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Post by crusader1970 on Nov 13, 2016 10:47:25 GMT -5
I have confidence that Nate pine will do the "right thing" and by next Wednesday.
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Post by sader81 on Nov 13, 2016 10:48:18 GMT -5
the boys did not tackle yesterday - many plays with 3 or more missed tackles. That shows they were not mentally and emotionally ready to play. You cannot blame injuries on that. It's time!
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Post by hc6774 on Nov 13, 2016 10:54:01 GMT -5
Yes he was and a rather ironic halftime presentation of one of those large symbolic checks for the record breaking Crusader Athletics Fund with Fr. B, Nate, I believe Heather Palmer, and one other person who escapes my memory. Here the announcer is extolling what great things the CAF does for HC athletics and we were getting routed by Fordham. While it made me wonder why I have been contributing since the Gridiron Club's inception, I was watching Nate's and Fr. B's faces on the jumbotron and they looked a bit chagrined, if that is the right word. Anyone else who was there have the same thoughts, are was it just me? the other was Gordie.... $1.6M First qtr presentation... later in first half Fordham was presented $47M check to the university by its alums
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Post by Crucis#1 on Nov 13, 2016 10:57:06 GMT -5
Yes he was and a rather ironic halftime presentation of one of those large symbolic checks for the record breaking Crusader Athletics Fund with Fr. B, Nate, I believe Heather Palmer, and one other person who escapes my memory. Here the announcer is extolling what great things the CAF does for HC athletics and we were getting routed by Fordham. While it made me wonder why I have been contributing since the Gridiron Club's inception, I was watching Nate's and Fr. B's faces on the jumbotron and they looked a bit chagrined, if that is the right word. Anyone else who was there have the same thoughts, are was it just me? Also on the field was Coleen Lynch And Gordie Lockbaum for the check presentation. While the outcome of the game on the field was sub optimal, to be kind, I really was pleased with the outstanding presentations, video clips and overall atmosphere during my five hours in Yankee Stadium. Without a doubt, it was the best atmosphere I have experience in nearly 50 years of HC football.I came away from the game hoping that a Jumbotron will be installed in Fitton next year. If you were not there, you truly missed an outstanding effort and game day experience from the Holy Cross Athletic staff and the Yankees organization.
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Post by sader1970 on Nov 13, 2016 11:01:14 GMT -5
Totally agree. The only thing that marred the day was the play on the field. Even a close loss would have made the trip worthwhile. And "sub optimal" is indeed a very kind description of events.
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Post by sader1970 on Nov 13, 2016 11:20:05 GMT -5
Was anyone else struck by how many Ram players seem to have gotten injured? I thought the game was going to run until 9:00 pm with so many injury timeouts. As for Chase Edmonds, I wondered early in the game why we didn't have someone dogging him on every play. If we did, I didn't notice. Of course, I think he "only" got something like 119 yards rushing. He should have been dumped on his backside every play. But their QB killed us with passes to wide open receivers. I hope this will be my last post on the subject. I need to treat this game like "politics" on Crossports! Erased from my memory bank.
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Post by sarasota on Nov 13, 2016 12:12:46 GMT -5
This whole thing was like someone farted in the middle of an opera audience.
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Post by sader1970 on Nov 13, 2016 14:55:40 GMT -5
I am not sure anyone can match your eloquence and suggest maybe this should be the last word on the subject. P.S. I hope you at least said "excuse me."
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Post by sarasota on Nov 13, 2016 17:16:34 GMT -5
I always point to the guy next to me and yell "It was him!"
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Post by timholycross on Nov 13, 2016 17:25:10 GMT -5
the boys did not tackle yesterday - many plays with 3 or more missed tackles. That shows they were not mentally and emotionally ready to play. You cannot blame injuries on that. It's time! I'd like to see a Yards After Catch stat...believe HC did incredibly poorly on that one. Been happening all year. Most of HC's opponents' big plays should have been small plays.
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Post by hcgrad94 on Nov 13, 2016 17:36:46 GMT -5
This whole thing was like someone farted in the middle of an opera audience. What whole thing? For those of us who actually went to the game we experienced a truly special weekend to be a Crusader. Anyone who says football doesn't matter at HC needs to realize that yesterday doesn't happen without the vehicle of football. Cant wait for similar experiences at UConn, BC etc.
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Post by timholycross on Nov 13, 2016 18:29:27 GMT -5
Real games in real stadiums before real crowds...maybe that will impress upon tptb what's been missing.
