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Post by Sons of Vaval on Sept 19, 2019 19:00:46 GMT -5
The only thing that counts is the commitments. Many of our stronger players were under recruited. Tim Szatko, for example. Kevin Hamilton also.Torey Thomas was a spring signee. It's great when we catch lightning in a bottle, but I would hope that's not the strategy Nelson employs. I'd like to compete with the Ivies, Bucknell, and A10 for recruits, again.
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Post by efg72 on Sept 19, 2019 19:07:10 GMT -5
Here is the thing to remember
After the top 150 kids those ranked in the top 1500 can play. Most ratings are based on athletic ability and not basketball skills
These kids play 80 plus games a year in AAU, 20 Summer league games, and another 25-30 in HS
For us the options on our menu should not be limited. Having coached AAU for longer than I care to admit , and I say this all the time, these coaches follow recruiting sheets and recruit the same kids so if they lose a kid or the player doesn’t work out they can say schools x,y, and z were involved, and yes I know most of you will disagree.
I believe at HC we we were much better off when the staff received info about prospects from former players/ alums with a sense of the game, the program, the style and the school.
Recruiting changed dramatically for the program many years ago
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Post by timholycross on Sept 19, 2019 23:16:56 GMT -5
What do you think caused that to change?
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Post by WorcesterGray on Sept 20, 2019 5:35:48 GMT -5
C.J. Jones taking an OV to BU this weekend.
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Post by efg72 on Sept 20, 2019 6:32:02 GMT -5
What do you think caused that to change? Technology brought about more complete scouting reports-early on we had Tommy and Howard issuing the 5* reports, Clark Francis with Hoop Scoop and there were one or two others. These reports came in the mail and Tommy Ks was the best of the bunch. camps and tournaments were limited, there were fewer open gyms which meant in many cases you went to school where your had relationships -HC was in NE and metro NYC and occasionally DC. The speed and access to information today with complete information/reports, videos posted, social media etc the coaches recruit differently and depending on budgets are involved in global recruiting efforts. I would bet many posters on this board would pass on info to the staff about certain players in Boston, DC, Detroit, and New York that would be acknowledged. The school recruited regionally and these networks were helpful to the process. People like Hoops, John Carrington, Paul G, Kevin and about 10 others of us were regularly involved that might continue in some ways today but also is very different hoops and others might have additional thoughts or even a different perspective
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Post by hchoops on Sept 20, 2019 7:05:29 GMT -5
Thorough and accurate
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Post by trimster on Sept 20, 2019 7:48:04 GMT -5
I can remember anxiously awaiting my next edition of Eastern Basketball Magazine to arrive in the mail.
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Post by WorcesterGray on Sept 20, 2019 8:21:09 GMT -5
Cutting through all the palaver about how the recruiting process has changed/evolved to HC's disadvantage . . .
1. It has changed/evolved for everybody, not just Holy Cross. The process is essentially the same for us as it is for our PL brethren and other low/mid-majors. 2. No change in the recruiting process is a valid excuse for why we are failing to compete with Bucknell, Lehigh, Colgate, BU, and other low/mid-majors. They are all operating under the same rules and in similar environments - they are getting it done, we haven't been. 3. Competing offers are an imperfect, but useful, gauge of a school's ability to attract the best talent. Colgate just got a commitment from Sam Thomson, a big with 20 offers, including from Bucknell, Lehigh, BU, and Penn. BU just got a commitment from Miles Brewster, who had 10 offers, including ones from Bucknell, Lehigh, and three Ivies (including Yale). This is the field we need to play on, all the time, or we are destined to be a perennial second-division team in the conference. Relying on finding kids in unexplored niches is a strategy that may work once in awhile, but not often.
The best current test for whether we can play on that field is Mike Rabinovich, the big from Worcester Academy. We gave him his first high-quality offer this summer - since then Brown and three other PL schools (including Lehigh) have made offers. This is the kind of battle (especially for bigs) that we need to start winning
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Post by bigfan on Sept 20, 2019 8:56:58 GMT -5
Eastern Basketball Magazine was the best. I always looked forward to the next issue.
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Post by efg72 on Sept 20, 2019 9:00:58 GMT -5
Cutting through all the palaver about how the recruiting process has changed/evolved to HC's disadvantage . . .
