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Post by timholycross on Jan 18, 2020 22:13:30 GMT -5
Caught a couple minutes, foul every time ball inside the paint. Team has no ability to stop the ball. On target for 28-to possible 30 loss season. Outside of JP, no positives here This is the big problem...defense, at least in the 22 minutes (the last 22) I watched. Almost all the points came from inside, AU 28-44 on two point attempts, 64%; their 8 3 point attempts is as few as I've seen in a college game in quite a while.
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Post by hchoops on Jan 18, 2020 22:20:50 GMT -5
Many/ most of their twos were pull up jumpers.
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Post by Crucis#1 on Jan 18, 2020 22:28:49 GMT -5
The Outside of JP and Austin our guys do not have the upper body muscular strength and lateral foot speed to play competitively a body banging game in the paint. I am sure that Coach Nelson recognizes this issue. Not much he can do with making the required adjustments necessary for this year. The roster was established before he set foot on Mt.St James.
Let’s hope the future rosters contain more JP and Austin type players, physically and mentally tough who want to make constant contact, impose their will and dominate in the lane.
When the staff is recruiting future players, the song from the Fabulous Thunderbirds should be kept in mind “Ain’t that Tough Enough “ to be at Holy Cross and play Sader Basketball. If not, go somewhere else.
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Post by Non Alum Dave on Jan 19, 2020 8:30:51 GMT -5
There's no doubt the lack of defense is killing us.
But I'm still not quite ready to abandon my (pipe) dream of ruining someone's season.
A lot of things have to happen, that's for sure; a perfect purple storm, if you will (needs viewing through purple lenses):
1. First and foremost: no more defections and/or injuries. 2. Hopefully get Kyle back at some point, if for nothing else, to provide a smidgen (rhymes with Pridgen) of much needed defensive help/flexibility. 3. Get Verbeek back to where he can at least sub for 2-3 minutes, and allow the game to shorten for MF. 4. For the coaches: keep the guys working hard. This may be their most important task right now. 5. Get Marlon back to where he was early in the season. Along with Ryan Wade, he's a guy you would want to be on the court in the endgame if you have the lead. But he has to be worthy of being out there. 6. We are probably going to need to have a significant edge in 3 point shooting to pull off an upset (seeing how getting stops have been so difficult). 6.Probably another 5 or 6 things.
In yesterday's game, I thought color guy Aldridge made a good point when he noted that AU made some plays down the stretch whereas HC did not. Thus, a game that was a 2 possession game late turns into what looks like an easy AU victory if you did not watch the game. Can our guys overcome that for ONE game when it counts?
Certainly, Colgate and BU, at least are much more talented right now, and would be tough matchups. But, at least in the case of BU, they are not coached by John Wooden. With Colgate, you would pray for a historic bad shooting night.
Bucknell would be tough because they still possess the winning culture. But they don't look invincible.
After that, is there any team that looks unbeatable?
I don't want to give up on this season (from this perspective), because I think a big win at the end would be extremely beneficial for next year (when we have reinforcements). So, I continue to hope for a miracle.
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Post by WorcesterGray on Jan 19, 2020 8:37:16 GMT -5
Hopefully get Kyle back at some point, if for nothing else, to provide a smidgen (rhymes with Pridgen) of much needed defensive help/flexibility. Only 341 days until Christmas . . .
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Post by hcpride on Jan 19, 2020 9:12:00 GMT -5
The Outside of JP and Austin our guys do not have the upper body muscular strength and lateral foot speed to play competitively a body banging game in the paint. I am sure that Coach Nelson recognizes this issue. Not much he can do with making the required adjustments necessary for this year. The roster was established before he set foot on Mt.St James. Let’s hope the future rosters contain more JP and Austin type players, physically and mentally tough who want to make constant contact, impose their will and dominate in the lane. When the staff is recruiting future players, the song from the Fabulous Thunderbirds should be kept in mind “Ain’t that Tough Enough “ to be at Holy Cross and play Sader Basketball. If not, go somewhere else. Part of successful recruiting at our current PL level (lower mid-major) is to steal a big (6'8") guy with the strength and athleticism to hold his own down low (defense/rebound/block shots) in the PL and not worry about shooting skills. That'll come (if it comes at all) later. The real gem at our level is to land an unpolished big guy like that who is not slow-footed. Think JF as a frosh. I'd settle for the former since we don't have that now but hope at some point I'm looking again at the latter. (We've had the sort of success in the PL and OOC this year you would expect from rotating and fairly nondescript point guards , a hustling shooter still learning his role, an undersized forward who can score quite well in the PL, and some tall string beans who like to shoot from outside the paint.)
