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Post by hcpride on Jan 22, 2018 9:20:57 GMT -5
One of our offers earlier this year verbally committed to Sacred Heart University instead - lets hope the Chesney Era reverses this trend.
Dec 20, 2017 at 8:33pm breezy said: Here is where things stand with respect to 2018 recruiting (subject, of course, to available public sources). As of December 20, 2017 -- 119 known offers, 11 committed to HC, 89 committed to other schools, 19 offerees still uncommitted. A look at the schools chosen by the 89 recruits who turned down HC demonstrates, in my opinion, that HC is aiming high and is not just going after the "low-hanging fruit." Harvard -- 5 Yale -- 4 Navy -- 4 William & Mary -- 4 Delaware -- 4 Princeton -- 4 North Dakota State -- 3 Two each to -- Buffalo, Purdue, Richmond, Bowling Green, Wake Forest, Toledo, Charlotte, Temple, Army, Villanova, Air Force, Lehigh, Fordham. One each to -- Tulsa, Arkansas State, Penn State, UCLA, Furman, Boston College, UConn, Cincinnati, Arizona, Wisconsin, Houston, Ball State, UAB, Virginia, Michigan State, USF, Wofford, Central Arkansas, Penn, Missouri State, UMass, Columbia, Lafayette, Rice, Troy, Nevada, Cornell, Bucknell, Washington State, Ohio State, Colorado, Liberty, Sacred Heart, Georgetown, Liberty.
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Post by purplehaze on Jan 22, 2018 9:25:54 GMT -5
Should we be offering full-4 yr shcolarships to players who are choosing between HC and NEC schools? I'd rather hold on to that schollie for next year if that's the best we can do this year.
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Post by hchoops on Jan 22, 2018 9:31:03 GMT -5
Did we offer a full schollie ?
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Post by breezy on Jan 22, 2018 10:19:22 GMT -5
We do not know, and it is most likely that we would not know.
As we have discussed previously, recruiting in FCS football means trying to build a roster of 90 (PL maximum) with 60 scholarships. It follows that only a certain portion of your roster can be built with full scholarships (best estimate is approximately 40). The remainder of the roster has to be built with partial scholarships or full-pay walk-ons. (One aspect of the PL rules is that if a recruited player is added to the roster and gets need-based aid, that is counted against the 60-scholarship maximum allowed by the PL -- understandably, perhaps, to keep a level playing field, but the practical result is that walk-ons generally have to be full-pay students.)
So there will be many instances when a player offered a partial scholarship by HC may be offered (and accept) a full scholarship to another school. This is all behind the scenes and never disclosed (unless the player chooses to disclose it -- which is very rare). I guess you are free to speculate about it, but it seems to me to be a fruitless exercise.
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Post by sader1970 on Jan 22, 2018 10:27:43 GMT -5
breezy, you've been on Crossports long enough to know that posters here are experts at fruitless exercises.
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Post by richh on Jan 22, 2018 10:29:05 GMT -5
We do not know, and it is most likely that we would not know. As we have discussed previously, recruiting in FCS football means trying to build a roster of 90 (PL maximum) with 60 scholarships. It follows that only a certain portion of your roster can be built with full scholarships (best estimate is approximately 40). The remainder of the roster has to be built with partial scholarships or full-pay walk-ons. (One aspect of the PL rules is that if a recruited player is added to the roster and gets need-based aid, that is counted against the 60-scholarship maximum allowed by the PL -- understandably, perhaps, to keep a level playing field, but the practical result is that walk-ons generally have to be full-pay students.) So there will be many instances when a player offered a partial scholarship by HC may be offered (and accept) a full scholarship to another school. This is all behind the scenes and never disclosed (unless the player chooses to disclose it -- which is very rare). I guess you are free to speculate about it, but it seems to me to be a fruitless exercise. One additional category. PL allows 3 true WOs. Any need aid they receive apparently does not count vs cap.
