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Post by Tom on Jan 5, 2020 19:58:01 GMT -5
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Post by cmo on Jan 5, 2020 20:19:19 GMT -5
Back from the game. Observations: I thought it was perhaps one of the best officiated games that I have seen in years and, in fact, post game I said to some of the Crossports faithful, "do you think we had some ACC/Big East refs?" Thank you hoops for confirming my suspicion. They were much better/fairer than what we usually see. To the point, I said to 8485, "I haven't seen any 'thank you for your service' fouls against HC." His response "the younger refs haven't learned that yet." One of the referees for this game, John Gaffney, is a big-time ref. Among other games this week, he did one ACC game and two Big East games. The other two referees rarely get a D1 assignment. I think this is what we will see on Sundays now. 1 “big time” ref working with 2 less experienced refs. New commissioner favors this. Hopefully it works out as well as it did today.
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Post by trimster on Jan 5, 2020 20:22:26 GMT -5
Back from the game. Observations: I thought it was perhaps one of the best officiated games that I have seen in years and, in fact, post game I said to some of the Crossports faithful, "do you think we had some ACC/Big East refs?" Thank you hoops for confirming my suspicion. They were much better/fairer than what we usually see. To the point, I said to 8485, "I haven't seen any 'thank you for your service' fouls against HC." His response "the younger refs haven't learned that yet." One of the referees for this game, John Gaffney, is a big-time ref. Among other games this week, he did one ACC game and two Big East games. The other two referees rarely get a D1 assignment. Must have made for an interesting pregame in the officials locker room. It was great to see the Crusaders win today. Gritty effort by a young team.
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Post by longsuffering on Jan 5, 2020 20:26:02 GMT -5
One of the referees for this game, John Gaffney, is a big-time ref. Among other games this week, he did one ACC game and two Big East games. The other two referees rarely get a D1 assignment. I think this is what we will see on Sundays now. 1 “big time” ref working with 2 less experienced refs. New commissioner favors this. Hopefully it works out as well as it did today. Does the big time ref and the less experienced refs all get paid the same for the game?
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Post by cmo on Jan 5, 2020 20:31:44 GMT -5
I think this is what we will see on Sundays now. 1 “big time” ref working with 2 less experienced refs. New commissioner favors this. Hopefully it works out as well as it did today. Does the big time ref and the less experienced refs all get paid the same for the game? i believe so. The experienced guys obviously get many many more games.
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Post by hchoops on Jan 5, 2020 20:41:10 GMT -5
I think this is what we will see on Sundays now. 1 “big time” ref working with 2 less experienced refs. New commissioner favors this. Hopefully it works out as well as it did today. Does the big time ref and the less experienced refs all get paid the same for the game? Yes, but Gaffney’s ACC and Big East games reward him far more generously. He does the PL on days off from the big boys.
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Post by bison137 on Jan 5, 2020 20:46:09 GMT -5
I think this is what we will see on Sundays now. 1 “big time” ref working with 2 less experienced refs. New commissioner favors this. Hopefully it works out as well as it did today. Does the big time ref and the less experienced refs all get paid the same for the game? Yes. That is one reason mid-major leagues don't get many of the top refs even when they don't have other assignments. Gaffney, however, seems to really want to ref as much as possible. In three of the last four seasons, he has reffed 77 games. He might be in the area to officiate Tuesday's BC-UVA game. As for any possible Sunday strategy, there are only four Sunday games on the schedule for the rest of the year so it won't have much effect. Fwiw, Holy Cross-Navy was the only game today that had a referee with a very good ranking.
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Post by bison137 on Jan 5, 2020 20:54:34 GMT -5
Does the big time ref and the less experienced refs all get paid the same for the game? Yes, but Gaffney’s ACC and Big East games reward him far more generously. He does the PL on days off from the big boys. He does do an occasional mid-major, but before today he hadn't done a PL game (actual league game, not OOC where the a higher conference assigns the refs) for at least 4.5 years. Maybe much longer.
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Post by cmo on Jan 5, 2020 20:56:45 GMT -5
Does the big time ref and the less experienced refs all get paid the same for the game? Yes. That is one reason mid-major leagues don't get many of the top refs even when they don't have other assignments. Gaffney, however, seems to really want to ref as much as possible. In three of the last four seasons, he has reffed 77 games. He might be in the area to officiate Tuesday's BC-UVA game. As for any possible Sunday strategy, there are only four Sunday games on the schedule for the rest of the year so it won't have much effect. Fwiw, Holy Cross-Navy was the only game today that had a referee with a very good ranking. Did the other 3 games employ the 1 experienced / 2 new guys pairing ?
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Post by timholycross on Jan 5, 2020 21:05:40 GMT -5
Where do you find the rankings of the officials; I couldn't find anything.
I believe a former HC football player, Jim Grady, is getting D1 assignments.
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Post by cmo on Jan 5, 2020 21:25:14 GMT -5
Where do you find the rankings of the officials; I couldn't find anything. I believe a former HC football player, Jim Grady, is getting D1 assignments. I think Grady is done with reffing. At least for now.
