|
Post by sader1970 on Aug 22, 2023 9:53:28 GMT -5
Yes, I realized that years ago and believe I posted this fact in the past. I didn't believe it was fair even when Tom Gilmore was coaching vs. Willard, Kearney, Brown, Carmody. Fully recognizing some people here detest TG, my point was the much larger area of responsibility over a basketball coach. Certainly Ralph deserved a big salary based on his success and experience. Kearney and Brown, not so much. Carmody got it based on experience and the flukey tournament championship that he could never leverage. Let me remind all that TG won a championship; played the eventual national champs Villanova to its closest game IIRC in the tournament; and finished second in the league at least twice. He was not the abject failure some here like to believe. He did not have some of the "advantages" that Bob Chesney has - a top of class Luth facility and an Admissions department that was "uncooperative" to say the least. Now, to be clear, Bob has done an outstanding job and I'm not postulating Tom would have had the outstanding success Bob has even if he had those advantages.
My point is, the football coach should be (and suspect now is) paid more than the basketball coach, all other things equal. And, yes, Holy Cross has been a "basketball school" more than a "football school" in the past. I'd like to think we could and can be both.
|
|
|
Post by alum on Aug 22, 2023 10:15:20 GMT -5
All of these accomplishments happen at Creighton with or without Blossom. What important hire has he had to make in his tenure at Creighton? Did MB steal your lunch money or push you off of a swing on the playground?
|
|
|
Post by Tom on Aug 22, 2023 11:03:42 GMT -5
Yes, I realized that years ago and believe I posted this fact in the past. I didn't believe it was fair even when Tom Gilmore was coaching vs. Willard, Kearney, Brown, Carmody. Fully recognizing some people here detest TG, my point was the much larger area of responsibility over a basketball coach. Certainly Ralph deserved a big salary based on his success and experience. Kearney and Brown, not so much. Carmody got it based on experience and the flukey tournament championship that he could never leverage. Let me remind all that TG won a championship; played the eventual national champs Villanova to its closest game IIRC in the tournament; and finished second in the league at least twice. He was not the abject failure some here like to believe. He did not have some of the "advantages" that Bob Chesney has - a top of class Luth facility and an Admissions department that was "uncooperative" to say the least. Now, to be clear, Bob has done an outstanding job and I'm not postulating Tom would have had the outstanding success Bob has even if he had those advantages. My point is, the football coach should be (and suspect now is) paid more than the basketball coach, all other things equal. And, yes, Holy Cross has been a "basketball school" more than a "football school" in the past. I'd like to think we could and can be both. One thing that might explain the basketball coach being paid more than the football coach is one "other thing" that is not equal. HC basketball competes at the highest level of college basketball. D-I FCS subdivision is not the highest level of college football
|
|
|
Post by Sons of Vaval on Aug 22, 2023 11:37:19 GMT -5
All of these accomplishments happen at Creighton with or without Blossom. What important hire has he had to make in his tenure at Creighton? Did MB steal your lunch money or push you off of a swing on the playground? No, just played a role in destroying our basketball program. Creighton’s WBB coach has been there 20+ years. Greg McDermott, their men’s coach, has been there for 13 years. Their volleyball coach has been there 20+ years. You or I could be the AD at Creighton and these accomplishments still happen. It’s fair to ask, given he royally failed in both making the most important hire at HC (MBB) and getting taken to the woodshed by Nelson and/or his agent with Nelson’s contract, what important hires he’s made at Creighton. Assistant social media manager doesn’t count.
|
|
|
Post by longsuffering on Aug 22, 2023 11:40:18 GMT -5
The PL in MBB and FB are at similar levels of overall D-1. BB has a taller ceiling but HC hasn't gotten closer to that ceiling than a step stool recently.
Pay Chesney, Magarity for results. Incentivize other coaches.
|
|
|
Post by alum on Aug 22, 2023 12:01:41 GMT -5
Did MB steal your lunch money or push you off of a swing on the playground? No, just played a role in destroying our basketball program. Creighton’s WBB coach has been there 20+ years. Greg McDermott, their men’s coach, has been there for 13 years. Their volleyball coach has been there 20+ years. You or I could be the AD at Creighton and these accomplishments still happen. It’s fair to ask, given he royally failed in both making the most important hire at HC (MBB) and getting taken to the woodshed by Nelson and/or his agent with Nelson’s contract, what important hires he’s made at Creighton. Assistant social media manager doesn’t count. Hiring is an important aspect of a job, but not the only one. Managers get credit when good things happen on their watch. The job pays what the market demands. From looking at VR's salary vis a vis the market, we should probably let Rich Patterson do all of the negotiating for the College.
