|
Post by longsuffering on Feb 16, 2020 17:01:02 GMT -5
He wouldn’t allow it, but maybe seniors from this year’s team? Basketball was invented to give FB and baseball players an indoor activity in the winter. Times have changed.
|
|
|
Post by possum on Feb 17, 2020 8:55:31 GMT -5
WooGray not sure Kinsey and Stevens is a good comp as neither played much at all as freshmen. Not writing Wade off just pointing out that so far he's shown little to indicate he can be a difference maker. If the standard is a serviceable player then I guess he would qualify, unfortunately having a roster full of serviceable players got us where we are and won't get us where we want to be.
|
|
|
Post by trimster on Feb 17, 2020 9:04:03 GMT -5
WooGray not sure Kinsey and Stevens is a good comp as neither played much at all as freshmen. Not writing Wade off just pointing out that so far he's shown little to indicate he can be a difference maker. If the standard is a serviceable player then I guess he would qualify, unfortunately having a roster full of serviceable players got us where we are and won't get us where we want to be. The kid is 18 years old and probably still getting used to college life and living away from home for the first time. Way too early to be making any calls on how much he will contribute to HC hoops during his career. On top of what I mentioned, the coach that recruited him retired just as he was arriving in Worcester and also his cousin left the program in January. Let’s not be so hasty to I’d him as a serviceable player.
|
|
|
Post by purplehaze on Feb 17, 2020 9:29:11 GMT -5
Completely agree ! Let's back off all of this prognostication about who is and isn't going to contribute in future seasons - I find the whole topic very unfair to players (their families) and coaches - can we refrain from such conversation ? Everyone is going through a very difficult season and let's try and focus on the positive.
|
|
|
Post by rgs318 on Feb 17, 2020 10:00:10 GMT -5
Referring to an earlier post...a squad full of "serviceable" players could be a lot better than currently. HC does not have anything like a "squad full" of players of any skill level with so many spots currently "open."
|
|
|
Post by efg72 on Feb 17, 2020 10:03:36 GMT -5
Given the state of the program, I understand the desire to make judgments on which players can contribute immediately, but this conversation lacks a dose of reality.
The likelihood of a freshman to deliver and accomplish what Pridgen has done this year is very rare. Last year Richardson was Rookie of the Year averaging 7/8 pts per game a couple of assists and rebounds/game.
For the talented freshman, he might earn/receive 12-18 minutes of PT, have some bright moments and those that represent he is a true freshman.
How many players for Holy Cross have been significant contributors in PT and had stats to suggest they are going to have a great 4 years? Going back to the time freshmen became eligible there have been maybe 7-10 and Potter, Vicens, Perry played together. Most develop during the first two years, and those we remember for their achievements, take off during their junior and senior seasons.
Any freshman basketball player receiving 30- 40 minutes per game is drinking from a fire hose as he adjusts to the speed, quickness, strength and Basketball IQ needed for the college game.
|
|
|
Post by hchoops on Feb 17, 2020 10:06:57 GMT -5
Add Tim Szatko, RJ Evans, Ryan Serravale
|
|
|
Post by WorcesterGray on Feb 17, 2020 10:38:04 GMT -5
Add Tim Szatko, RJ Evans, Ryan Serravale Total minutes not readily available before 1990, but others who played big (700+) minutes their freshman year - Curry, Pegues, Whearty, Meade, Wilson, Lufkin, Vander Baan, Burrell, Thompson. Charles, Butler, Grandison, Green.
|
|
|
Post by Tom on Feb 17, 2020 11:29:02 GMT -5
Everyone is going through a very difficult season and let's try and focus on the positive. Please advise. I've been looking real hard and can't find much
|
|
|
Post by Tom on Feb 17, 2020 11:29:52 GMT -5
Yes that was joking, or at least half joking.
Anyone who has seen Pridgen play can find at least one positive this season
|
|
|
Post by Tom on Feb 17, 2020 11:34:19 GMT -5
Add Tim Szatko, RJ Evans, Ryan Serravale I think Serravale and to even Szatko are in a little different spot than Wade. Serravale was one of only a handful of scholarship players in the whole league. Szatko only a year later in a similar status. In theory they should have been a step above the playing field, while Ryan is on a more level field
|
|
|
Post by possum on Feb 17, 2020 11:40:12 GMT -5
Yup can't discuss player performance or who might help in the future unless it's positive because we might hurt someone's feelings, that pretty much limits discussion to Pridgen.
|
|
|
Post by Tom on Feb 17, 2020 12:23:30 GMT -5
Yup can't discuss player performance or who might help in the future unless it's positive because we might hurt someone's feelings, that pretty much limits discussion to Pridgen. Sometimes it's hard to predict the future at the end of the 2016 campaign, I thought Karl Charles would be the shining star of the class of 2016. I was wrong. Simply focusing on the court, Charles' junior year was going to be the breakout year as the focus of the team. I seriously expected his game to go up a notch and be on some post season team. By the end of the season, both scoring average and rebounding average didn't meet his freshmen numbers. On the other hand, a big athletic kid named Floyd who was only a role player behind Alexander became the guy on that squad. Charles was so much better than Floyd statistically as a freshmen that not many would have guessed the flip flop by junior year. Based on the first few chapters of the Ryan Wade book, it could be a pretty good book, but not a best seller. Sometimes you know after a few chapters, sometimes you don't . I wasn't overly excited about the first few chapters of the Floyd book, but sure was by the time I finished it.
|
|
|
Post by possum on Feb 17, 2020 12:59:57 GMT -5
Yeah maybe Wade will turn out to be better than Pridgen not likely but I guess anything is possible.
|
|
|
Post by Sons of Vaval on Feb 17, 2020 13:17:06 GMT -5
I’d like to see Wade develop into something more than just camping out on the wing and shooting threes.
