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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Mar 4, 2022 19:22:57 GMT -5
With respect to Millard, Millard was expanded significantly early last decade, if memory serves. Several courses, e.g., digital graphics, currently offered at Millard, will be shifted to Prior once it opens. These visual arts courses are computer-centric,. That will free some space. But given Vince's statement that the college needs 'modern academic buildings', one could view Millard as dated and perhaps even obsolete. If so, I suspect Millard would be replaced, rather than refurbished.
With respect to Wheeler, Wheeler was supposedly built like the proverbial brick outhouse, and if so, the cost of re-purposing Wheeler to some other use may be prohibitive. I think Wheeler would be an attractive housing option if all rooms were single occupancy.
I cannot find a list of classrooms at HC. The course schedule / calendar has a column for building /classroom but uniformly, the column is blank. So enumerating the number of classrooms that Vince would characterize as non-modern (and absent a definition of such) is guesswork. Fair to say, any classrooms in O'Kane, Fenwick(?), Carlin would be so characterized.
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Mar 4, 2022 19:57:42 GMT -5
Answering several comments supra. The college in its submission to the Planning Board states that the total number of parking spaces on campus exceeds by 370 spaces (I can't recall the exact number) what is required by the city. The proposed residence halls require seven parking spaces, the college is providing four, new spaces, with the other three covered by the parking space 'surplus'. ---- 20 City View is owned by a couple in their mid 70s. ---------------------------------------------------------- Madison Properties acquired two more parcels on Kendig St. next to the campus, in Dec 2021. The prices was either $300,000 or $600,000. When added to a third parcel acquired in August 2020, the total land area now owned by Madison Properties on Kendig is a bit more than 25,000 square feet. These properties, all vacant land, back on to HC properties on City View and the afore-mentioned 20 City View. Madison Properties is the developer of properties around Polar Park. Fr. B., in a communication to the HC community in late 2019 said that HC intended to build the new Jesuit residence on Kendig St. With the COVID outbreak in 2020, and the hit on the college's financial bottom line, construction was apparently deferred. The college already owns property on the south side of Kendig, sufficient for a new Jesuit residence. HC's two properties on Kendig, both with homes, have a total land area of 0.61 acres. These properties back on to HC properties on Avon St. HC's two properties on Avon, both vacant land, total about 75,000 sq. ft. Methinks that City Manager Ed Augustus has his fingers in this. --------------------------------- Edited to add. From the timing of the review by the Planning Board, this probably indicates a summer 2022 construction start. if so, the new residence halls could be ready for occupancy by fall semester 2023. What do youthinks Ed Augustus did here exactly? First, Madison Properties is not named for Madison St., in Worcester where Madison Properties has a big development underway. www.worcesterchamber.org/madison-properties-breaks-ground-first-residential-development-near-polar-park/Rather, I am pretty sure 'Madison' is derived from Madison, Wisconsin, home of the University of Wisconsin, the alma mater of the owner of Madison Properties. There are proposals afoot for possibly reconfiguring the I-290 ramps at Southbridge St. The HoJo's lot may be part of a re-configuration. Rick Patterson said the state and Federal Highway Administration would need to be involved. So, this acquisition of scrubby ledge at the top of the hill, land that is essentially unbuildable as a residential home, by Madison Properties might become part of a future land swap with the college involving future development of the HoJos's lot, and/or land owned by the College on the west side of College St. from College Square to Boyden Viunce says the college wants to beautify (improve) the appearance of College St.
I could see Ed Augustus being a facilitator in conversations between the college and the owner of Madison Properties.
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Post by Crucis#1 on Mar 4, 2022 20:15:25 GMT -5
If Millard is in the mix for replacement, as it should be regarding age and functionality, the footprint for Millard and Campion should be used for student housing, creating the east side residential village. Meanwhile, those functions still being used in Millard could be shifted to the spaces being made available with the relocation of Fenwick Theatre and the theatre department.
Wheeler should then be converted to office and academic space. If I remember correctly, and it has been over half a century since I was last in the building, it did not have an elevator for students to use. So to meet current codes, an elevator and other ADA requirements will need to be remediated. Does anyone know if there is currently an elevator in the building?
Exciting times ahead with the new campus master plan.