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Post by trimster on Jan 19, 2020 9:13:42 GMT -5
The Basketball program must gain institutional stability after this season. Too many coaching changes in the last 10 years, a high number transfers (10) and key members of the athletic administration leaving, has made it extremely difficult to build a winning culture. I hope that the BOT will give ADMB and HCBN the proper support to turn thing around in the next three years. I’m getting old and would like to see a couple of 20 win seasons while I still have cognitive ability to appreciate the victories. I am right there with you. It would be great to be even somewhat relevant again. I was looking at Saint Mary’s College in the West Coast Conference. They are relevant and a lot like HC. Small Catholic college with a gym the size of the Hart Center. I think they are pretty well regarded academically and they pop up on the national scene here and there and are consistently good. We should be able to have a program like Saint Mary’s.
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Post by Non Alum Dave on Jan 19, 2020 9:13:43 GMT -5
I'll tell you one thing - come hell or high water, we've got to hold on that kid. If he ever leaves I'll be pulling a Fred Sanford for sure:
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Post by Non Alum Dave on Jan 19, 2020 10:25:57 GMT -5
Another improvement that needs to happen (and no excuses): the junior trio of AB/MF/CN needs to be shoot free throws in the 70s. They've done it before, they don't have any technique issues that I can see. They are leaving too many points off the board right now.
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Post by WorcesterGray on Jan 19, 2020 10:34:04 GMT -5
Hargis (92.6%), Wade (82.4%), and Verbeek (75%) have been very good. Everybody else is under 70%.
As a team, Holy Cross is just 65.4% from the line, ranked 305th.
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Post by possum on Jan 19, 2020 10:48:08 GMT -5
There's something to be said for learning how to win and to date this team has not grasped that concept. We are in a lot of games coming into the last 5 minutes but its been our opponents making winning plays rather than us. I think losing begets losing and rather than making the necessary plays we're waiting for something bad to happen. While it would be nice to get Copeland back in the mix, so far he has not been dependable from a performance or a durability standpoint. Earlier this year he played 3 strong games in succession then his play tailed off and he's now once again unavailable. Being half way through his junior year it's getting late to be hoping for him to be a positive force.
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Post by Non Alum Dave on Jan 19, 2020 11:04:44 GMT -5
Hard to argue that....
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Post by longsuffering on Jan 19, 2020 11:09:19 GMT -5
There's no doubt the lack of defense is killing us. But I'm still not quite ready to abandon my (pipe) dream of ruining someone's season. A lot of things have to happen, that's for sure; a perfect purple storm, if you will (needs viewing through purple lenses): 1. First and foremost: no more defections and/or injuries. 2. Hopefully get Kyle back at some point, if for nothing else, to provide a smidgen (rhymes with Pridgen) of much needed defensive help/flexibility. 3. Get Verbeek back to where he can at least sub for 2-3 minutes, and allow the game to shorten for MF. 4. For the coaches: keep the guys working hard. This may be their most important task right now. 5. Get Marlon back to where he was early in the season. Along with Ryan Wade, he's a guy you would want to be on the court in the endgame if you have the lead. But he has to be worthy of being out there. 6. We are probably going to need to have a significant edge in 3 point shooting to pull off an upset (seeing how getting stops have been so difficult). 6.Probably another 5 or 6 things. In yesterday's game, I thought color guy Aldridge made a good point when he noted that AU made some plays down the stretch whereas HC did not. Thus, a game that was a 2 possession game late turns into what looks like an easy AU victory if you did not watch the game. Can our guys overcome that for ONE game when it counts? Certainly, Colgate and BU, at least are much more talented right now, and would be tough matchups. But, at least in the case of BU, they are not coached by John Wooden. With Colgate, you would pray for a historic bad shooting night. Bucknell would be tough because they still possess the winning culture. But they don't look invincible. After that, is there any team that looks unbeatable? I don't want to give up on this season (from this perspective), because I think a big win at the end would be extremely beneficial for next year (when we have reinforcements). So, I continue to hope for a miracle. 7. For the coach. Write down something positive about every team member and check off the list during your interviews to be sure you don't forget any one. Tell us (and the team) what every player contributes and what each one is working on to improve. Don't let any more players fall into a black hole of DNP-CD or "unavailable for personal reasons" or simply yanked from their playing time without explanation, and then gone from the team. COMMUNICATE.
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Post by trimster on Jan 19, 2020 11:23:23 GMT -5
That would create a much longer pregame interview for sure. Many kids fall into the DNP status every night in college basketball and I don’t think a coach owes us an explanation why especially if it’s for reasons other than play. That’s just me.
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Post by sader1970 on Jan 19, 2020 11:35:58 GMT -5
Even the AU announcers were aware and brought up multiple times that the HC roster was both inexperienced and thin but they compared that to AU not long ago and said that in another year or two that HC will again be a force in the PL centered around Joe P and Wade who they thought to be very talented and they were high on Brett to take them on that journey to success.