83% of his FGA have been 3PT.
I imagine this has to be an HC record.
|
|
|
Post by Tom on Feb 17, 2020 13:20:39 GMT -5
Yeah maybe Wade will turn out to be better than Pridgen not likely but I guess anything is possible. Probably not. Just saying predicting the future success of freshmen is far from an exact science
|
|
|
Post by efg72 on Feb 17, 2020 13:26:13 GMT -5
Not sure anybody suggested Wade was among the elite freshmen we have had. Unlike some, I believe he has made a solid contribution this year and shows signs he has learned more about the game and himself as a player. As he matures I think he will continue to grow and deliver on both ends of the floor.
What was said, is that few if any freshman is ready for all that college basketball demands day one. Some are, and we have had a handful, but most don't develop until later. Those select few, like Pridgen, are a step and level above, but they too need to adjust and learn the college game.
|
|
|
Post by WorcesterGray on Feb 17, 2020 14:19:04 GMT -5
I’d like to see Wade develop into something more than just camping out on the wing and shooting threes. 83% of his FGA have been 3PT. I imagine this has to be an HC record. Yes, it is.
Top 10 Three-Point Rate Seasons (min. 100 FGA) Ryan Wade, 2019-20. 83% (3FG%, 30.4)
James Stowers, 1997-98. 76% (3FG%, 37.4)
James Stowers, 1998-99. 74% (3FG%, 39.5)
Malik Waters, 1997-98. 67% (3FG%, 34.7)
Cullen Hamilton, 2012-13. 67% (3FG%, 29.2)
Anthony Thompson, 2016-17. 67% (3FG%, 30.6)
Anthony Thompson, 2015-16. 66% (3FG%, 25.6)
Andrew Beinert, 2010-11. 66% (3FG%, 37.6)
Kevin Hamilton, 2002-03. 65% (3FG%, 29.3)
Jordan Stevens, 2012-13. 62% (3FG%, 34.6)
|
|
|
Post by Sons of Vaval on Feb 17, 2020 14:38:16 GMT -5
Still a long way to go to catch up to Max Hooper. Over the course of three seasons -- one at St. John's and two at Oakland -- Hooper shot 468 threes to 11 twos. In his final season, he didn't attempt a two point shot.
If Wade becomes a 45.5% three point shooter, which is what Hooper was as a senior, then he can shoot ten a game.
|
|
|
Post by possum on Feb 17, 2020 15:01:48 GMT -5
I think most would like to see Wade diversify his offensive game but at the risk of being negative Wade's two point FG% is worse than it is from beyond the arc.
|
|
|
Post by dadominate on Feb 17, 2020 15:27:59 GMT -5
I’d like to see Wade develop into something more than just camping out on the wing and shooting threes. 83% of his FGA have been 3PT. I imagine this has to be an HC record. Yes, it is.
Top 10 Three-Point Rate Seasons (min. 100 FGA) Ryan Wade, 2019-20. 83% James Stowers, 1997-98. 76% James Stowers, 1998-99. 74% Malik Waters, 1997-98. 67% Cullen Hamilton, 2012-13. 67% Anthony Thompson, 2016-17. 67% Anthony Thompson, 2015-16. 66% Andrew Beinert, 2010-11. 66% Kevin Hamilton, 2002-03. 65% Jordan Stevens, 2012-13. 62%
thanks, woogray. can you add the 3fg% next to those numbers? will be interesting to see. i know stowers was a good shooter, but don't remember how well he shot it when it actually mattered, i.e. in the games. never thought the guy would come up twice in two threads in 2020!
|
|
|
Post by WorcesterGray on Feb 17, 2020 15:43:30 GMT -5
Have edited my post to reflect 3FG% for these guys.
Btw, Stowers' career three point rate was over 75%, and in his limited play as a senior, it was higher (84%) than Wade's. His career 3FG% was 37.5.
|
|
|
Post by Sons of Vaval on Feb 17, 2020 15:54:19 GMT -5
It looks like Stowers and, to a lesser extent Beinert, were the only guys who had any business shooting that many threes.
Ant Thompson -- yikes.
|
|
|
Post by KY Crusader 75 on Feb 17, 2020 16:26:14 GMT -5
In KHam's defense, that total is from his freshman season. He improved in just about every way by the end of the season and certainly as a sophomore. As a soph he shot .387 on threes and that was his highest percentage. For his career he was a not bad .347 on threes. For perspective that number for a team would place it right about #100 among D-1 teams. Not until he was a senior did KHam take more twos than threes. His 2 point percentage was a sub-optimal .435 for his career, a percentage that would have some current posters calling for his head. Of course, Kevin Hamilton was a star who contributed in many ways at both ends of the court
Andrew Beinert was a great shooter with a career 3 point percentage of .407, good for #6 all-time at Holy Cross.
If I had to set benchmarks for shooting threes (some here are aware of my control of the red light) I'd say
.300= stop taking threes unless wide open
.333= okay (about average for D-1)
.350= Good
.375= Very Good
.400= Outstanding
|
|
|
Post by hchoops on Feb 17, 2020 16:30:25 GMT -5
In KHam's defense, that total is from his freshman season. He improved in just about every way by the end of the season and certainly as a sophomore. As a soph he shot .387 on threes and that was his highest percentage. For his career he was a not bad .347 on threes. For perspective that number for a team would place it right about #100 among D-1 teams. Not until he was a senior did KHam take more twos than threes. His 2 point percentage was a sub-optimal .435 for his career, a percentage that would have some current posters calling for his head. Of course, Kevin Hamilton was a star who contributed in many ways at both ends of the court Kevin was a real stat stuffer—points, rebounds,assists, steals, even blocks occasionally, and RW’s favorite, deflections.
|
|