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Post by realism on Nov 13, 2016 18:32:58 GMT -5
Fordham is bigger. Fordham is leaner. Fordham is faster. Fordham has more talent. Fordham has more depth. Fordham has a better offensive plan. Fordham has a better defensive plan. Fordham is playing harder. No wonder why we have so many injuries. We will never compete with the current player and coaching profile. Simply impossible. Ok this is coming from someone who has erred on the side of hope and positivity, and this is about as blunt as I can state it: The program needs to seize this moment to evaluate it if should continue along the road of D1 scholarship football. If the answer is yes, the program needs to be gutted and started anew. If the answer is no, we need to downgrade to another conference or hold hands with Georgetown, the only team we can compete with anymore, and drop football. I don't care how many 5th year seniors are returning, we've regressed to the point where the fastest we can expect to rebuild in order to compete with Lehigh, Colgate, and Fordham is 4 or 5 years. As for the many strong OOC teams we have coming up, God help us. The guys who are out on that field tonight getting humiliated deserve much more. And real classy of Fordham to run up the score. Real nice. As the venerable Lou Holtz said, “You're never as good as everyone tells you when you win, and you're never as bad as they say when you lose.” But the sense of entitlement or inevitability of a change in actual performance among posters here has simply been astounding to this poster who watches the rest of the PL religiously. The buy-n and optimism is based on what evidence ? Surely, ADNP has been trained better than his predecessor to be an Athletic Director. Kudos to ADNP for doing a lot of administrative and marketing tasks that everyone in the PL has put in place over the past decade. A great league, for what it is athletically and academically. With the exception of Lafayette every PL institution is pretty proud of what they stand for. Believing that ADNP has a magic formula and a related wand for improving performance is just hocus-pocus. Lehigh, Colgate & Fordham beat Holy Cross this year by a combined 126-36. Translated to average per game, that's 42-12. And Fordham lost to Navy 52-16. Colgate lost to Syracuse 33-7. hc87 can defensively poo-poo the PL all he wants for not making much progress under schollies. Based on performance and recruiting, Lehigh, Colgate and Fordham are clawing their way into another echelon that distances itself from H.C., after this 4th year of scholies. Again, kudos tp ADNP. But, I'm not buying the performance implications of what he's selling. Simply stated, he's a nice young upwardly mobile administrator, whose track record is based on raising money. He has never done in actual performance what this Board is buying into.
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Post by sarasota on Nov 13, 2016 18:53:12 GMT -5
NP has never been a head AD has he?
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Post by alumni111 on Nov 13, 2016 19:29:15 GMT -5
As for the account of the game being "all over Metro NY newspapers" and thereby causing embarassment to HC, the TELEGRAM didn't even staff the game, and that's not a knock on the T, just the realities of the newspaper biz today. Heck, the Globe used to cover a couple of HC games a year, and yesterday it didn't even staff BC bkb's home opener. The landscape of college sports all over New England is SO different than just 15-20 years ago. The "upsides" just aren't there anymore, at least not without a lot of slow, hard progress.
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Post by zambonihomie13 on Nov 13, 2016 19:53:11 GMT -5
Fordham is bigger. Fordham is leaner. Fordham is faster. Fordham has more talent. Fordham has more depth. Fordham has a better offensive plan. Fordham has a better defensive plan. Fordham is playing harder. No wonder why we have so many injuries. We will never compete with the current player and coaching profile. Simply impossible. Ok this is coming from someone who has erred on the side of hope and positivity, and this is about as blunt as I can state it: The program needs to seize this moment to evaluate it if should continue along the road of D1 scholarship football. If the answer is yes, the program needs to be gutted and started anew. If the answer is no, we need to downgrade to another conference or hold hands with Georgetown, the only team we can compete with anymore, and drop football. I don't care how many 5th year seniors are returning, we've regressed to the point where the fastest we can expect to rebuild in order to compete with Lehigh, Colgate, and Fordham is 4 or 5 years. As for the many strong OOC teams we have coming up, God help us. The guys who are out on that field tonight getting humiliated deserve much more. And real classy of Fordham to run up the score. Real nice. As the venerable Lou Holtz said, “You're never as good as everyone tells you when you win, and you're never as bad as they say when you lose.” But the sense of entitlement or inevitability of a change in actual performance among posters here has simply been astounding to this poster who watches the rest of the PL religiously. The buy-n and optimism is based on what evidence ? Surely, ADNP has been trained better than his predecessor to be an Athletic Director. Kudos to ADNP for doing a lot of administrative and marketing tasks that everyone in the PL has put in place over the past decade. A great league, for what it is athletically and academically. With the exception of Lafayette every PL institution is pretty proud of what they stand for. Believing that ADNP has a magic formula and a related wand for improving performance is just hocus-pocus. Lehigh, Colgate & Fordham beat Holy Cross this year by a combined 126-36. Translated to average per game, that's 42-12. And Fordham lost to Navy 52-16. Colgate lost to Syracuse 33-7. hc87 can defensively poo-poo the PL all he wants for not making much progress under schollies. Based on performance and recruiting, Lehigh, Colgate and Fordham are clawing their way into another echelon that distances itself from H.C., after this 4th year of scholies. Again, kudos tp ADNP. But, I'm not buying the performance implications of what he's selling. Simply stated, he's a nice young upwardly mobile administrator, whose track record is based on raising money. He has never done in actual performance what this Board is buying into. Wait, I'm confused. Is it's ADNP fault that the floor has fallen out on this football season?