Of course, I am paraphrasing.
P.S. Those same two announcers said when HC was closing the gap that it would be interesting to see if HC could continue because they had proven throughout the season the ability to come back from deficits only to fall short and fade in the end. Prophetic. I think our Crusaders’ reputation for failing to be able to push to a final victory is now common knowledge.
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Post by Non Alum Dave on Jan 19, 2020 11:42:37 GMT -5
We just need the waters to stop churning. If say 2 of the guys coming in next year are at Joe's level (or close to it), things could change in a hurry.
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Jan 19, 2020 11:50:12 GMT -5
There's something to be said for learning how to win and to date this team has not grasped that concept. We are in a lot of games coming into the last 5 minutes but its been our opponents making winning plays rather than us. I think losing begets losing and rather than making the necessary plays we're waiting for something bad to happen. While it would be nice to get Copeland back in the mix, so far he has not been dependable from a performance or a durability standpoint. Earlier this year he played 3 strong games in succession then his play tailed off and he's now once again unavailable. Being half way through his junior year it's getting late to be hoping for him to be a positive force. Kyle Copeland's career to date reminds me of Lawrence Dixon HC 2009--had some promise but was often injured and missed a lot of games
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Post by WorcesterGray on Jan 19, 2020 12:15:26 GMT -5
We just need the waters to stop churning. If say 2 of the guys coming in next year are at Joe's level (or close to it), things could change in a hurry. Hope folks will have a chance to watch the Worcester Academy duo this afternoon. Help is on the way.
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Post by Tom on Jan 19, 2020 17:59:26 GMT -5
7. For the coach. Write down something positive about every team member and check off the list during your interviews to be sure you don't forget any one. Tell us (and the team) what every player contributes and what each one is working on to improve. Don't let any more players fall into a black hole of DNP-CD or "unavailable for personal reasons" or simply yanked from their playing time without explanation, and then gone from the team. COMMUNICATE. As curious as I am about some of these things, I also think some topics are best left behind closed doors. Each player should know where they stand, Fans don't need to know everything
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Post by bringbackcaro on Jan 19, 2020 18:06:41 GMT -5
There's no doubt the lack of defense is killing us. But I'm still not quite ready to abandon my (pipe) dream of ruining someone's season. A lot of things have to happen, that's for sure; a perfect purple storm, if you will (needs viewing through purple lenses): 1. First and foremost: no more defections and/or injuries. 2. Hopefully get Kyle back at some point, if for nothing else, to provide a smidgen (rhymes with Pridgen) of much needed defensive help/flexibility. 3. Get Verbeek back to where he can at least sub for 2-3 minutes, and allow the game to shorten for MF. 4. For the coaches: keep the guys working hard. This may be their most important task right now. 5. Get Marlon back to where he was early in the season. Along with Ryan Wade, he's a guy you would want to be on the court in the endgame if you have the lead. But he has to be worthy of being out there. 6. We are probably going to need to have a significant edge in 3 point shooting to pull off an upset (seeing how getting stops have been so difficult). 6.Probably another 5 or 6 things. In yesterday's game, I thought color guy Aldridge made a good point when he noted that AU made some plays down the stretch whereas HC did not. Thus, a game that was a 2 possession game late turns into what looks like an easy AU victory if you did not watch the game. Can our guys overcome that for ONE game when it counts? Certainly, Colgate and BU, at least are much more talented right now, and would be tough matchups. But, at least in the case of BU, they are not coached by John Wooden. With Colgate, you would pray for a historic bad shooting night. Bucknell would be tough because they still possess the winning culture. But they don't look invincible. After that, is there any team that looks unbeatable? I don't want to give up on this season (from this perspective), because I think a big win at the end would be extremely beneficial for next year (when we have reinforcements). So, I continue to hope for a miracle. 7. For the coach. Write down something positive about every team member and check off the list during your interviews to be sure you don't forget any one. Tell us (and the team) what every player contributes and what each one is working on to improve. Don't let any more players fall into a black hole of DNP-CD or "unavailable for personal reasons" or simply yanked from their playing time without explanation, and then gone from the team. COMMUNICATE. This is Division 1 basketball. Most of these guys should be writing notes to Nelson & HC every day thanking them for a $60k+ per year scholarship when they would have no demand on the “open market.”
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Post by longsuffering on Jan 19, 2020 18:29:48 GMT -5
Pridgen may be the only HC player left with demand on the open market. If we keep him everything else can be chalked up to growing pains and the turnaround begins in the fall. Hopefully.
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Post by rgs318 on Jan 19, 2020 19:52:57 GMT -5
I wonder how the players feel when they hear * That they are not division 1 players (even those they are. players on a division 1 team). * There is only one player with value on this team * The "turnaround" will be done mostly by people who are not yet on the Hill and have not attended one practice at HC.