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Mar 4, 2022 20:22:48 GMT -5
There was an elevator in Wheeler the four years I lived there but students did not use it other than moving days,
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Post by rgs318 on Mar 5, 2022 4:32:50 GMT -5
I remember that elevator and got to use it all of one time to get my trunk upstairs to my room next to the staircase on Wheeler 3.  |
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Mar 5, 2022 7:46:10 GMT -5
Shifting Millard to O'Kane does not meet Vince's definition of a modern academic building. I also believe that studio art requires a robust ventilation/exhaust system which O'Kane does not offer. Artist studios should have large north-facing windows for natural light. O'Kane cannot provide this. You might convert Millard into a dedicated NROTC building. If HC builds a new academic building, it likely will be built where the basketball court is, north of Linden Lane. The tennis courts might get moved as well. EYP is the architect. Their student life portfolio is at the link below. Note the newest residence hall at BC, where the BC law school once was, before it was moved away from Chestnut Hill. www.eypae.com/student-lifeWould not surprise me if they have preliminary designs for residence hall on the south side of City View. If 20 City View is bought, they could catty-corner the building(s) where City View becomes McCarthy Lane. |
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Post by Tom on Mar 5, 2022 9:06:08 GMT -5
What do youthinks Ed Augustus did here exactly?
I could see Ed Augustus being a facilitator in conversations between the college and the owner of Madison Properties.
. Perhaps. Based on zero information, I would guess that Augustus would not want HC to get the Madison properties. Although he was a one time employee of the school, his loyalty now is to the city. HC properties in general are not on the tax rolls. I can't see the city manager actively facilitating getting property off the tax rolls. Residential properties rented to college kids are a financial plus for the city. Tax revenues and college kids, unlike families, don't have kids that you need to pay to educate. |
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Post by hc6774 on Mar 5, 2022 9:42:19 GMT -5
What do youthinks Ed Augustus did here exactly? First, Madison Properties is not named for Madison St., in Worcester where Madison Properties has a big development underway. www.worcesterchamber.org/madison-properties-breaks-ground-first-residential-development-near-polar-park/Rather, I am pretty sure 'Madison' is derived from Madison, Wisconsin, home of the University of Wisconsin, the alma mater of the owner of Madison Properties. There are proposals afoot for possibly reconfiguring the I-290 ramps at Southbridge St. The HoJo's lot may be part of a re-configuration. Rick Patterson said the state and Federal Highway Administration would need to be involved. So, this acquisition of scrubby ledge at the top of the hill, land that is essentially unbuildable as a residential home, by Madison Properties might become part of a future land swap with the college involving future development of the HoJos's lot, and/or land owned by the College on the west side of College St. from College Square to Boyden Viunce says the college wants to beautify (improve) the appearance of College St.
I could see Ed Augustus being a facilitator in conversations between the college and the owner of Madison Properties.
. just catching up with this thread... so it may have been mentioned above I believe I heard Rick Patterson say that housing & academic buildings would be part of the campus master plan & that a need for open space would be a factor. my thought is that demolitions as well as construction may be a factor |
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Post by lou on Mar 5, 2022 10:07:47 GMT -5
I cannot imagine anyone who cares about Worcester would not be thrilled with these planned improvements to the neighborhood. These buildings will be spectacular and an incredible addition right next to the amazing Jo. The loss of a few $ in property taxes if HC continues the expansion should be welcome
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Post by gks on Mar 5, 2022 10:17:02 GMT -5
What do youthinks Ed Augustus did here exactly? First, Madison Properties is not named for Madison St., in Worcester where Madison Properties has a big development underway. www.worcesterchamber.org/madison-properties-breaks-ground-first-residential-development-near-polar-park/Rather, I am pretty sure 'Madison' is derived from Madison, Wisconsin, home of the University of Wisconsin, the alma mater of the owner of Madison Properties. There are proposals afoot for possibly reconfiguring the I-290 ramps at Southbridge St. The HoJo's lot may be part of a re-configuration. Rick Patterson said the state and Federal Highway Administration would need to be involved. So, this acquisition of scrubby ledge at the top of the hill, land that is essentially unbuildable as a residential home, by Madison Properties might become part of a future land swap with the college involving future development of the HoJos's lot, and/or land owned by the College on the west side of College St. from College Square to Boyden Viunce says the college wants to beautify (improve) the appearance of College St.
I could see Ed Augustus being a facilitator in conversations between the college and the owner of Madison Properties.
