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Post by timholycross on Sept 17, 2019 18:31:17 GMT -5
You know what would happen if D1 became one division? Why MORE bowl games, of course!
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Post by longsuffering on Sept 17, 2019 22:15:32 GMT -5
You know what would happen if D1 became one division? Why MORE bowl games, of course! We'd be in the venerable Cumberland Farms Bowl.
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Post by hcpride on Sept 18, 2019 6:13:04 GMT -5
I don't know. If we are ever good enough at football to be selected for a post-season bowl game I think we should consider going. I don't think we'll meet that requisite level of FBS success for a while. Even at our lower FCS level I wouldn't be surprised if many HC fans would happily attend a post-season Ivy-Patriot bowl-type matchup. Of course each of those two fantasies is not going to occur (HC at an FBS bowl and HC playing the Ivy Champ in a bowl game).
But we can win the PL and make inroads in the FCS playoffs (like Colgate last year) at some point which I think is our collective goal.
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Post by Tom on Sept 18, 2019 8:17:10 GMT -5
The Ivies could very easily, and probably should, move up to FBS. As a percentage of their pocketbook it would be a very minimal investment for them. They're already giving FBS levels of aid and most of their stadiums would be compliant. Don't you need to average a certain amount of fans over a period of time to maintain 1-A/FBS status?
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Post by purplepig on Sept 18, 2019 8:25:44 GMT -5
The Ivies could not move up nor would they. Dartmouth versus Clemson? Bring it on! Nor are the Ivies going to add teams. “Today, the Ancient Eight becomes the Educated Eleven!” No, it won’t happen. So after 11 screens of comments, there is no solution and no other suitable league for the Patriot teams (except Georgetown could go to the Pioneer conference). So get better if possible. It may just be that scholarships didn’t help because the league is squeezed between the Ivies, CAA and academically solid big schools, along with the NESCAC. Maybe there is no solution.
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Post by td128 on Sept 18, 2019 9:01:45 GMT -5
There is very much a solution and it in the process of being implemented at Holy Cross right now.
1. Recruit players who can compete at a level above the Patriot League (certainly at the CAA and even more so at the MAC) and want the combination of the fabulous academic program at Holy Cross and very solid D1 football. Find the kids who absolutely love the game and the competition. No room for slackers.
2. Augment the recruiting of the student-athletes in point 1 by selling them and their families on the 40 year/lifetime decision of matriculating at Holy Cross with the specific benefits of our best in class 90-Wide program that is only getting better and better each and every year. Coach Chesney and staff have embraced the 90W in wondrous ways. No other PL program has anything close to the 90W and we are widening the gap.
3.The new facilities are hugely impactful to the process because they are every bit as good as anything our future Crusaders will see at any school that might recruit them AND FAR BETTER than most.
Coach Chesney and staff are executing this plan with precision and to perfection. The quality of recruits who have committed to Holy Cross is outstanding. Many/most have fit the profile outlined above. I have had the good fortune of meeting many of these families whose sons are currently Crusaders. They speak to me about these specific points as to why their sons chose to come to Holy Cross and are Crusaders.
Disaster? Perhaps other PL schools are having issues but the future is exceptionally bright atop Mt. St. James and rest assured I am not now nor will I ever drink the Kool-Aid and make a public pitch if I think there are issues needing to be addressed. We are honest, forthright, and appropriately aggressive in every pursuit.
We always want to raise the bar and the expectations for the Crusaders and then support the program in those pursuits. In fact that is and always has been the stated Mission of the Friends of Crusader Football: "A commitment to excellence in helping the Crusaders win on and off the field."
BEAT YALE . . . NO PRISONERS . . . LET'S WIN!!
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Post by td128 on Sept 18, 2019 9:28:56 GMT -5
Question: Are you in favor of remaining in the PL?
In order of priority, I am in favor of pursuing excellence and the byproduct of that pursuit which is winning.
Excellence and winning creates all sorts of positive benefits and options which otherwise do not come to pass when mired in the midst of mediocrity. If we literally play our way right out of the league and have the option of doing so then that would be a good thing. Always nice to have options.
The issue for Holy Cross in regard to football and the Patriot League seems to me to have little to do with football and everything to do with the current state and trajectory of our hoop program.
