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Post by joutsHC77 on Sept 19, 2023 15:50:42 GMT -5
I would like to see our guys hold opponents to 17 points or fewer. If we do that and score 40 plus points, we make the point that we dominate without putting up numbers that some might find unseemly. Alum, I agree. HC has scored in the 40s and opponents have scored in low 20s in our 2 victories. HC is hardly scoring in the 60s or 70s that we have seen in college football games this year. During the HC-Yale game thread, I posted: Pound them and make them cry uncle! This was said in jest as we were finally-the last few years-exerting dominance over Yale. However, several sensitive posters took offense and proceeded to complain about running up the score and commenters extended the thread for several pages. Do they ever see ND’s scores which are mainly lopsided in their victories over weaker opponents? I rest my case and say continue to pound our opponents with the aforementioned target scores you and I agree upon.
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hc69
Crusader Century Club
Posts: 224
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Post by hc69 on Sept 19, 2023 15:56:48 GMT -5
I have no problem with this. Chesney had his reasons for having his starters stay in for that series, but running up the score to impress the voters wasn't one of them. Had margin of victory been his priority, he would have kept his starting D in to keep Yale from scoring the garbage time TD.
The only poll that matters is the coaches poll. That's the basis of the selection committee's decisions. Fans put a lot more stock in margin of victory than do coaches. Coaches know a lot of variables go into margin of victory. What matters is that you don't struggle in games you should win, not what the margin of victory is. We won the Yale game going away. While some on here may care that we won by 35 instead of 28, the coaches don't care.
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Post by longsuffering on Sept 19, 2023 16:14:26 GMT -5
It is what it is but I agree nht, there was no need for either Sluka or Coker to be out there to hook up on that last TD up 42-17 with 5+ minutes left. I will say that this is a good "problem" to have. It wouldn't shock me if Yale discontinues this series.....not just due to that one play but how we have dominated the series lately. Where else is Coach Reno going to get a strong test for the Eli before they face the Ivy iron?
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Post by hc2020 on Sept 19, 2023 16:28:13 GMT -5
I remember when Patriots fans used to blindly trust in BB….
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Post by Sons of Vaval on Sept 19, 2023 16:29:23 GMT -5
I remember when Patriots fans used to blindly trust in BB…. Why the continual subtle (and not so subtle) criticisms in one of the best coaches in the country?
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Post by longsuffering on Sept 19, 2023 16:37:33 GMT -5
Remember the play when Sluka's helmut came off and it looked like he needed to take a play off? That was a huge third or fourth down.. In the future in that situation, I'd like a backup with SOME experience. I have no love lost for Yale but their behavior toward us in '17 was exemplary That points out one small advantage of the IL turning their collective nose up at the playoffs. H&Y feel no pressure to win by an ostentatious margin to impress the selection committee. NFL, MLB, NHL, NBA teams also don't have to impress a selection committee. College football teams striving for post season at large berths, seeds/byes or Bowl invites unfortunately are in a similar boat as figure skaters or MMA Fighters relying on judges/selection committees.
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Post by deep Purple on Sept 19, 2023 16:39:01 GMT -5
Four qbs used and Fenerty done after 3rd qtr in the Columbia game in 1983. The career stats would look a lot different if starters in the Carter/Duffner years stayed in the game in the 4th quarter during routs. That being said, I was hoping for 50 against Yale.
From NY Times
FENERTY RUNS 337 YARDS FOR HOLY CROSS By Alex Yannis
Oct. 30, 1983
Gill Fenerty, a sophomore tailback, rushed for 337 yards on 18 attempts and scored 6 touchdowns today as undefeated Holy Cross trounced Columbia, 77-28, before a crowd of 12,861 at windy Fitton Field.
Holy Cross entered the game ranked second nationally, behind Southern Illinois,among Division I-AA schools. Southern Illinois may maintain the top spot after its victory today over New Mexico State, but Holy Cross's performance will not go unnoticed.
Fenerty, a 6-foot, 190-pounder, achieved his feat in only three quarters of play. Coach Rick Carter did not use him in the last quarter, and as a result Fenerty missed an opportunity to break the Division I-AA single-game rushing record of 345 yards set by Russell Davis of Idaho in 1981.
''He was unbelievable at times,'' Carter said about Fenerty. ''The run where he broke the two tackles was terrific. He punished people.''
Carter was referring to the 68-yard run that produced Fenerty's sixth touchdown, which also tied a record for touchdowns by rushing - held by Henry Odom of South Carolina State. In addition, Fenerty equaled Odom's mark of scoring 36 points in a game.