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Post by HC92 on Jan 5, 2020 23:24:53 GMT -5
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Post by Crosser on Jan 6, 2020 0:17:45 GMT -5
Congratulations to all the coaches and players! It was a most enjoyable day at the Hart Center. As for that chest cold thing going around Worcester, I’m almost back to 95% or so after it lingered with me for going on 6 weeks. Of course, I’m not a young athlete either.
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Post by WorcesterGray on Jan 6, 2020 8:22:18 GMT -5
Telegram story . . .
WORCESTER — It was nice to finally hear some cheering — and even some singing — coming from the Holy Cross men’s locker room this season.
The Crusaders celebrated their first home win and first Patriot League victory, while also serenading junior forward Connor Niego with a few verses of “Happy Birthday” after beating Navy in dramatic fashion Sunday afternoon at the Hart Center.
Freshman guard Drew Lowder buried the go-ahead 3-pointer with 6 seconds left, HC prevented the Midshipmen from getting off a quality final shot and the Crusaders prevailed, 63-61.
Holy Cross (2-13, 1-1) snapped a six-game losing streak.
“Right since Christmas break we’ve been ready to make a breakthrough,” HC coach Brett Nelson said, “and our guys have been working hard, we’ve been practicing consistently and they’ve had good attitudes. When you do that, it’s going to put you in position to win, and today we executed, which was good to see. I’m proud of our effort.”
Holy Cross junior guard Austin Butler led all scorers with 18 points and was one of four HC players in double figures. Freshman guard Ryan Wade added 10 and Lowder and freshman forward Joe Pridgen 10 points each.
Niego, who turned 21 Sunday, was coming off one of his best games of the year with 10 points and 11 rebounds at Loyola, but did not play against Navy due to sickness. In his absence, junior Matt Faw started at center and gave the Crusaders a lift at the defensive end with five rebounds and three blocked shots.
Navy (7-6, 1-1) made 58 percent of its attempts in the first half, but Holy Cross held the Mids to 31 percent from the floor in the second.
HC overcame a 5-for-16 showing at the free throw line and a five-minute scoring drought in the second half.
“Overall, I thought it was our best defensive game,” Nelson said. “I challenged our guys to put 40 minutes together. We’ve put together 30 minutes and 35 minutes, but we had yet to put 40 minutes together at the defensive end. Credit our guys. They were able to sustain their defensive intensity, especially in the second half when we had a hard time scoring. I’m really proud of our defensive effort.”
Navy snapped a 59-59 tie when sophomore Greg Summers made a pair of free throws with 34 seconds left. Faw made 1-2 free throws to get HC within a point. Navy’s Luke Loehr missed two free throws and Holy Cross sophomore forward Marlon Hargis came down with a huge rebound with 11 seconds left.
HC called a 30-second timeout to set up a play, which planned for a Pridgen layup.
“But he got doubled,” Lowder said, “and he just followed coach’s instructions. He played off two feet and made the right pass. I was just there to hit the shot.”
Lowder, HC’s second-leading scorer (14.6 ppg), got off to a good start this year, but has been in and out of the lineup the last few weeks due to an injury and coach’s decision.
He scored 17 points in 24 minutes off the bench at Loyola and added five assists and a steal in 23 minutes against Navy.
“Through highs and lows, your confidence has to remain the same as a basketball player if we’re going to accomplish what we want to accomplish,” Lowder said. “We just take it a day at a time and be there when the team needs you.”
Pridgen, who has captured four straight Patriot League Rookie of the Week honors, scored in double figures for the ninth game in a row. Nelson was most impressed with his assist on the winning basket.
“Making that decision off the slip of the ball screen,” Nelson said, “he had two guys on him. I keep talking about, ‘Keep your feet. Pivot step to your target when you pass and throw a strike,’ and Joe did exactly that. He hit Drew right in the pocket and Drew made an unbelievable shot.”
Coming out of a timeout, Butler huddled his teammates.
“I said, ‘One stop and the game is ours,‘” Butler said. ‘“We have to be locked in on the last play.’”
Freshman Jaylen Walker’s 3-point try clanged off the rim.
Eight of the last 11 games between Holy Cross and Navy have been decided by seven or fewer points.
In the first half, Holy Cross scored 15 straight points and used a 26-6 run over eight minutes to turn a 10-point deficit into a 10-point lead with 4:33 left. HC led by four at halftime.
Navy used an 11-2 run to regain the lead, 50-49, with 9:40 to go. Butler, Lowder and Pridgen hit key baskets in the closing minutes.
The Crusaders were up by 11 in the first half at Loyola last Thursday before falling, 80-70, so being able to hold off the Mids was an important step.
“At halftime we kept saying, ‘Full 40. Today’s the day we put a full 40 minutes together,’” Butler said. “We had that span in the second half when we weren’t scoring, but we knew if we got stops the scoring would come. It came down to the last second and we executed.”
