|
Post by football44 on Jun 28, 2024 11:07:25 GMT -5
football44 and harry, you guys are right. It appears that if you don't pay, they won't play. At least the basketball performers we'd all want to watch win in the purple and white. I think you absolutely nail the urgency and needs in that respect, and you're putting your money and efforts where your mouths are in that respect. Commendable, truly.. However, I went to Holy Cross. I went for four years. I studied, was in clubs, I played intramural sports, I met new people, I partied, I succeeded, I failed... the whole experience. In many ways, just like the football players or basketball players or any of my other peers. But I didn't get paid to attend (outside of the scholarship, which I believe I earned, and financial aid, which I know I needed). Those players didn't get paid to attend (outside of their scholarships). No student was PAID to go to Holy Cross. So yeah, from my perspective, there's a tinge of jealousy that now there's a growing and somewhat confrontational group of voices saying WE HAVE TO START PAYING THESE KIDS OR WE WILL LOSE. It's not holier-than-thou. It's not immediately a moral high ground play. It's not for the virtues of amateur athletics, or the values of the Patriot League. It's about money. This isn't the NBA. The kid is in college. But because he happens to have grown to seven feet tall we HAVE TO PAY HIM? I was funnier than that kid. Maybe someone was more handsome. Maybe somebody was a better student. Maybe their parents are wealthy and will make more donations. We don't have to pay those people, do we? Are we setting up NILs for them? But for a hoopster? For a football player we do? I hate to lose. I've wanted these Holy Cross teams to kick ass for twenty years, and most people still active on this board have wanted it for double (triple?) that amount of time. But is this the final cost? We have to throw money at them like we "HAVE" to throw money at taxes and everything else just to hopefully have a chance? I'm basically fed up. Nobody is yelling and screaming that we HAVE to give me any money. That we HAVE to give it to our ill family members, classmates, the needy, etc. For a kid to play ball? I've gone zero to sixty about hating all this NIL nonsense, for ignorant ball players to get rich and not give two #@*&$~!s about their school, community, larger identity, and be a part of it... just mercenaries separating you from your money. Makes me feel like that they think we're suckers. I'm no sucker. WCHC I totally respect your position. All dharry and I are trying to say is that our competitive level will decline if we don't play in the NIL world. Now understand the NIL levels at the Patriot League are not at the financial levels at larger schools. Schools like Fordham, Colgate and now Richmond have healthy NIL programs. Recruiting those types of players in the Patriot League puts our two coaches in a non competitive position recruiting wise.
|
|
|
Post by football44 on Jun 28, 2024 11:26:10 GMT -5
All on this board have been so proud of our football success over the past 5 years. To help everyone understand the world of NIL using our past great roster, here you go: Jake Dobbs - JMU- NIL money, Eric Schoen - Duke- NIL money, Pat Mcmurtrie - JMU - NIL money, Luke Newman - Michigan State - NIL money, Matt Sluka - UNLV - NIL money, Jalen Coker Carolina Panthers, CJ Hanson Kansas City Chiefs. Those are the types of talented players we will lose to the competition in the Patriot League without a healthy NIL program. Not to mention that Coach Paulson lost 2 players to NIL deals at other schools this past year. Don't think those great freshman he brought in this year won't be approached by schools with NIL money. This is the world of collegiate sports now. Like it or not. Just know what dharry and I are saying if we don't participate, we won't be very good. If you're good with that then so be it.
|
|
|
Post by Non Alum Dave on Jun 28, 2024 11:46:05 GMT -5
The problem for me (not that anyone should care) is that there are no guarantees, or a view of a ceiling on all this. Having the great luck that I do with money, I could just imagine plucking down major bucks in hoping to keep a kid here, only to have him bolt anyway.
Having said that, I did feel a twang of guilt in being email shamed (kidding) by Coach Paulsen. I added a few pesos to my annual meager donation to Men's Basketball. We're talking a few extra post game pizzas.
|
|
|
Post by sader1970 on Jun 28, 2024 11:49:47 GMT -5
All of these in your example are grad students that left HC only after graduating. They couldn't come back. Couldn't they have left last year for the NIL money? Matt in fact stayed as we all know, for his last semester just so he'd get his HC diploma. It's individual priorities. My clear takeaway is that both DP and DC are looking for student-athletes (and/or their parents) smart enough to see further down the road than immediate NIL payoff.
OK, put me in your "Holy Cross arrogant" category if you think I fit there. I can live with that criticism.