1. It has changed/evolved for everybody, not just Holy Cross. The process is essentially the same for us as it is for our PL brethren and other low/mid-majors. 2. No change in the recruiting process is a valid excuse for why we are failing to compete with Bucknell, Lehigh, Colgate, BU, and other low/mid-majors. They are all operating under the same rules and in similar environments - they are getting it done, we haven't been. 3. Competing offers are an imperfect, but useful, gauge of a school's ability to attract the best talent. Colgate just got a commitment from Sam Thomson, a big with 20 offers, including from Bucknell, Lehigh, BU, and Penn. BU just got a commitment from Miles Brewster, who had 10 offers, including ones from Bucknell, Lehigh, and three Ivies (including Yale). This is the field we need to play on, all the time, or we are destined to be a perennial second-division team in the conference. Relying on finding kids in unexplored niches is a strategy that may work once in awhile, but not often. The best current test for whether we can play on that field is Mike Rabinovich, the big from Worcester Academy. We gave him his first high-quality offer this summer - since then Brown and three other PL schools (including Lehigh) have made offers. This is the kind of battle (especially for bigs) that we need to start winning Not sure change that has been described in any of the posts suggests it works to HC disadvantage at all-- The process has changed, the number of kids capable of playing has increased, and while there is more information to digest, it still requires hard work, relationships and execution. we need to be better
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Post by Non Alum Dave on Sept 20, 2019 9:41:41 GMT -5
I can remember anxiously awaiting my next edition of Eastern Basketball Magazine to arrive in the mail. I still have 1 or 2 of those hanging around the house. What a great publication that was!
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Post by WorcesterGray on Sept 20, 2019 11:25:31 GMT -5
HOLY CROSS OFFERS. As of September 20th.
PG - Kaden Metheny (WV - University HS), 5-10. Offers from Penn, URI, William and Mary, a few MAC schools, and others. COMMITTED TO BOWLING GREEN.
CG – Da’Jion Humphrey (MI – Southfield Christian), 6-2. Offers from Cleveland St., Sam Houston St., Brown, Kent St. CG - Tyler Kolek (RI - St. George's), 6-3. Other offers from Penn, Bucknell, Richmond, Towson, Lehigh, Vermont, several more. COMMITTED TO GEORGE MASON. CG – Sebastien Lamaute (CAN – College Jean de Brebeuf), 6-3. Interest from Vermont, BC. SG – C.J. Jones (VT – Vermont Academy), 6-5. Offers from Penn, Bucknell, Vermont, several others.
SF - Judson Martindale (MA - Worcester Academy), 6-6. Offers from Bucknell, Vermont, BU, American, Fairfield, others.
PF - Sam Thomson (MA - Brooks School), 6-9. Other offers from multiple PL and Ivy schools, Vermont, Wofford, Canisius, etc. COMMITTED TO COLGATE PF - Andrew Carr (PA - West Chester HS), 6-9. Offers from Delaware, LaSalle, Stony Brook, Dartmouth, Army, Navy, others. COMMITTED TO DELAWARE. PF - Reece Brown (CT - Loomis Chaffee School), 6-8. Offers from Wisconsin, Georgetown, Richmond, UMass, St. Louis, Rutgers, Delaware, BU, multiple MAAC schools . . . PF – Michael Rabinovich (MA – Worcester Academy), 6-9. Offers from Brown, Lehigh, American, BU, UMBC, Hartford, UNH, Sacred Heart.
C - Noel Brown (VA - Flint Hill), 6-11. Other offers from St. Bonaventure, Bucknell, Fairfield, Robert Morris, Colgate, URI, Lehigh, Brown, others. COMMITTED TO GEORGE WASHINGTON.
INTEREST ONLY.
PG – Shemar Rathan-Mayes (CAN – Orangeville Prep), 5-11. PG – Bryce Howard (CT – Pomfret School), 6-2. PG – Jimmy Edouard (MA – Bristol Prep), 6-0.
SG – Luke Morrison (KY – South Oldham HS), 6-4. SG – Chris Robinson (CT – Westminster School), 6-0.
SF – Connor Kochera (IL – St. Viator HS), 6-4. Offers from Milwaukee, Penn, W&M, Wofford, Furman, others. COMMITTED TO WILLIAM AND MARY. SF – Michael Katsock (DC – St. Alban’s HS), 6-5. SF - Djordje Orcev (MA – Winchendon School), 6-5.