|
|
|
Post by DFW HOYA on Aug 22, 2023 12:44:00 GMT -5
One thing that might explain the basketball coach being paid more than the football coach is one "other thing" that is not equal. HC basketball competes at the highest level of college basketball. D-I FCS subdivision is not the highest level of college football There's a certain degree of semantics to claim that Patriot League schools compete at the highest level of college basketball given its post-season record and a general lack of participation in the Associated Press Top 25. Were there a basketball subdivision, the PL would be in basketball's version of the FCS. The last appearance in the weekly AP Top 25, per school: American: None Army: One appearance, last in (pre-PL) December 1970 Boston U: None Bucknell: One appearance, last in February 2006 Colgate: None Holy Cross: 169 weeks all time, but last appearance (pre-PL) in January 1978 Lafayette: None Lehigh: None Loyola: None Navy: 27 weeks all time, but last appearance (pre-PL) in January 1987 Put another way, PL teams have combined for one Top 25 appearance since the league was formed for basketball. Could Holy Cross aspire further? It certainly could, but it seems preternaturally hesitant to seek the A-10 or other such conferences.
|
|
|
Post by Tom on Aug 22, 2023 14:02:22 GMT -5
One thing that might explain the basketball coach being paid more than the football coach is one "other thing" that is not equal. HC basketball competes at the highest level of college basketball. D-I FCS subdivision is not the highest level of college football There's a certain degree of semantics to claim that Patriot League schools compete at the highest level of college basketball given its post-season record and a general lack of participation in the Associated Press Top 25. Were there a basketball subdivision, the PL would be in basketball's version of the FCS. The last appearance in the weekly AP Top 25, per school: American: None Army: One appearance, last in (pre-PL) December 1970 Boston U: None Bucknell: One appearance, last in February 2006 Colgate: None Holy Cross: 169 weeks all time, but last appearance (pre-PL) in January 1978 Lafayette: None Lehigh: None Loyola: None Navy: 27 weeks all time, but last appearance (pre-PL) in January 1987 Put another way, PL teams have combined for one Top 25 appearance since the league was formed for basketball. Could Holy Cross aspire further? It certainly could, but it seems preternaturally hesitant to seek the A-10 or other such conferences. The PL might not be too successful, but the winner of the PL is in the same championship tournament as Duke, Kansas, UConn, etc. Might not be probable, but the possibility of a cinderella run exists. The PL is not in the same championship football tournament as Ohio ST and Alabama. No matter what HC does in the regular season, they will not be in the FBS bracket. You might argue that the PL is not competitive in the highest level of NCAA basketball, but that is definitely where they compete. One could make an argument that HC hasn't been competitive in the PL league lately, but that doesn't mean they're not in it. And, going back full circle, that could be a potential reason the basketball coach makes more than the football coach even though the football coach has to deal with more players.
|
|
|
Post by longsuffering on Aug 22, 2023 16:11:54 GMT -5
Agree with your reasoning as to one possible reason why BB pays more, but regarding FB, being in FCS and beating an FBS team somehow is sweeter than if we were in FBS. HC has the best of both worlds in FB right now.
Whoever scheduled the last four FBS teams, UConn, Buffalo, BC, Army is brilliant. The order of ascending difficulty was just right.
|
|
|
Post by sader1970 on Aug 22, 2023 16:25:46 GMT -5
Argue it any way you want but absolutely, positively Brett Nelson should never have been paid twice as much as Bob Chesney.
The former was grossly overpaid; the latter grossly underpaid.
|
|
|
Post by longsuffering on Aug 22, 2023 18:12:21 GMT -5
Argue it any way you want but absolutely, positively Brett Nelson should never have been paid twice as much as Bob Chesney. The former was grossly overpaid; the latter grossly underpaid. Do you think the FB and MBB head coaches are tied in salary now?
|
|
|
Post by sader1970 on Aug 22, 2023 20:41:07 GMT -5
I'll withhold my guess until 2 years from now when the 990 comes out.
|
|
|
Post by bfoley82 on Aug 22, 2023 21:43:33 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by Ignutz on Aug 31, 2023 19:46:09 GMT -5
This can be found here. projects.propublica.org/nonprofits/organizations/42103558/202341289349302159/fullThere is a list of the top salaries on page 7 and then a further breakdown of them about ten pages from the end. It contains a bit of interesting information, starting with the fact that we got VR on the cheap for $400,000 (not including retirement contributions) It would appear that he is not on the College's health insurance plan. Perhaps his wife's plan is a better deal. The $400,000 number includes $290,000 in salary and another $109,000 in other reportable compensation which I suppose could be the house that HC is providing to him. I will be interested in seeing if this goes up each year. BN's base salary was around $340,000 and it looks like he earned a $6800 bonus plus benefits. BC made $185,000 base plus a $40,000 bonus plus benefits. EDIT: The Supplemental Information reveals that the housing is included in the $109,000 other reportable compensation. Reading the info re: BN’s compensation, the first thing that came to mind was Indianapolis Colts coach, Jim Mora ………….. “Bonus?!? You’re talking about a bonus? I’m just hoping we can win a game!”
|
|
|
Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Sept 1, 2023 8:27:13 GMT -5
For FY 2016, median compensation for head coaches.
FCS Hoops $279K Football $267K Ice Hockey $253K (13 schools)
FBS, non-autonomy Hoops $1,035K Football $2,353K Ice hockey $553K
Div I, no football Hoops, $413K Ice hockey $412K (9 schools)
NCAA no longer publicly publishes this granular level of detail. IMO, too revealing.
|
|