. I'm no engineer but how would they even attempt to do a reconfiguration of the Southbridge Street/College Sq exit off of 290? There's so much going on at that interchange. In addition....Wouldn't this be affected by the world-famous flood plain? |
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Post by lou on Mar 5, 2022 10:26:33 GMT -5
This change to the 290 ramp to get to HC should be an absolute top priority. The manuver to exit 290 and move over three lanes to make a quick right up College is treacherous, has amazed me for years how this has remained so dangerous
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Mar 5, 2022 11:49:15 GMT -5
This change to the 290 ramp to get to HC should be an absolute top priority. The manuver to exit 290 and move over three lanes to make a quick right up College is treacherous, has amazed me for years how this has remained so dangerous Indeed. Rick Patterson mentioned that the Federal Highway Administration is / would need to be involved, so that's something more than traffic signaling. One possible re-alignment is to move the I-290 westbound off-ramp to the east. Start the ramp just east of McKeon, drop it down closing Riverside St. and end the ramp at a signal on Southbridge St, for traffic to turn left to College Sq., or right to downtown Worcester. That would eliminate the current fishhook off- ramp. They could even take the Wendy's and the Family Dollar store. That might allow widening of the culvert for the Middle River between Southbridge St. and McKeon Rd., or the floodplain. goo.gl/maps/DfSvxcgmdXef9vQeAA second possible re-alignment is to start the eastbound I-290 ramp a bit earlier, have it flyover eastbound Southbridge St., and drop the ramp to the south of existing Southbridge St and end the ramp just before College Square. This could involve taking some of the HoJo property that HC owns. Patterson specifically referenced that the HoJo property might factor in a re-alignment. goo.gl/maps/sHxR8PftCfYUqq9J7Holy Cross could swap the remaining portion of the HoJos parcel for the three small parcels of land that Madison Properties bought on Kendig. Madison would develop the HoJo land. I'll address the flood plain matter separately, because I think the city wants to stop the yearly flooding of Cambridge St, to the east of Mckeon rd. ------------------------------------  129 Kendig St., bought in Dec 2020 by Madison Properties, for $95,000. Lot is 8,000 sq ft  131 Kendig St., bought in Dec 2021 by Madison Properties for $300,000, Lot is 7,200 sq ft  133 Kendig St. bought in Dec 2021 by Madison Properties for $0 (Purchase amount included in the transaction for 131 Kendig.) Lot is 8976 sq ft Last two views are looking north northeast toward the Prior Center. College owns where the tree line ends. |
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Post by timholycross on Mar 5, 2022 12:14:11 GMT -5
Has the College (or some private REIT) purchased or shown any interest in properties on Dutton, Electric, Davenport or Avon?
There's also a big chunk of land more or less behind the fire station on McKeon that either the College doesn't own or it's not considered buildable land.
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Mar 5, 2022 12:14:25 GMT -5
I'm guessing that Madison Properties bought these lots so it could hold them until it can get HC to overpay?
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Mar 5, 2022 13:05:27 GMT -5
Has the College (or some private REIT) purchased or shown any interest in properties on Dutton, Electric, Davenport or Avon? There's also a big chunk of land more or less behind the fire station on McKeon that either the College doesn't own or it's not considered buildable land. The college owns most of Avon. One parcel is owned by a natural gas company, and is the site for a high pressure natural gas pipeline pressure regulator station. Re: the other streets, no. HC did buy a house and land on Epworth at the SW corner of Fr. K. field to increase access to the fields, and IMO, to hook up to the city's water and sewer system from the top of the hill in the future. The college owns the land behind the fire station. HC donated the land for the fire station to the city so a new station could be built. |
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Post by hc6774 on Mar 5, 2022 13:15:11 GMT -5
It would be interesting to see the initial plans for I 290 before the eminent domain process broke down & the Holy Cross 'swerve' & ramps was designed to salvage Fitton Field.
When considering access to the Worcester Airport in 2005 or so, I was advised to review plans in the Mass DOT office on Rte 9. The engineer showed me the plans for the area around the airport. Then he showed plans for a never built ring road around Worcester. Such a road would have been very helpful for the airport. The plans were made well before the Mass Pike was conceived & the Worcester Airport had commercial traffic.
