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Post by conshycrusader on Feb 19, 2019 20:04:13 GMT -5
Matt Colangelo (safeties coach) to take job at Nova
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Post by efg72 on Feb 19, 2019 20:09:56 GMT -5
This makes you wonder Are we not paying assistant coaches a fair salary? Is there no room for advancement? Is it assistants with limited voice? A bunch of other Qs
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Post by HC92 on Feb 19, 2019 20:10:51 GMT -5
He’s not afraid to move around. Since 2015, he has been at Assumption, Yale, Villanova, HC and Villanova again.
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Post by gks on Feb 19, 2019 20:17:11 GMT -5
Young coaches move all the time. What's his new role at Villanova? It's more than likely a step up. Can't blame him.
And yes...HC needs to pay their assistants more.
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Post by HC92 on Feb 19, 2019 20:25:46 GMT -5
This makes you wonder Are we not paying assistant coaches a fair salary? Is there no room for advancement? Is it assistants with limited voice? A bunch of other Qs I think just part of reality at our level. Assistant coaches are going to move around. This guy has had 5 jobs in 5 seasons. He obviously likes Chesney having played for him and coached with him at both Assumption and HC. Maybe he got another 6k per year. Or maybe he has a girlfriend in Philly. Not going to worry much about it.
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Post by southerncross on Feb 19, 2019 23:40:29 GMT -5
He may have “liked” Coach Chesney, but at some point respect has to come into play. Particularly after accepting a position with a coach who brought you into a program which you knew would take some time to build. Also, I’m pretty sure he would have known his salary ceiling for at least the first couple of seasons. Like.......maybe. Respect.......nah.
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Post by rgs318 on Feb 20, 2019 8:38:48 GMT -5
He may have “liked” Coach Chesney, but at some point respect has to come into play. Particularly after accepting a position with a coach who brought you into a program which you knew would take some time to build. Also, I’m pretty sure he would have known his salary ceiling for at least the first couple of seasons. Like.......maybe. Respect.......nah. I don't quite follow. Are you implying that the coach left because he did not respect Chesney? Where did that come from?
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Post by joe on Feb 20, 2019 8:59:31 GMT -5
If it is true that HC pays assistants non-competitive salaries, one would logically question allotting 97M for facility upgrades rather than investing in coaching.
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Post by rgs318 on Feb 20, 2019 9:10:14 GMT -5
The two are not an either/or match. Both were/are important. If HC is seen as a step up with the possibility of a better salary and position down the road, that is no necessarily a bad ting. I do wonder, as the number of coaches dwindles, when we will see some new names added to our staff,
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Post by joe on Feb 20, 2019 9:14:05 GMT -5
Just common sense. if you spend 97M in facilities in order to win, but do not hire coaches who give you the best chance of winning, you will have wasted 97M. Could have told Mr. and Mrs. Luth to keep their money in the stock market and CDs.
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Post by rgs318 on Feb 20, 2019 9:17:08 GMT -5
Two separate issues that IMHO show neither common sense or logic requiring they be put together. This is simply a personal belief. A valid belief for you, but not necessarily the dire extreme you seem to see in it.
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Post by gks on Feb 20, 2019 9:28:54 GMT -5
If it is true that HC pays assistants non-competitive salaries, one would logically question allotting 97M for facility upgrades rather than investing in coaching. Don't think the Luth's and others would have been too happy if the money they donated specifically for the athletic center was then spent somewhere else. Priority for new AD is get the high-profile sports coaching positions endowed. That will free up money for assistants who are ridiculously under paid at HC (talking football here). When you have a young staff that's well-regarded in the world of coaching this is going to happen. No idea what Colangelo's new position is at Villanova but I'm sure it's a step up. Chesney will find a qualified replacement. Coaches want to work with him. Just got to keep the money somewhat competitive.
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Post by sader1970 on Feb 20, 2019 9:36:01 GMT -5
I do recall that someone posted that Chesney requested and was granted a (slightly?) lower personal salary in order to free up some money to pay more for his assistants. That said, while I am sure Holy Cross is not overpaying its assistant coaches, I would be surprised if they were being grossly underpaid. And recall, too, that the cost of living is less than at some other locations and salaries would be reflective of that.
I would be surprised if Villanova didn't pay more for a similar position and I don't recall seeing here if he is taking a lateral position or a promotion.
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Post by joe on Feb 20, 2019 9:45:34 GMT -5
My point is that by accepting such an incredibly generous amount of money from the Luth family in order to advance HC athletics, no matter how the family directed that money to be spent, and then not following-up on this IMMEDIATELY with a top-down recommitment to being more competitive, including paying highly competitive coaching salaries and dozens of other ancillary things, I, personally, can see how this could be viewed as a slap in the face to this family. We can agree to disagree on this, but that money could have fed the poor of Worcester for decades. If you're going to spend it on something as ultimately frivolous as college athletics, you might as well do it right, otherwise decline it. It's like building a mansion in Beverly Hills without indoor plumbing. If you're going to do it, do it right.
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Feb 20, 2019 10:52:08 GMT -5
2016-17 / Assistant coaches Men's Team, Average Annual Institutional Salary per FTE (Number of FTEs)
Bucknell $51508 (20) Colgate $51502 (20) Holy Cross $53281 (19) Lafayette $65755 (14) Lehigh $49199 (24)
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Post by hc87 on Feb 20, 2019 10:58:37 GMT -5
FTE? Short for full-time assistant coaches?
If so, we look fairly competitive within the Core 5 PL anyway. Wonder how it compares to the Ivies or CAA for football?