...and to hear this from people who claim to be their fans. That last point must hurt those players who have stayed with the team and are working their butts off to do what their new coach wants and to make their team better. IMHO they deserve some "better" fans. But, that is probably just the opinion of one man.
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Post by longsuffering on Jan 19, 2020 20:38:09 GMT -5
I wonder how the players feel when they hear * That they are not division 1 players (even those they are. players on a division 1 team). * There is only one player with value on this team * The "turnaround" will be done mostly by people who are not yet on the Hill and have not attended one practice at HC. ...and to hear this from people who claim to be their fans. That last point must hurt those players who have stayed with the team and are working their butts off to do what their new coach wants and to make their team better. IMHO they deserve some "better" fans. But, that is probably just the opinion of one man. My remarks were dashed off insensitively while watching football. I support all the HC players and root for them but am disappointed that players keep leaving. I don't hold student athletes responsible and wish BN was a better communicator and more supportive of his players instead of blaming some of them between the lines for not giving maximum effort. Coach Chesney has turned around the FB program without inferring any of the much larger FB team is giving less than maximum effort. Chesney is Mr. Positive and upbeat. Realistically no student athlete can be blamed for much, even transferring out. The responsibility for building a positive team culture is on the head coach and his hires. I see similarities between the SK hire and the BN hire. The success of ND and Marquette can't be bought and transferred with a four year contract to the top assistant who has never been a head coach. In Chesney's case the culture could be transferred because he built the culture at both schools. I also can't blame BN for taking a head coaching position when offered. I hope his first recruiting class really is as good as some say.
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Post by bringbackcaro on Jan 19, 2020 20:47:55 GMT -5
I wonder how the players feel when they hear * That they are not division 1 players (even those they are. players on a division 1 team). * There is only one player with value on this team * The "turnaround" will be done mostly by people who are not yet on the Hill and have not attended one practice at HC. ...and to hear this from people who claim to be their fans. That last point must hurt those players who have stayed with the team and are working their butts off to do what their new coach wants and to make their team better. IMHO they deserve some "better" fans. But, that is probably just the opinion of one man. -8-30 (.211) in last 38 games -7-17 (.292) in last 24 PL games -Currently KenPom #340 out of 353 D1 teams -Lost to an unranked D3 team Sorry, but anyone still actively following this team belongs in the Fan Hall of Fame. The players are getting a $60k+ per year education for free. They will be OK. I remain hopeful that the future will be bright with Pridgen, Wade, and an influx of Nelson recruits.
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Post by rgs318 on Jan 19, 2020 21:21:47 GMT -5
My post was not directed at you in particular. Please don't feel bad about what you said. Thank you for the reply. In your post you make some good points. I'll try to address them one by one.
1. While I do not want to place "blame" on anyone, I do hold student-athletes responsible to their decisions and to some degree the consequent effects of those decisions. If it is "between the lines" then BN is not picking on anyone for blame. If a coach says that players must give 100% and be unselfish to get playing time, that is an important lesson. I have not seen a practice so I do not know how well the team is developing a new culture. I do know it is not yet a "winning culture" but for this year, patience will be needed.
2.Coach Chesney is really upbeat and has been positive (from day #1). Coach Nelson did say that the team will look very different in February than it did at the start of the season and that there was a lot to learn. He has also given the spotlight to a number of players as they improve and fit together. I don't know what his individual interactions are with his players and coaches, but I have never heard him call out any individual. There are some similarities with SK in terms of hw he came to HC, but I believe his athletes respect him. I also believe that much of the team did not respect Coach Kearney. Of course, that is second hand knowledge. Don't underestimate the experience of Nelson working under some very talented coaches. I would rather he develop his own style than try to copy one of theirs. We'll see how that works.
3. Your point about the first recruiting class is right on. I hope Coach Nelson and his staff are able to find players who fit into the picture he is forming with this team. One or two difference-makers added to the players who return could form a very different picture for HC hoops. We have seen some players start to develop their personal roles on the team. A couple of players seem to still be working on that.
4. Patience was something we knew would be important this year. I am trying to remember that after watching our script (fall behind, come back, take the lead, then drift behind at the end of the game). I hope the players are able to maintain patience as they adapt to a new style of play.
5. I know that watching the game via video streaming is not the same as being there in person. One is limited buy what the camera shows and little things (like facial expressions and body language) are often impossible to pick up. Over the last two year I was able to see HC in person a number of times and to get to know the players in that way. This year, that has not been possible. I will be a slow learner...but I will try to be patient. As an optimist, I try got look for positives (same way I coached). Perhaps that is why I have difficulty with some pessimists who seem to see mostly the negative in everything they see.
Thanks for this opportunity to share ideas.
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