The 10 touchdowns by Holy Cross was one of eight school records broken. The Crusaders amassed 684 yards total offense, also a school record, including 583 on the ground, which is a national record. The previous mark of 526 yards was set by Idaho against Simon Fraser in 1981.
Holy Cross is now 8-0, the best start in its history. The Crusaders' previous best start was in 1945 when they were 7-0 and made it to the Orange Bowl.
''We're proud to say this is the first team at Holy Cross to win its first eight games,'' said Carter, who is in his third year as the Crusaders' coach. ''We'd like to make the Division 1-AA playoffs and see how far we can go. We have some talent here, and Fenerty is not the only one.'' ''I feel somewhere between total glee and ecstasy,'' Fenerty said. ''I'm happy for the whole offense. I was just one of the 11 players.''
Fenerty, a native of New Orleans who transferred from Louisiana State, had two runs of more than 60 yards, three for more than 50 yards, three more than 40, four more than 30, and six more than 20. His longest was the 68-yarder; his other scoring runs were of 62, 55, 22 and twice for 11 yards. 4 Quarterbacks Used
Carter used 96 players, including four quarterbacks. Peter Muldoon started and yielded to Tom Heffernan after Muldoon helped build a 30-0 lead before the game was even 16 minutes old. Heffernan later gave way to Dave Hock, who was replaced by Chris Degenhardt.
Hock and Degenhardt scored once each, with Chuck Doyle, Wayne Jackson and Tom Kelleher also scoring touchdowns for the Crusaders. Tony Melnik missed three extra points but made a 37-yard field goal. John Witkowski, the senior quarterback for Columbia, scored the first two touchdowns of his career, both on short runs.
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Post by longsuffering on Sept 19, 2023 16:42:54 GMT -5
I remember when Patriots fans used to blindly trust in BB…. I don't anticipate a post-Sluka fade similar to the post-Brady fade. Coach Chesney is as upbeat as BB is dour although they both know FB.
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Post by longsuffering on Sept 19, 2023 16:54:11 GMT -5
Four qbs used and Fenerty done after 3rd qtr in the Columbia game in 1983. The career stats would look a lot different if starters in the Carter/Duffner years stayed in the game in the 4th quarter during routs. That being said, I was hoping for 50 against Yale. From NY Times FENERTY RUNS 337 YARDS FOR HOLY CROSS By Alex Yannis Oct. 30, 1983 Gill Fenerty, a sophomore tailback, rushed for 337 yards on 18 attempts and scored 6 touchdowns today as undefeated Holy Cross trounced Columbia, 77-28, before a crowd of 12,861 at windy Fitton Field. Holy Cross entered the game ranked second nationally, behind Southern Illinois,among Division I-AA schools. Southern Illinois may maintain the top spot after its victory today over New Mexico State, but Holy Cross's performance will not go unnoticed. Fenerty, a 6-foot, 190-pounder, achieved his feat in only three quarters of play. Coach Rick Carter did not use him in the last quarter, and as a result Fenerty missed an opportunity to break the Division I-AA single-game rushing record of 345 yards set by Russell Davis of Idaho in 1981. ''He was unbelievable at times,'' Carter said about Fenerty. ''The run where he broke the two tackles was terrific. He punished people.'' Carter was referring to the 68-yard run that produced Fenerty's sixth touchdown, which also tied a record for touchdowns by rushing - held by Henry Odom of South Carolina State. In addition, Fenerty equaled Odom's mark of scoring 36 points in a game. The 10 touchdowns by Holy Cross was one of eight school records broken. The Crusaders amassed 684 yards total offense, also a school record, including 583 on the ground, which is a national record. The previous mark of 526 yards was set by Idaho against Simon Fraser in 1981. Holy Cross is now 8-0, the best start in its history. The Crusaders' previous best start was in 1945 when they were 7-0 and made it to the Orange Bowl. ''We're proud to say this is the first team at Holy Cross to win its first eight games,'' said Carter, who is in his third year as the Crusaders' coach. ''We'd like to make the Division 1-AA playoffs and see how far we can go. We have some talent here, and Fenerty is not the only one.'' ''I feel somewhere between total glee and ecstasy,'' Fenerty said. ''I'm happy for the whole offense. I was just one of the 11 players.'' Fenerty, a native of New Orleans who transferred from Louisiana State, had two runs of more than 60 yards, three for more than 50 yards, three more than 40, four more than 30, and six more than 20. His longest was the 68-yarder; his other scoring runs were of 62, 55, 22 and twice for 11 yards. 4 Quarterbacks Used Carter used 96 players, including four quarterbacks. Peter Muldoon started and yielded to Tom Heffernan after Muldoon helped build a 30-0 lead before the game was even 16 minutes old. Heffernan later gave way to Dave Hock, who was replaced by Chris Degenhardt. Hock and Degenhardt scored once each, with Chuck Doyle, Wayne Jackson and Tom Kelleher also scoring touchdowns for the Crusaders. Tony Melnik missed three extra points but made a 37-yard field goal. John Witkowski, the senior quarterback for Columbia, scored the first two touchdowns of his career, both on short runs. Tom Kelleher who was a very personable and diplomatic color analyst along side Mr. E, Bob Fouracre is mentioned. I hope he is doing well.