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Post by realism on Nov 13, 2016 20:23:33 GMT -5
Wait, I'm confused. Is it's ADNP fault that the floor has fallen out on this football season? No. I'm sorry that you picked up on that as my main point. Rather I am following up on the general thrust ( not the specific recommendations ) of Joe's wake up call ( above ): "Ok this is coming from someone who has erred on the side of hope and positivity, and this is about as blunt as I can state it:" I've followed Joe's optimistic comments from the beginning of the season. I respect his flexibility and don't doubt that his loyalty/passion to H.C. is any less than the impressive optimism of other H.C. alum posters. However, the football situation brings to the surface the depth and range of problems that ADNP's "oversight" is expected to fix in a variety of sports. The changes in actual performance are most certainly going to to take longer and be more complex than most people on this Board seem to expect. ADNP may be the wunderkind ? There's no evidence that he has "overseen" the fixing of this kind of situation before. Maybe it's time for some healthy skepticism and insight to complement what Joe describes as " hope and positivity."
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Post by bringbackcaro on Nov 13, 2016 20:48:59 GMT -5
This whole thing was like someone farted in the middle of an opera audience. What whole thing? For those of us who actually went to the game we experienced a truly special weekend to be a Crusader. Anyone who says football doesn't matter at HC needs to realize that yesterday doesn't happen without the vehicle of football. Cant wait for similar experiences at UConn, BC etc. Amazing experience that went far beyond the scoreboard. I look forward to a similar experience for BC, but don't understand why the UCONN game was allowed to be moved to a Thursday night? Thursday of Labor Day weekend in East Hartford is not exactly going to be a big draw for HC fans.
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Post by joe on Nov 13, 2016 20:56:38 GMT -5
I pledged 4 seasons ago to be open minded until we were a full schollie team. I also pledged that when we had some early adversity this season that I would remain positive as long as we were competing at a PL Championship level, even if we didn't win a championship, per se.
Now the program finds itself at a crossroads. 3 teams have pulled ahead and the longer this is allowed to continue the larger the divide will become and the harder it will be to swim upstream to catch up. With regard to ADNP's halftime comments during the hoops game, no one wants to hear about patience any longer. New facilities are great but won't be done until 2018 and as far as we know the stadium will still be outdated, not even with lights! We've scheduled games against FBS teams NOW, not in 5 years. We've chosen to play in a scholarship league NOW, not in 5 years. We've had plenty of time to get the program to where it needs to be and by all measures have failed.
A lot of people get paid a lot of money to see that HC has a good football team and they all need to this figured out right now, or we should downgrade/de-emphasize. If not for my loyalty to the school, the program, and the amazing guys that come through it, of whom I am very proud, I would turn my back once and for all.
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Nov 14, 2016 7:57:25 GMT -5
realism and alumni 111 have stated some very good points. ___________________________________________ Spending on football ($ in millions) 2011-12 / 2012-13 / 2013-14 / 2014-15
Colgate 4.7 / 4.8 / 4.7 / 5.3 HC 3.9 / 4.4 / 4.4 / 4.8 Fordham 5.7 / 5.6 / 5.8 / 6.5 Lehigh 4.5 / 4.2 / 4.3 / 5.3
The last two years are the first two years of scollies for the league. In the run-up to scollies, it appears to me that several schools tried to adjust their financial aid so not to run afoul of the NCAA cap on players receiving scollies. Data for the third year of scollies, 2015-16, should be available next month. The HC budget would be a DR budget, by and large.