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Post by gks on Feb 20, 2019 11:08:46 GMT -5
2016-17 / Assistant coaches Men's Team, Average Annual Institutional Salary per FTE (Number of FTEs) Bucknell $51508 (20) Colgate $51502 (20) Holy Cross $53281 (19) Lafayette $65755 (14) Lehigh $49199 (24) This tells us nothing. You could have a coordinator making 100K and a lower positional assistant making 15K and you get your average.
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Post by joe on Feb 20, 2019 11:10:33 GMT -5
FTE? Short for full-time assistant coaches? If so, we look fairly competitive within the Core 5 PL anyway. Wonder how it compares to the Ivies or CAA for football?
Numbers are numbers. How many coaches? How is the money distributed? Useless data, IMO.
Eyeball test baby. Eyeball test.
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Post by southerncross on Feb 20, 2019 15:17:43 GMT -5
He may have “liked” Coach Chesney, but at some point respect has to come into play. Particularly after accepting a position with a coach who brought you into a program which you knew would take some time to build. Also, I’m pretty sure he would have known his salary ceiling for at least the first couple of seasons. Like.......maybe. Respect.......nah. I don't quite follow. Are you implying that the coach left because he did not respect Chesney? Where did that come from? Where I come from respect & loyalty are synonymous.
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Feb 20, 2019 15:37:49 GMT -5
FTE? Short for full-time assistant coaches? If so, we look fairly competitive within the Core 5 PL anyway. Wonder how it compares to the Ivies or CAA for football? It is less than the Ivies, and probably less than the CAA. Solve for X: Football expenses comprised of four categories: operating expenses, fin aid, recruiting, coaches salaries. For the 2015-16 academic year: School Total expenses - operating expenses - scollie aid = $ for coaches and recruiting Assumptions: 60 scollies for PL except Georgetown @ $60,000 a scollie Richmond & Villanova at 63 scollies./ $ in thousands Bucknell 4600 - 440 - 3600 = $560 (Bucknell scollie aid assumption is probably too high) Colgate 5630 - 640 - 3600 = $1390 HC 5320 -400 -3600 - = $1320 Georgetown 1825 -445 - 0 = $1380 Lafayette 5625 -545 -3600 = $1480 Lehigh 4955 -545 -3600 = $810 Harvard 2785 - 385 -0 = $2400 Princeton 2820 -470 -0 = $2350 Richmond 6795 -1090 -3780 = $1925 Villanova 6565 -1370 -3780 = $1405 Yale 3460 -650 - 0 = $2810 Recruiting expenses: all men's teamsColgate $343000 HC $328000 Harvard $816000 Princeton $819000 Richmond $357000 Villanova $313000 Yale $716000 THe Ivies, while fielding more sports, spend $400-500K more on recruiting than does the PL or CAA. The Ivies, with a JV team, are allowed by the NCAA, to have one additional assistant coacxh. This data suggests that Colgate, HC, and Georgetown pay football coaches similarly, about $1.0-1.1 million total,
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Post by joe on Feb 20, 2019 15:57:15 GMT -5
Brutal.
Pay more; get more.
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Post by sader1970 on Feb 20, 2019 16:06:59 GMT -5
The question for Phreek is less about the numbers he quotes but the source. NCAA? Self-reported? NY Times? Whatever.
Assuming these are accurate numbers (some might not accept that assumption), I believe the number of assistants in any sport is either required by the NCAA or PL to be either exactly or roughly the same for each school. If those assumptions/understandings are correct, then the average salaries for assistants do matter and are a valid comparison. Who cares if a defensive coordinator makes more than the offensive coordinator or that either of those makes more than the linebackers coach? It all averages out.
I believe that the PL assistants, our direct competitors, pay approximately the same as HC. Obviously less than the Ivies or FBS schools. The guy we lost to Villanova is undoubtedly making more money there than at Holy Cross or he sees his long term career prospects better there. Good for him. To me, that's not a reflection on Holy Cross as much as it is the environment in which we exist.
As for the investment in LAC, I have heard directly from coaches and players that it has helped our recruiting immensely. It gives us an advantage that our competitors don't have. But that does not and will not translate into higher salaries for our coaches. It just makes their jobs a little easier.
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Feb 20, 2019 16:33:55 GMT -5
The source is the Title IX reports (which are public). The Title IX reports are derived from the annual reports by schools to the NCAA on revenues and expenses (no private school has ever released its NCAA reports to my knowledge).. For 2016-17 for all FCS schools, for football. Median salary/benefits of head coach was $267,000 Median total salaries/benefits for assistant coaches was $667,000 Source: p. 81 www.ncaa.org/sites/default/files/2017RES_D1-RevExp_Entire_2017_Final_20180123.pdf^^^ This is the summary of all the individual school NCAA reports.
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Post by sader1970 on Feb 20, 2019 17:55:42 GMT -5
Thank you, Phreek.
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Feb 20, 2019 19:27:51 GMT -5
To answer IH's question, FTE is full time equivalent. For example, if a coach of a minor sport only worked six months of a year, he/she would be counted as 0.5 FTE. __________________________________________
One other thing about coaches' salaries. I excluded Fordham from my sample as it appears that Fordham coaches are paid comparatively more to offset the higher cost of living in NYC as well as a higher tax burden. The same appears to go for coaches at BostonU, who are coaching for an institution in a high cost metropolitan area. One need only look at the sale price of homes on City View and nearby streets to realize one can buy, for the sane amount of money, a lot more house in Worcester than, for example, in Brookline.
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