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Post by A Clock Tower Purple on Jan 22, 2018 10:40:43 GMT -5
Should we be offering full-4 yr shcolarships to players who are choosing between HC and NEC schools? I'd rather hold on to that schollie for next year if that's the best we can do this year. ? ? ?
'haze - do you not think that some NEC student athletes could have/can help HC given what we've seen on the field the last several years?
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Post by purplehaze on Jan 22, 2018 11:16:15 GMT -5
Two points: - to yours above, unfortunately the answer is 'yes', but likely not able to help us beat the teams on our future schedules. Therefore, I prefer that this staff keep a couple of schollies for next year if they can't get what they really want
- I had a discussion with a member of the athletic staff in the fall and asked the question abt % of schollie players on full rides - without hesitation he said 80-85% ('we need to do that to get them') - maybe that % will come down with Chesney, and that might be a good thing - hard to say
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Post by hcpride on Jan 22, 2018 12:48:30 GMT -5
Should we be offering full-4 yr shcolarships to players who are choosing between HC and NEC schools? I'd rather hold on to that schollie for next year if that's the best we can do this year. I may be misunderstanding your question but NEC football and Patriot League football were quite comparable this year. Edge to NEC 3-1 this year. Central Connecticut, Duquesne, and Bryant were ranked above Holy Cross with St Frances and Wagner just below. (And Central Connecticut was ranked over Patriot League champion Lehigh). So yes, at this point we should be offering full scholarships to some NEC and Patriot League-level players.
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Post by richh on Jan 22, 2018 13:25:59 GMT -5
Some perspective. Lehigh started out with a 40-20 split in schollies. While we've gotten a lot of good players the overall system has not helped results. Over the last 2 yrs we have switched to practically all full rides. The increase in talent has been appreciable. Putting the academic snobbery of some aside, NEC has become at least comparable to the PL. NEC awards 45 full rides plus need aid to the NCAA cap of 63. Why would a kid pass up a PL offer for an NEC team? Easy, he got a better offer. It is becoming more common each year. Lehigh lost a very good OL prospect to the Dukes for that very reason.
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Post by breezy on Jan 22, 2018 18:38:33 GMT -5
Two more reports of visits and offers during the weekend. Both are kickers/punters. OFFER #130: K/P GRIFFIN CERRA, 6-0, 160, Cardinal Gibbons HS, Fort Lauderdale, FL Twitter: @griffincerra Hudl highlights: www.hudl.com/profile/5408328/Griffin-CerraAlso has offers from Jacksonville, Valparaiso, and Stetson. (It appears that his older brother is on the Colgate football roster; also a kicker/punter.) OFFER #131: K/P MATTHEW TRICKETT, 6-0, 185, St. Ignatius HS, Cleveland, OH Twitter: @matt_trickett2 Hudl highlights: www.hudl.com/profile/4086567/Matthew-TrickettAlso has an offer from Kent State. (Teammate of HC incoming freshman Connor Kennedy.)
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Post by breezy on Jan 22, 2018 20:45:16 GMT -5
VERBAL COMMIT #14 (3RD VERBAL COMMIT of the late signing period), OL JACK McCAULEY, 6-4, 270, Westfield HS, Westfield, NJ Twitter: @jackfmccauley6 Hudl highlights: www.hudl.com/profile/4547471/Jack-McCauleyNo information on other offers. Westfield has won three straight state championships and will carry a 37-game winning streak into the 2018 season.