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Post by hc87 on Sept 19, 2023 17:43:49 GMT -5
Four qbs used and Fenerty done after 3rd qtr in the Columbia game in 1983. The career stats would look a lot different if starters in the Carter/Duffner years stayed in the game in the 4th quarter during routs. That being said, I was hoping for 50 against Yale. From NY Times FENERTY RUNS 337 YARDS FOR HOLY CROSS By Alex Yannis Oct. 30, 1983 Gill Fenerty, a sophomore tailback, rushed for 337 yards on 18 attempts and scored 6 touchdowns today as undefeated Holy Cross trounced Columbia, 77-28, before a crowd of 12,861 at windy Fitton Field. Holy Cross entered the game ranked second nationally, behind Southern Illinois,among Division I-AA schools. Southern Illinois may maintain the top spot after its victory today over New Mexico State, but Holy Cross's performance will not go unnoticed. Fenerty, a 6-foot, 190-pounder, achieved his feat in only three quarters of play. Coach Rick Carter did not use him in the last quarter, and as a result Fenerty missed an opportunity to break the Division I-AA single-game rushing record of 345 yards set by Russell Davis of Idaho in 1981. ''He was unbelievable at times,'' Carter said about Fenerty. ''The run where he broke the two tackles was terrific. He punished people.'' Carter was referring to the 68-yard run that produced Fenerty's sixth touchdown, which also tied a record for touchdowns by rushing - held by Henry Odom of South Carolina State. In addition, Fenerty equaled Odom's mark of scoring 36 points in a game. The 10 touchdowns by Holy Cross was one of eight school records broken. The Crusaders amassed 684 yards total offense, also a school record, including 583 on the ground, which is a national record. The previous mark of 526 yards was set by Idaho against Simon Fraser in 1981. Holy Cross is now 8-0, the best start in its history. The Crusaders' previous best start was in 1945 when they were 7-0 and made it to the Orange Bowl. ''We're proud to say this is the first team at Holy Cross to win its first eight games,'' said Carter, who is in his third year as the Crusaders' coach. ''We'd like to make the Division 1-AA playoffs and see how far we can go. We have some talent here, and Fenerty is not the only one.'' ''I feel somewhere between total glee and ecstasy,'' Fenerty said. ''I'm happy for the whole offense. I was just one of the 11 players.'' Fenerty, a native of New Orleans who transferred from Louisiana State, had two runs of more than 60 yards, three for more than 50 yards, three more than 40, four more than 30, and six more than 20. His longest was the 68-yarder; his other scoring runs were of 62, 55, 22 and twice for 11 yards. 4 Quarterbacks Used Carter used 96 players, including four quarterbacks. Peter Muldoon started and yielded to Tom Heffernan after Muldoon helped build a 30-0 lead before the game was even 16 minutes old. Heffernan later gave way to Dave Hock, who was replaced by Chris Degenhardt. Hock and Degenhardt scored once each, with Chuck Doyle, Wayne Jackson and Tom Kelleher also scoring touchdowns for the Crusaders. Tony Melnik missed three extra points but made a 37-yard field goal. John Witkowski, the senior quarterback for Columbia, scored the first two touchdowns of his career, both on short runs. Tom Kelleher who was a very personable and diplomatic color analyst along side Mr. E, Bob Fouracre is mentioned. I hope he is doing well. TK is coaching at Bishop Fenwick in Peabody. My brother and he worked some camps together this Summah.
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hc69
Crusader Century Club
Posts: 224
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Post by hc69 on Sept 19, 2023 17:52:00 GMT -5
It is what it is but I agree nht, there was no need for either Sluka or Coker to be out there to hook up on that last TD up 42-17 with 5+ minutes left. I will say that this is a good "problem" to have. It wouldn't shock me if Yale discontinues this series.....not just due to that one play but how we have dominated the series lately. The last five times we've played them we've won by 28, 24, 3, 3 (OT), and lost by 32. I guess it all depends how you define "dominated" and "lately."