If we accept mediocrity within our athletic pursuits and that strikes me as a very real issue then we are going nowhere either within the PL or outside of it.
BEAT YALE . . . NO PRISONERS . . . LET'S WIN!!
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Post by nycrusader2010 on Sept 18, 2019 10:08:36 GMT -5
The Ivies could very easily, and probably should, move up to FBS. As a percentage of their pocketbook it would be a very minimal investment for them. They're already giving FBS levels of aid and most of their stadiums would be compliant. Don't you need to average a certain amount of fans over a period of time to maintain 1-A/FBS status? The attendance requirement was initially invoked to push the Ivies, MAC (for a couple years) and several other I-A schools down (William & Mary, Colgate, HC, etc). However it hasn't really been used since even though rule remains on books. If it were invoked again, half the MAC wouldve been relegated down, UMass would be back to FCS and Idaho would've dropped a decade before they did. I highly doubt the likes of North Texas, Georgia State (UT win notwithstanding), Coastal Carolina and Middle Tennessee are able to consistently average the 15k required. The biggest barrier to entry to FBS now is that you have to be invited by an existing conference. So an FCS league can't just "jump" together and move up. Nor could a strong group of FCS schools create their own football conference out of thin air and declare themselves FBS. Liberty was a recent exception as they were somehow able to pay someone off / claim religious discrimination and move up as an independent with no conference invite on the horizon. They had been lobbying CUSA, Sun Belt and MAC for years but to no avail.
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Post by td128 on Sept 18, 2019 10:38:46 GMT -5
I would not set any ceilings prior to pursuing and committing ourselves to "excellence." I mean I do think we address the concept of "excellence" in our Mission Statement, so how does an overall winning percentage of less than 50% if not less than 40% reconcile with that? "As a liberal arts college, Holy Cross pursues excellence in teaching, learning, and research." : www.holycross.edu/about-us/mission-statementAny coach worth his salt, would tell you that his role is really one of a teacher. If/as we approach excellence, we can think about whether we want to cross any bridges that are in front of us. There are many miles to go before we get there. I am sure you would agree that life is far more about the journey than the destination. Who knows, perhaps in the process of developing an excellent basketball program, we might just land the next CJ McCollum or others of that ilk. Excellence
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Post by longsuffering on Sept 18, 2019 12:55:55 GMT -5
Regarding the NCAA FCS playoffs, I liken them to the excitement of our two game run in the NIT (1-1). We didn't beat ND in their best sport, football, nor did we beat them in the best post season BB tournament, the NCAA, but we beat them in a legitimate D-1 post season tournament you have qualify for and moved on and it was thrilling.
Just cracking the FCS national rankings and then moving up after victories will be great. To quote Pete Carroll, I'm "pumped and jacked" for small incremental steps up the ladder of success.
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Sept 18, 2019 13:38:11 GMT -5
Don't you need to average a certain amount of fans over a period of time to maintain 1-A/FBS status? The attendance requirement was initially invoked to push the Ivies, MAC (for a couple years) and several other I-A schools down (William & Mary, Colgate, HC, etc). However it hasn't really been used since even though rule remains on books. If it were invoked again, half the MAC wouldve been relegated down, UMass would be back to FCS and Idaho would've dropped a decade before they did. I highly doubt the likes of North Texas, Georgia State (UT win notwithstanding), Coastal Carolina and Middle Tennessee are able to consistently average the 15k required. The biggest barrier to entry to FBS now is that you have to be invited by an existing conference. So an FCS league can't just "jump" together and move up. Nor could a strong group of FCS schools create their own football conference out of thin air and declare themselves FBS. Liberty was a recent exception as they were somehow able to pay someone off / claim religious discrimination and move up as an independent with no conference invite on the horizon. They had been lobbying CUSA, Sun Belt and MAC for years but to no avail. North Texas has actually averaged over 20,000 for the past three years while Georgia State and Middle Tennessee are right at 15-16,000. Who knows how accurate those numbers are. The school that best exemplifies attendance futility is Ball State: under 10,000 per year for 2015 & 16 & 17 and 10,328 for last season.
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Post by joe on Sept 18, 2019 13:47:06 GMT -5
Is it true that certain colleges will buy back their own tickets to meet attendance numbers, hence the discordance between what is documented and the eyeball test?
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