Finally, you guys are doing what you think is the right thing for Holy Cross and our athletes. As I've posted before, I appreciate what you are trying to do. Right now, and not for the foreseeable future, I won't be jumping on your bandwagon but think nothing less of anyone who does. Maybe just a different world view?
|
|
|
Post by Non Alum Dave on Jun 28, 2024 11:54:57 GMT -5
Also want to say it would be a real shame if the money thing ends up causing divisiveness on this board. Would hate to see it mirror the lovely political climate we live in.
|
|
|
Post by rgs318 on Jun 28, 2024 12:07:34 GMT -5
NAD...be careful not to use that "p" word too often on here.
|
|
|
Post by football44 on Jun 28, 2024 12:39:39 GMT -5
Also want to say it would be a real shame if the money thing ends up causing divisiveness on this board. Would hate to see it mirror the lovely political climate we live in. Not even an issue. Some of you guys used to root for me back in the 70’s. No divisiveness here guys.
|
|
|
Post by td128 on Jun 28, 2024 12:45:01 GMT -5
Vision Mission Strategy Tactics Programs Values
Each and every business or organization worth its salt has a statement or passage on each of these cornerstones within its' operations.
Many factors go into a market the size and complexity of college and university athletics. Those who might think about matriculating at a school like Holy Cross typically incorporate a review of a wide number of factors in their assessment prior to deciding to come or not come. Anybody fixated on one factor and not understanding that there are multiple factors involved likely would not be looking at HC in the first place. Those who put differing weights on various factors including an NIL are entitled to do so. I am a big believer and proponent of free market capitalism and competition. I am also a big believer that it is always important to understand everything going on in a market so as to thrive and generate positive outcomes.
I am a supporter of our NIL. My friends run it. Do I think it is the sole reason why somebody would or would not matriculate at HC? No, I am not. Additionally, if you speak to parents of current Crusaders and those who have already committed to attending they highlight the entirety of the HC experience as to why they came to HC and value their entire experience.
Last I checked in the midst of the presence of NIL over the last 3-4 years, HC has brought in top rated classes of FB recruits. As a Crusader, I welcome competing and am not going to begin taking a back seat to any other school in the marketplace regardless of whether they offer any sort of NIL or not. If a student chooses not to come to HC because he is being offered an NIL stipend of sorts and that is the sole reason, I might wonder if they understand the Mission of HC in the first place.
We may at some point lose a top rated and regarded Crusader due to perceived better opportunities elsewhere. That will happen. I am a BIG believer, though, that HC will be a meaningfully positive net winner in terms of attracting future Crusaders to Worcester in the current and future environment of college athletics given the ENTIRETY of the HC offering and experience along with what is happening at other schools in the midst of these recent developments. I hear this dynamic repeatedly from many parents including those whose sons have chosen to matriculate at HC despite having offers from schools in leagues within the Group of 5. Our current Crusaders are our best salespeople in that process.
I spend meaningful time developing strong relationships with both our Crusaders and their parents and inquire often why they came to Holy Cross and how their experience has been. The consistent resoundingly positive message from both parents and Crusaders is "no other school offers the full complement of compelling reasons to matriculate as Holy Cross." Even those who have already moved on to other schools for their 5th year after graduating from HC have informed me that their new experiences do not match what they experienced at HC. Think academics, athletic opportunities, facilities, atmosphere on campus, alumni support, the 4-40 mantra. Overall alumni financial support for HCFB has doubled over the last 4-5 years. Why is alumni support for HC MBB in such dire straits? That is what happens when you have 12-15 years of disastrous performance on the court. I am highly confident that CDP will be hugely successful. Why/how do we think he attracted such an outstanding class of recruits this past year?
I have previously stated and welcome repeating that I am hugely bullish on the future of HCFB and HC MBB. For those with less optimistic views on the future, that's ok. Differences of opinions are what make markets. I see the NIL as a transactional factor in the world of college athletics akin to the 'give a man a fish' approach. I am not saying HC should not have an NIL presence but I am saying it should occupy a place within the midst of the entirety of the HC experience and Mission which is intended to be transformative, that is, 'teach a man to fish'.
LET'S WIN!!
Commitment to excellence in helping our Crusaders win on and off the field.
|
|
|
Post by longsuffering on Jun 28, 2024 14:59:00 GMT -5
In today's environment a talented grad transfer can generally expect some dollar amount of NIL inducement. At the Dobbs and Sluka level, HC would likely have to outbid an FBS NIL offer, perhaps by a lot, to keep them. If they stayed at HC they each would be six years out of high school before they got their bachelor degree and they would present NFL scouts with no sustained experience against FBS competition. It almost is squeezing a square peg into a round hole to expect them to come back just because NCAA regs give them each another year of eligibility.