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Post by dharry13 on Sept 19, 2023 18:02:51 GMT -5
I remember when Patriots fans used to blindly trust in BB…. Why the continual subtle (and not so subtle) criticisms in one of the best coaches in the country? Wow. You are the only guy with an issue with this program. We get it - we know you love the RB depth with kids who won’t play at the bottom of the RB room. And for every kid to make every trip for every game. We get it.
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Post by joutsHC77 on Sept 19, 2023 18:16:11 GMT -5
Four qbs used and Fenerty done after 3rd qtr in the Columbia game in 1983. The career stats would look a lot different if starters in the Carter/Duffner years stayed in the game in the 4th quarter during routs. That being said, I was hoping for 50 against Yale. From NY Times FENERTY RUNS 337 YARDS FOR HOLY CROSS By Alex Yannis Oct. 30, 1983 Gill Fenerty, a sophomore tailback, rushed for 337 yards on 18 attempts and scored 6 touchdowns today as undefeated Holy Cross trounced Columbia, 77-28, before a crowd of 12,861 at windy Fitton Field. Holy Cross entered the game ranked second nationally, behind Southern Illinois,among Division I-AA schools. Southern Illinois may maintain the top spot after its victory today over New Mexico State, but Holy Cross's performance will not go unnoticed. Fenerty, a 6-foot, 190-pounder, achieved his feat in only three quarters of play. Coach Rick Carter did not use him in the last quarter, and as a result Fenerty missed an opportunity to break the Division I-AA single-game rushing record of 345 yards set by Russell Davis of Idaho in 1981. ''He was unbelievable at times,'' Carter said about Fenerty. ''The run where he broke the two tackles was terrific. He punished people.'' Carter was referring to the 68-yard run that produced Fenerty's sixth touchdown, which also tied a record for touchdowns by rushing - held by Henry Odom of South Carolina State. In addition, Fenerty equaled Odom's mark of scoring 36 points in a game. The 10 touchdowns by Holy Cross was one of eight school records broken. The Crusaders amassed 684 yards total offense, also a school record, including 583 on the ground, which is a national record. The previous mark of 526 yards was set by Idaho against Simon Fraser in 1981. Holy Cross is now 8-0, the best start in its history. The Crusaders' previous best start was in 1945 when they were 7-0 and made it to the Orange Bowl. ''We're proud to say this is the first team at Holy Cross to win its first eight games,'' said Carter, who is in his third year as the Crusaders' coach. ''We'd like to make the Division 1-AA playoffs and see how far we can go. We have some talent here, and Fenerty is not the only one.'' ''I feel somewhere between total glee and ecstasy,'' Fenerty said. ''I'm happy for the whole offense. I was just one of the 11 players.'' Fenerty, a native of New Orleans who transferred from Louisiana State, had two runs of more than 60 yards, three for more than 50 yards, three more than 40, four more than 30, and six more than 20. His longest was the 68-yarder; his other scoring runs were of 62, 55, 22 and twice for 11 yards. 4 Quarterbacks Used Carter used 96 players, including four quarterbacks. Peter Muldoon started and yielded to Tom Heffernan after Muldoon helped build a 30-0 lead before the game was even 16 minutes old. Heffernan later gave way to Dave Hock, who was replaced by Chris Degenhardt. Hock and Degenhardt scored once each, with Chuck Doyle, Wayne Jackson and Tom Kelleher also scoring touchdowns for the Crusaders. Tony Melnik missed three extra points but made a 37-yard field goal. John Witkowski, the senior quarterback for Columbia, scored the first two touchdowns of his career, both on short runs. Tom Kelleher who was a very personable and diplomatic color analyst along side Mr. E, Bob Fouracre is mentioned. I hope he is doing well. I used to listen to Fouracre and Big Red. Big Red was goòd and always diplomatic with Bob.
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Post by cruskater31 on Sept 19, 2023 18:39:10 GMT -5
Never got to see Tom play in person but loved hearing Big Red call games with Bob. Happy to hear he is doing well at Fenwick-an old rival of my own high school Alma mater.
Gosh would I love to hear Bob calling football again with Gordie or Big Red by his side. Imagine Fouracre when Dobbs throws a big hit or Sluka turns a broken play into a 50 yard rushing TD? He is probably smiling down on this football team!
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Post by Ignutz on Sept 19, 2023 18:43:48 GMT -5
It is what it is but I agree nht, there was no need for either Sluka or Coker to be out there to hook up on that last TD up 42-17 with 5+ minutes left. I will say that this is a good "problem" to have. It wouldn't shock me if Yale discontinues this series.....not just due to that one play but how we have dominated the series lately. As the game was winding down, I was thinking that we should do a poll where we predict the date when Yale cancels whatever games are currently scheduled.