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Jan 22, 2018 21:37:18 GMT -5
Welcome aboard!! Love getting guys from dominant programs
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Jan 22, 2018 22:23:55 GMT -5
Some perspective. Lehigh started out with a 40-20 split in schollies. While we've gotten a lot of good players the overall system has not helped results. Over the last 2 yrs we have switched to practically all full rides. The increase in talent has been appreciable. Putting the academic snobbery of some aside, NEC has become at least comparable to the PL. NEC awards 45 full rides plus need aid to the NCAA cap of 63. Why would a kid pass up a PL offer for an NEC team? Easy, he got a better offer. It is becoming more common each year. Lehigh lost a very good OL prospect to the Dukes for that very reason. richh, very interesting. If a PL school rostered 52 full (which is 80-85 percent of the total fin aid) and 16 partials (half scollies) for a total of 68, they could be offering less total aid than a NEC school with 45 full, 36 need-based partials at 50 percent, and 8 need-based partials at 25 percent, for a total of 85, correct? The PL school goes three-deep on its roster with scollies, and the NEC school goes four-deep. It would not surprise me that a PL school typically would have 10-12 scollie players unable to play at any oone time because they are injured, With concussion protocols these days, perhaps a change in the rules is needed so that football rosters don't become depleted of scollie players.
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Post by richh on Jan 22, 2018 23:20:40 GMT -5
Some perspective. Lehigh started out with a 40-20 split in schollies. While we've gotten a lot of good players the overall system has not helped results. Over the last 2 yrs we have switched to practically all full rides. The increase in talent has been appreciable. Putting the academic snobbery of some aside, NEC has become at least comparable to the PL. NEC awards 45 full rides plus need aid to the NCAA cap of 63. Why would a kid pass up a PL offer for an NEC team? Easy, he got a better offer. It is becoming more common each year. Lehigh lost a very good OL prospect to the Dukes for that very reason. richh, very interesting. If a PL school rostered 52 full (which is 80-85 percent of the total fin aid) and 16 partials (half scollies) for a total of 68, they could be offering less total aid than a NEC school with 45 full, 36 need-based partials at 50 percent, and 8 need-based partials at 25 percent, for a total of 85, correct? The PL school goes three-deep on its roster with scollies, and the NEC school goes four-deep. It would not surprise me that a PL school typically would have 10-12 scollie players unable to play at any oone time because they are injured, With concussion protocols these days, perhaps a change in the rules is needed so that football rosters don't become depleted of scollie players. You got it.And they dont have roster caps. We may get more top level talent but overall they can have better teams at least at the top.
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Post by HCFC45 on Jan 22, 2018 23:57:10 GMT -5
Breezy: You are to be commended for the outstanding job you have done and continue to do regarding tracking recruiting!
You are as committed to HC Football as anyone!
Thoroughly enjoy all that you post!
Enjoy your posts and keep up the good work! !
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Post by alum on Jan 23, 2018 7:43:43 GMT -5
We can debate the allocation of scholarships all we want, but it is important to remember that each kid has his own thought process for choosing a school. It seems to me that the kids we are recruiting have three items to consider: potential playing time, cost to them, and the academic qualities of the school. The problem in evaluating why we get some kids and don't get others is that we don't know how the recruits rank those factors. Some choose an Ivy even if they have to pay some of the cost because they view the education and the connections worth it. Some who would appear to be reasonably affluent have spent a lot of money on houses and Catholic school and AAU basketball and supporting Grandma in a nursing home are attracted by the full scholarship. Others just want to go someplace they can play right away and, because they can afford it or because they will get plenty of non athletic aid, might even forego the D1 chase entirely and look at a NESCAC.
Heck, to switch to basketball for a second, MH went home to Nebraska to play at the equivalent of UMASS-Lowell. While we can't fathom how someone would give up an HC education for that, it happens.
The important thing is that the coaching staff has to figure out each kid's motivation and see what they can do to meet his needs.
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Post by HC92 on Jan 23, 2018 8:03:53 GMT -5
I think the perceived “fit” with future coaches and teammates is a big factor as well. I know of one student-athlete who chose Fordham over HC primarily due to a better “connection” with the coaches. Given that coaches come and go all the time, that probably shouldn’t be at the top of the list but it is very important to a lot of kids.