On the other hand, a kid who arrived a little behind physically or skill wise but who has worked his butt off to climb up the ladder and is eligible for a redshirt year, why not come back for the fall semester where all your hard work pays off and you are able to max out your potential? That's a situation where NIL money to help balance the player losing a step in career or grad school progress to come back is a great incentive.
|
|
|
Post by bfoley82 on Jun 29, 2024 10:07:41 GMT -5
All on this board have been so proud of our football success over the past 5 years. To help everyone understand the world of NIL using our past great roster, here you go: Jake Dobbs - JMU- NIL money, Eric Schoen - Duke- NIL money, Pat Mcmurtrie - JMU - NIL money, Luke Newman - Michigan State - NIL money, Matt Sluka - UNLV - NIL money, Jalen Coker Carolina Panthers, CJ Hanson Kansas City Chiefs. Those are the types of talented players we will lose to the competition in the Patriot League without a healthy NIL program. Not to mention that Coach Paulson lost 2 players to NIL deals at other schools this past year. Don't think those great freshman he brought in this year won't be approached by schools with NIL money. This is the world of collegiate sports now. Like it or not. Just know what dharry and I are saying if we don't participate, we won't be very good. If you're good with that then so be it. UNH lost their starting QB to Minnesota and plenty of other schools are being poached. It has to do with the ability to play FBS football over FCS.
|
|
|
Post by alum on Jun 30, 2024 4:24:34 GMT -5
What do we know about the status of NIL at the other PL schools vis a vis HC?
|
|
|
Post by CHC8485 on Jul 10, 2024 10:14:28 GMT -5
The Court is Finished. Not a huge change, but the map is gone, the shield is bigger and the lanes are purple once again.
|
|
|
Post by trimster on Jul 10, 2024 10:55:03 GMT -5
Two thumbs up!
|
|
|
Post by Sons of Vaval on Jul 10, 2024 12:00:59 GMT -5
I was getting my hopes up...
|
|
|
Post by sader1970 on Jul 10, 2024 14:06:02 GMT -5
Whoopee! Happy for all the Mass Map haters.
|
|
|
Post by efg72 on Jul 10, 2024 14:08:56 GMT -5
A modest improvement-- but hard to think of the same tradition- without the Crusader
|
|
|
Post by Ignutz on Jul 10, 2024 14:40:31 GMT -5
Video on goholycross.com.
The "playing floor" looks a bit brighter than it has been.
I like it.
|
|
|
Post by JRGNYR on Jul 10, 2024 14:41:33 GMT -5
The Court is Finished. Not a huge change, but the map is gone, the shield is bigger and the lanes are purple once again. A vast improvement IMO.
|
|
|
Post by alum on Jul 10, 2024 14:49:32 GMT -5
When I walk into the gym, I am more likely to notice the banners for the 1947 and 1954 teams and the great players of old than the design on the floor but I won't miss hearing announcers describe from where in the Commonwealth a shot was taken.
|
|
|
Post by sader1970 on Jul 10, 2024 15:31:13 GMT -5
Since I attend almost every home game in person, do the announcers do that with any regularity? I mean I can understand some really long 3 ball and could imagine 4acre doing that but the guys we have now . . . . . really?
|
|
|
Post by longsuffering on Jul 10, 2024 21:09:31 GMT -5
Not a constant thing like "Bang!" but a town from where a shot was launched is mentioned on occasion.
|
|
|
Post by Crucis#1 on Jul 10, 2024 22:20:59 GMT -5
Occasionally there was mention of a shot from Nantucket or the Vineyard. 🤣
I would expect work will soon begin on the floor of the Blaney Gym, to match the Hart Arena floor.
|
|
|
Post by timholycross on Jul 11, 2024 6:59:54 GMT -5
Occasionally there was mention of a shot from Nantucket or the Vineyard. 🤣 I would expect work will soon begin on the floor of the Blaney Gym, to match the Hart Arena floor. If wear-and-tear at the same rate as the main court, yes.. Otherwise, seems like you don't have to do that.
|
|
|
Post by CHC8485 on Jul 11, 2024 7:24:15 GMT -5
A few pics with a closer look. I like it. And I'd bet Blaney gym has more wear & tear then the main court so it is probably going to be done as well.
|
|
|
Post by JRGNYR on Jul 11, 2024 8:51:51 GMT -5
Call me old-fashioned but I much prefer the sharp, clean look created by the differentiation of the light floor and the royal purple.
I'm largely indifferent on the HC and the shield, honestly. I think it might look more authoritative (regal?) if the interlocking HC included letters with straight lines and right angles, similar to the interlocking HC shared earlier in the thread - whatever that font is. But again, just my opinion and not a dealbreaker for me.
I'm also not a fan of the font used for "Holy Cross" on the baseline. I think that could be better, but overall I think the look in totality is sharper and better.
|
|