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Post by trimster on Jan 6, 2020 8:28:04 GMT -5
Does the big time ref and the less experienced refs all get paid the same for the game? Yes. That is one reason mid-major leagues don't get many of the top refs even when they don't have other assignments. Gaffney, however, seems to really want to ref as much as possible. In three of the last four seasons, he has reffed 77 games. He might be in the area to officiate Tuesday's BC-UVA game. As for any possible Sunday strategy, there are only four Sunday games on the schedule for the rest of the year so it won't have much effect. Fwiw, Holy Cross-Navy was the only game today that had a referee with a very good ranking. I read somewhere last year that there is concern some of these big time hoop officials are taking far too many games. Don't forget, for the most part, these people have a regular job and some of them are traveling hither and yon most days of the week, to officiate for four months. I am not saying it is the case with Gaffney but Some of them want to minimize the days and nights they don't work a game. At some point burnout sets in.
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Post by bison137 on Jan 6, 2020 8:32:10 GMT -5
Yes. That is one reason mid-major leagues don't get many of the top refs even when they don't have other assignments. Gaffney, however, seems to really want to ref as much as possible. In three of the last four seasons, he has reffed 77 games. He might be in the area to officiate Tuesday's BC-UVA game. As for any possible Sunday strategy, there are only four Sunday games on the schedule for the rest of the year so it won't have much effect. Fwiw, Holy Cross-Navy was the only game today that had a referee with a very good ranking. Did the other 3 games employ the 1 experienced / 2 new guys pairing ? None of them did.
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Post by bison137 on Jan 6, 2020 8:34:27 GMT -5
Where do you find the rankings of the officials; I couldn't find anything. Pomeroy' s site shows every ref assignment for the last five years. Obviously there is no perfect way to rate refs, but he uses a combination of the quality of assignments and number of assignments. Assumes that the assignors, who see all of the evaluations, have a pretty good idea who is doing a good or bad job.
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Post by HC92 on Jan 6, 2020 8:41:09 GMT -5
I watched the last 5 minutes of the game on the DVR last night. Very impressed with Matt Faw’s development and effort. Two great effort plays by him in the last few minutes that had a huge impact. He had another one where he almost got another steal. Great to see and kudos to Coach Nelson and staff for motivating him to play a little differently and to him for making the effort.
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Post by Tom on Jan 6, 2020 8:53:34 GMT -5
Not sure if it's already been said, but there's something nice from a learning and confidence standpoint to be down on your last possession and pull out a win
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Post by purplehaze on Jan 6, 2020 10:01:52 GMT -5
It's always interesting to hear from the other side in such a closely contested game - from the Navy story:
"Disappointing loss," said Navy head coach Ed DeChellis. "We didn't defend real well in the first half and didn't rebound. We came out in the second half and defended better, but offensively, in this game you have to make one-foot shots and free throws and we missed several one-foot open shots and then we missed free throws that hurt us and changed the tide of the game. Certainly, it was a winnable game and that's the frustrating part of it."
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Post by rgs318 on Jan 6, 2020 10:08:51 GMT -5
HC has been there and felt that.
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Post by WorcesterGray on Jan 6, 2020 10:47:23 GMT -5
"Disappointing loss," said Navy head coach Ed DeChellis. " . . . in this game you have to make one-foot shots and free throws and we missed several one-foot open shots and then we missed free throws that hurt us and changed the tide of the game." I hate when we make this excuse for HC losses, and don't like it any better here. Navy missed some open shots in close (everybody does), but their EFG was 46.2%, which is actually a little better than it had been coming in (45.5%). They made 50% of their twos, significantly better than they had been doing (45.3%). They missed some free throws; we missed more.
Holy Cross was the better team yesterday. That's why Navy lost.
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Post by dadominate on Jan 6, 2020 10:47:47 GMT -5
It's always interesting to hear from the other side in such a closely contested game - from the Navy story: "Disappointing loss," said Navy head coach Ed DeChellis. "We didn't defend real well in the first half and didn't rebound. We came out in the second half and defended better, but offensively, in this game you have to make one-foot shots and free throws and we missed several one-foot open shots and then we missed free throws that hurt us and changed the tide of the game. Certainly, it was a winnable game and that's the frustrating part of it." hard to objectively see missed free throws as a/the difference in this game!
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Post by Tom on Jan 6, 2020 10:47:54 GMT -5
It's always interesting to hear from the other side in such a closely contested game - from the Navy story: "Disappointing loss," said Navy head coach Ed DeChellis. " we missed free throws that hurt us and changed the tide of the game. Certainly, it was a winnable game and that's the frustrating part of it." Too funny. They missed 9 free throws in route to a 59 percent afternoon. HC missed 11 to get 31 percent. Missed free throws can change things, but hard to go there when HC was percentage wise way worse. I do get his point. All missed free throws hurt, no matter how much your opponent is clanging them up there
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Post by longsuffering on Jan 6, 2020 10:57:38 GMT -5
I will split a hair. The T+G described HC preventing Navy from getting a quality last shot and the last shot as clanging off the rim. Fair description, but I recall the last shot clanged in and out of the rim before it clanged off the rim. My point is that is why live sports are so exciting and why they are the top rated network shows because they are unscripted.
This game hopefully will be pointed to as a turning point for HC MBB. Just fascinating how sports are games of inches, centimeters and split seconds.
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