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Post by inhocsigno on Nov 14, 2016 10:41:47 GMT -5
Yes he was and a rather ironic halftime presentation of one of those large symbolic checks for the record breaking Crusader Athletics Fund with Fr. B, Nate, I believe Heather Palmer, and one other person who escapes my memory. Here the announcer is extolling what great things the CAF does for HC athletics and we were getting routed by Fordham. While it made me wonder why I have been contributing since the Gridiron Club's inception, I was watching Nate's and Fr. B's faces on the jumbotron and they looked a bit chagrined, if that is the right word. Anyone else who was there have the same thoughts, are was it just me? I would agree. Admittedly, my memory is a bit hazy as we met up with many former teammates/classmates for pregame activities, being away from the kids for the first time., thinking that 38 is 18 again, etc., but the feeling in the stadium was an interesting mix - the positive social atmosphere and the very disappointing performance. I imagine ADNP was feeling the same, i.e. great event and embarrasing performance. I loved that ADNP got this game set up - as it was great to meet up with everyone from TD128 to young guys like Dom and Brock (and everyone in between). These are the types of events that help the program and keep alumni engaged. I just wish we played well.
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Post by cruskater31 on Nov 14, 2016 11:23:48 GMT -5
What whole thing? For those of us who actually went to the game we experienced a truly special weekend to be a Crusader. Anyone who says football doesn't matter at HC needs to realize that yesterday doesn't happen without the vehicle of football. Cant wait for similar experiences at UConn, BC etc. Amazing experience that went far beyond the scoreboard. I look forward to a similar experience for BC, but don't understand why the UCONN game was allowed to be moved to a Thursday night? Thursday of Labor Day weekend in East Hartford is not exactly going to be a big draw for HC fans. Great point Caro! Normally, I would suspect a large contingent of HC fans from New England and the Tri-State area would descend upon East Hartford, but that draw is difficult. ESPN has a number of early season Thursday night games. It seems teams from the American (like UConn) as well as conferences such as the MAAC, CUSA, and Sun Belt agree to the Thursday games in exchange for a chance to play on ESPN or ESPN 2. Normally LL Ragin Cajuns or the Troy Trojans wouldn't have a chance for a spotlight game on a Saturday. Who knows? Maybe a chance to be on national tv for HC
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Post by hchoops on Nov 14, 2016 11:32:49 GMT -5
Might that be a good or bad occurrence ?
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Post by JRGNYR on Nov 14, 2016 11:36:05 GMT -5
If the game is on ESPN, then Thursday night is A-OK by me.
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Post by realism on Nov 14, 2016 13:22:42 GMT -5
" we've regressed to the point where the fastest we can expect to rebuild in order to compete with Lehigh, Colgate, and Fordham is 4 or 5 years. As for the many strong OOC teams we have coming up, God help us." Joe
Like Joe, I think it’s time for posters to realize that the timing for realizing HC's ambitious athletic vision appears a tad askew. Unlike Joe, I don’t know how long it will take to effect this turnaround. However, I can imagine how incredulous the H.C. pitch is becoming to recruits, whether coming from HCTG or someone new charged with delivering its story.
I. TRAJECTORY OF H.C."s PERFORMANCE IN THE SCHOLLY ERA
2010 6-5 2011 6-5 2012 2-9 ...............SCHOLLY ERA....................... 2013 3-9 2014 4-8 2015 6-5 2016 4-7
II. WHY THE P.L. ?
Lehigh, Colgate & Fordham beat Holy Cross this year by a combined 126-36. Translated to average per game, that's 42-12. As one of our insightful alums ( hc87 ) has prophetically stated, “We like the PL because it gives us the cushion o play our traditional big time o.o.c. peers 5 or 6 games a year.”
III. HOW’S THE OUTLOOK FOR THOSE BCS TRADITIONAL PEER GAMES LOOKING ?
And Fordham lost to Navy 52-16. Colgate lost to Syracuse 33-7. ( “Heck, we’re even playing both Navy and Syracuse in one season in just a couple of years” )
IV. PLAYING OUR IVY PEERS
Harvard ( 5.2% acceptance rate ) and Yale ( 6.3% acceptance rate ) like playing H.C. ( 37% acceptance rate ) because of the prestige by association that it brings to them nationally. Nothing more.
V. IMPACT ON THE EVOLVING IMAGE OF HOLY CROSS
“Boy, did we hit one out of the park, so to speak, at Yankee Stadium.”
VI. FACILITIES
“On track for March 2018, just in time for the jumbo Navy/Syracuse schedule.”
VII. OUR WUNDERKIND TURNAROUND SPECIALIST AD
“ He’s not a bean counter by training like our last AD. ADNP cut his eye teeth as an athletic fundraising staff member at big schools. Now he’s channeling those skills into firing and hiring coaches, scheduling and massive p.r. for the institution. Fundraising, Performance turnaround experience....one and the same thing, you know”
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