PF – John Adams (MA – Wilbraham-Monson Academy), 6-8. Offers from Navy, UNH, Hartford, Bryant. PF – Mohamed Wague (NY – Frederick Douglas Academy), 6-9. Offers from St. Bonaventure, UMass, Rider, Marist, UNC-Asheville, others. May have HC offer.
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Post by rickii on Sept 21, 2019 9:22:20 GMT -5
Who is Colgate recruiting and who are they recruiting against for those kids?
Certainly not HC/Nelson.
1 kid....and we lost.
Why aren’t we looking in Europe like Colgate?
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Post by HC92 on Sept 21, 2019 18:03:43 GMT -5
Who is Colgate recruiting and who are they recruiting against for those kids? Certainly not HC/Nelson. 1 kid....and we lost. Why aren’t we looking in Europe like Colgate? How do you know we’re not?
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Post by hcgrad94 on Sept 21, 2019 19:57:56 GMT -5
Who is Colgate recruiting and who are they recruiting against for those kids? Certainly not HC/Nelson. 1 kid....and we lost. Why aren’t we looking in Europe like Colgate? You tell us. What does your research tell you?
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Post by bison137 on Sept 21, 2019 21:10:50 GMT -5
Who is Colgate recruiting and who are they recruiting against for those kids? Certainly not HC/Nelson. 1 kid....and we lost. Why aren’t we looking in Europe like Colgate? How do you know we’re not? I don't think Colgate is looking much in Europe. Over the past 20 years, I am only aware of one player they discovered in Europe: Portuguese guard Francisco Amiel, who was primarily a sub for them and far from a difference-maker.
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Post by WorcesterGray on Sept 22, 2019 9:11:01 GMT -5
C.J. Jones on his third OV, this one at Penn. Maximum of two remaining - will Holy Cross earn one?
Bucknell, BU, and Penn . . . sounds familiar. Big test for Nelson's powers of persuasion.
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Post by HC92 on Sept 22, 2019 9:30:46 GMT -5
Is there any reason to think we are in any way in play for Jones? We’re not one of the 15 schools listed on an image apparently created by his prep school. Feeling like we should move on and focus on the guys we’re actively recruiting where there is some mutual interest.
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Post by WorcesterGray on Sept 22, 2019 9:34:40 GMT -5
Is there any reason to think we are in any way in play for Jones?
/photo/1
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Post by rgs318 on Sept 22, 2019 9:38:12 GMT -5
Since the success or lack of success of todays head coaches depends to such a large extent on the quality of their recruits, why do so many posts here make it seem as though the coaches do not know this? Of course Nelson (and company) are recruiting and looking at the talent they want for HC. They are also making ties for now and for the future of their recruiting efforts.
Does anyone expect that it will show up here on CROSSPORTS? Why? As much as I admire and appreciate the research done by some posters to let us know who may have ben contacted by HC, it is still a bit of guesswork. After all, our jobs do not hang on the results of recruiting, but those of the coaches do.
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Post by efg72 on Sept 22, 2019 9:46:07 GMT -5
Given we haven’t seen anything on social media or elsewhere about OVs to HC, I am wondering if our late start in this process is significantly impacting Nelson’s ability to recruit the 2 bigs he wants for the future, and will result in us going after the two best available players?
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Post by WorcesterGray on Sept 22, 2019 9:57:23 GMT -5
Sam Thomson had scheduled an OV at Holy Cross for last weekend, but cancelled it when he committed to Colgate.
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Post by HC92 on Sept 22, 2019 10:46:39 GMT -5
Is there any reason to think we are in any way in play for Jones?
/photo/1
I know we made an offer. I just don’t see anything that suggests we are actually in play for him. In addition to the other realities of our current situation, can’t imagine Coach Popp is a huge HC fan.
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Post by WorcesterGray on Sept 22, 2019 11:03:21 GMT -5
I'm going to assume Nelson wouldn't have offered if he didn't think we had a shot. Also worth noting that the image showing the schools interested in Jones is unchanged since it first was posted in mid July - Holy Cross offered two weeks ago.
We'll see what happens next week.
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Post by possum on Sept 22, 2019 11:34:51 GMT -5
At least he's not a PG, very stiff competition can't remember the last time we won one of these.
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