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hc69
Crusader Century Club
Posts: 224
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Post by hc69 on Sept 19, 2023 19:01:28 GMT -5
It is what it is but I agree nht, there was no need for either Sluka or Coker to be out there to hook up on that last TD up 42-17 with 5+ minutes left. I will say that this is a good "problem" to have. It wouldn't shock me if Yale discontinues this series.....not just due to that one play but how we have dominated the series lately. As the game was winding down, I was thinking that we should do a poll where we predict the date when Yale cancels whatever games are currently scheduled. The last five times we've played them we've won by 25, 24, 3, 3 (OT) and lost by 32. Guess it depends of how you define 'dominated" and "lately," but I know an average margin of +5.6 over the last five games isn't in the same time zone as domination. And two double digit wins in a row does not a trend line make.
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Post by Sons of Vaval on Sept 19, 2023 19:04:53 GMT -5
As the game was winding down, I was thinking that we should do a poll where we predict the date when Yale cancels whatever games are currently scheduled. The last five times we've played them we've won by 25, 24, 3, 3 (OT) and lost by 32. Guess it depends of how you define 'dominated" and "lately," but I know an average margin of +5.6 over the last five games isn't in the same time zone as domination. And two double digit wins in a row does not a trend line make. One of those games is not like the other.
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Post by efg72 on Sept 19, 2023 19:05:14 GMT -5
It is what it is but I agree nht, there was no need for either Sluka or Coker to be out there to hook up on that last TD up 42-17 with 5+ minutes left. I will say that this is a good "problem" to have. It wouldn't shock me if Yale discontinues this series.....not just due to that one play but how we have dominated the series lately. As the game was winding down, I was thinking that we should do a poll where we predict the date when Yale cancels whatever games are currently scheduled. When the contract ends😇✝️ Will be happy to see it come to and end and replace them with Villanova or UNH
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hc69
Crusader Century Club
Posts: 224
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Post by hc69 on Sept 19, 2023 19:09:39 GMT -5
One of those games is not like the other. Ok, I'll buy that. The margin for the last four games is +14. That's not domination either.
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Post by midwestsader05 on Sept 19, 2023 19:10:03 GMT -5
One of those games is not like the other. Ok, I'll buy that. The margin for the last four games is +10. That's not domination either. Pretty sure the 32 point loss was 6 seasons ago now. Ches is 4-1 vs them with the loss coming in 2019 by 13 (23-10) Harvard has had our number relative to Yale even in The Chesney era. 1-3 so far.
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Post by efg72 on Sept 19, 2023 19:10:54 GMT -5
If we lose to them we get punished and we win by 20 plus the voters say that was expected
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hc69
Crusader Century Club
Posts: 224
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Post by hc69 on Sept 19, 2023 19:11:52 GMT -5
Ok, I'll buy that. The margin for the last four games is +10. That's not domination either. Pretty sure the 32 point loss was 6 seasons ago now. Ches is 4-1 vs them with the loss coming in 2019 by 13 (23-10) Harvard has had our number relative to Yale even in The Chesney era. 1-3 so far. You're right.
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Post by mm67 on Sept 19, 2023 19:28:33 GMT -5
Expect the team is not going through the mental gymnastics expressed on this board(myself included.). Just play the damn games & win. You play the game to win.
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Post by cruskater31 on Sept 20, 2023 5:22:53 GMT -5
I still chuckle seeing the title of this thread. When I first saw this yesterday, I really thought there was a controversy about guys ordering Jersey Mikes on the field during halftime!
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Post by nycrusader2010 on Sept 20, 2023 8:55:36 GMT -5
My thoughts -- remember conditioning the starters to play a full 60 minutes may have factored into the calculus. 42-17 with 4:50 to go is a 4-score game. Game is over. I think in that scenario I bring in the 2's to be completely honest. 41-17 I'm sticking with the ones since 24pt is technically still a 3-score game. Perhaps the staff thought more goal line / RZ reps were needed. You coach teams to finish drives and finish games. And while the game was in hand, it was nowhere near running up the score territory. The final score was 49-24 -- decisive but by no means ugly. And I'm not a big "style points" guy either. I would like to believe that committees and pollsters are smart enough to rank Holy Cross where we deserve regardless of whether we obtained a quality win by 4 scores or 5 scores. I believe the closeness of the BC loss is more important than our average margin of victory over PL and Ivy opponents.
NY Cru likely gives the 2nd string the opportunity to punch it in there but I'm not going to second guess Chesney for making the decision he did. Good sportsmanship on both sides allowing the respective backups to finish out the game on the final series.
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