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Post by worcester on Jan 23, 2018 14:14:29 GMT -5
We can debate the allocation of scholarships all we want, but it is important to remember that each kid has his own thought process for choosing a school. It seems to me that the kids we are recruiting have three items to consider: potential playing time, cost to them, and the academic qualities of the school. The problem in evaluating why we get some kids and don't get others is that we don't know how the recruits rank those factors. Some choose an Ivy even if they have to pay some of the cost because they view the education and the connections worth it. Some who would appear to be reasonably affluent have spent a lot of money on houses and Catholic school and AAU basketball and supporting Grandma in a nursing home are attracted by the full scholarship. Others just want to go someplace they can play right away and, because they can afford it or because they will get plenty of non athletic aid, might even forego the D1 chase entirely and look at a NESCAC. Heck, to switch to basketball for a second, MH went home to Nebraska to play at the equivalent of UMASS-Lowell. While we can't fathom how someone would give up an HC education for that, it happens. The important thing is that the coaching staff has to figure out each kid's motivation and see what they can do to meet his needs. If playing time is a consideration then you don't want that person. You want someone who wants to earn their time.
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Post by alum on Jan 23, 2018 14:52:05 GMT -5
If playing time is a consideration then you don't want that person. You want someone who wants to earn their time. That sounds great but it is just not true. I am not talking about kids who think that they are owed something. I am talking about a kid with some choices who can separate the money piece out and pick a school. I don't think that there is anything wrong with letting playing time be a factor. For example, I wouldn't mind getting the kid who would rather have a chance to play right away at the FCS level than go through an almost mandatory redshirt season at UCONN or UMASS and then be fourth on the depth chart on a 85 player roster. Basketball players certainly make decisions based upon early playing time at their position all of the time.
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Post by worcester on Jan 23, 2018 15:03:11 GMT -5
If playing time is a consideration then you don't want that person. You want someone who wants to earn their time. That sounds great but it is just not true. I am not talking about kids who think that they are owed something. I am talking about a kid with some choices who can separate the money piece out and pick a school. I don't think that there is anything wrong with letting playing time be a factor. For example, I wouldn't mind getting the kid who would rather have a chance to play right away at the FCS level than go through an almost mandatory redshirt season at UCONN or UMASS and then be fourth on the depth chart on a 85 player roster. Basketball players certainly make decisions based upon early playing time at their position all of the time. I'm not saying players don't make a decision based on playing time, however it shouldn't be a factor. You choose a school for the school and the athletic program. I've seen wayyyyyyyy too many athletes let playing time be a factor and are disappointed because things didn't work out. Why do you think there are more athletes transferring now than ever before?
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Post by richh on Jan 23, 2018 17:06:44 GMT -5
Of course playing time is a consideration. For the vast majority of PL recruits it is not the #1 priority. Where it does become important is with H2H between 2 PL schools. Lehigh lost out on a WR a few years ago to a PL squad because that team could ( and did) put him on the field immediately. Agree if that is his primary issue, I would rather not recruit him.
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Post by hcpride on Jan 23, 2018 17:28:52 GMT -5
I hear FCS kids reference geography (friends and parents can come see them play) and program quality (team competitive in their conference year after year). Of course those might not be paramount and will vary from recruit to recruit in any case.
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Post by breezy on Jan 23, 2018 21:02:36 GMT -5
VERBAL COMMIT #15 (4TH VERBAL COMMIT of the late signing period). DB ALEX SLOAN, 6-3, 185, Rumson-Fair Haven HS, Rumson, NJ Twitter: @alexsl0an Hudl highlights: www.hudl.com/profile/9017768/Alex-SloanTook official visit to HC this past weekend; no information on other offers
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Jan 23, 2018 21:17:03 GMT -5
Nice to see that he made his commitment even though his official visit came during a quiet period on campus. Would I be correct in guessing that some current football players come back from break early to lift weights and entertain recruits??
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