishes or stay in the league- clearly a hypotheticsl |
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Post by hcpride on Feb 17, 2023 21:53:52 GMT -5
My point was if fifth year eligibility was critical to him do we support his wishes or depart from the league- clearly a hypotheticsl While Chesney plainly stated 5th-years enabled us to compete at the highest level in the FCS he may be satisfied battling for Patriot League (the lowest level of FCS football) supremacy should 5th-years disappear. Ok, I’m kidding. |
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Post by longsuffering on Feb 18, 2023 0:26:38 GMT -5
Fifth year students at a four year school are probably never going to be as advantageous as at a university. If anyone can get a few non-medical fifth year players allowed in the PL it's Chesney, perhaps using his current stature and credibility networking with other head coaches and ADs to lobby the Presidents.
But that just puts HC at a disadvantage to other league schools such as Fordham and Georgetown. Holy Cross is on equal competitive footing with players like Matt Sluka who developed an extra year in prep school before arriving at Holy Cross.
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Post by hc6774 on Feb 18, 2023 7:36:23 GMT -5
Fifth year students at a four year school are probably never going to be as advantageous as at a university. If anyone can get a few non-medical fifth year players allowed in the PL it's Chesney, perhaps using his current stature and credibility networking with other head coaches and ADs to lobby the Presidents. But that just puts HC at a disadvantage to other league schools such as Fordham and Georgetown. Holy Cross is on equal competitive footing with players like Matt Sluka who developed an extra year in prep school before arriving at Holy Cross. agree that grad programs are advantage especially with the freedom to transfer for Covid, I believe IL waived undergrad restriction, has it been reinstated? Effective with the 2023-24 academic year, the League regulation limiting a football roster size to 90 student-athlete will be eliminated. This action allows each member institution
to manage the size of its roster according to its own culture and community. [Council, December 2022]. Does underlined suggest something beyond roster size? e.g. grad students; 5 th yr undergrads? |
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Post by CHC8485 on Feb 18, 2023 10:36:39 GMT -5
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Feb 18, 2023 19:54:29 GMT -5
I could drive a truck through that. Just be certain he doesn't get a degree prematurely, then he becomes a post-baccalaureate student-athlete, and I think one is looking at a graduate school program, or a 3-2 program.
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Post by longsuffering on Feb 19, 2023 0:16:57 GMT -5
If a PL coach can't find an exception that works he ain't trying.
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Post by hc6774 on Feb 19, 2023 8:50:18 GMT -5
I could drive a truck through that. Just be certain he doesn't get a degree prematurely, then he becomes a post-baccalaureate student-athlete, and I think one is looking at a graduate school program, or a 3-2 program. The 'Council. Dec'22' updates to the PL Policy/Procedure manual are specific to football. In the update that eliminates the 90 roster limit, the Council includes 'This action allows each member institution to manage the size of its roster according to its own culture and community.' Does this language modify, reinforce or not pertain to the PL manual's general waiver provisions above? |
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