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Mar 5, 2022 13:41:57 GMT -5
I'm guessing that Madison Properties bought these lots so it could hold them until it can get HC to overpay? Probably not. HC likely did not want to buy the parcels at this time as there is no immediate use for the land, and until it buys 20 City View. Its primary targets for purchase are three houses on the west side of College St. These will cost $1.4-$1.7 million??? 50 College, the white house with the large parking pad. (Trulia estimate $442,000) And 56 College, the brown house. (Trulia estimate $305,000) goo.gl/maps/VgxFb6EGgm8R2Kg8Aand 64-68 College, a converted two family house. The gray house in the link below. No Trulia estimate goo.gl/maps/SEouuiKYhFDWNDLb6and a second priority is this house on Boyden. HC owns the one to its right in the photo. goo.gl/maps/LJqhK2nQw1gi5FCn8HC bought 52 College late last year for $600,000. Its the house in the middle. goo.gl/maps/BBtfZjaSA4Buibu18 |
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Post by timholycross on Mar 5, 2022 16:38:15 GMT -5
It would be interesting to see the initial plans for I 290 before the eminent domain process broke down & the Holy Cross 'swerve' & ramps was designed to salvage Fitton Field. When considering access to the Worcester Airport in 2005 or so, I was advised to review plans in the Mass DOT office on Rte 9. The engineer showed me the plans for the area around the airport. Then he showed plans for a never built ring road around Worcester. Such a road would have been very helpful for the airport. The plans were made well before the Mass Pike was conceived & the Worcester Airport had commercial traffic. It's hard to conceive of what land or how much land was empty and available after WW2, things have gotten so built up. I've read where the powers-that-be in Worcester had pissed off either the governor or the legislature and therefore they insisted on the path the new Mass Pike took, which clearly cut off the city and reduced the airport to an afterthought. Rectified only in later years first with the opening of 290 and then the 146 exit. Think of how things may have evolved if the Worcester Airport had grabbed a good chunk of the business that over the years has gone to Logan? Also, the guy representing Framingham was apparently in someone's good graces as that town, with 20K people at the time, got as many exits as Worcester. |
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Mar 5, 2022 18:11:31 GMT -5
Reducing flooding on the Middle River:Potentially, re-alignment of the I-290 westbound off-ramp for Southbridge St. could expand the flood plain area between Southbridge St. and McKeon Road. A small industrial site, probably a Brownfield site, north of the softball field, might also be converted to wetlands. Ending the recurring flooding of Cambridge St. near the railroad tracks might require a large, subsurface stormwater detention chamber to hold peak runoff until it can be released to flow either into a sewer, or into the Middle River. In a quick exploration of the hydrology of the Middle River, I found this in Auburn, near Pakachoag St. (College St. becomes Pakachoag St. at the Worcester - Auburn line.) The Worcester Flood Diversion Channel in Auburn.  See center of image
 The Diversion Channel flows below the Pakachoag Golf Course. This diversion channel appears to drain stormwater runoff from the area of Webster Square. If so, this should substantially reduce flooding of the Middle River at the foot of College Hill, as runoff flows are diverted to this diversion channel. If so, this may introduce future opportunities for improvements to the college's playing fields at the bottom of the hill. (Also nearly all the HoJo's parcel is elevated above the flood plan for the Middle River.)
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Post by longsuffering on Mar 5, 2022 22:11:15 GMT -5
Vewwy interesting. I would say Augustus is known for being savvy, smooth and skilled but also ethical and honest. What in the world could his fingers do? Perhaps bring two parties together to facilitate something positive for both entities and upgrade the city at the same time?
Edit: I posted this before reading the additional comments. Regarding property tax, Augustus may not be too concerned because the untaxed buildings owned by Becker have come back onto the tax rolls but the city lost a college. Here the city would be getting more "spin off" from jobs and economic activity when another college expands and/or upgrades but losing some taxes, probably much less than they gained from the Becker closure.
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Mar 6, 2022 8:30:09 GMT -5
Vewwy interesting. I would say Augustus is known for being savvy, smooth and skilled but also ethical and honest. What in the world could his fingers do? Perhaps bring two parties together to facilitate something positive for both entities and upgrade the city at the same time? Edit: I posted this before reading the additional comments. Regarding property tax, Augustus may not be too concerned because the untaxed buildings owned by Becker have come back onto the tax rolls but the city lost a college. Here the city would be getting more "spin off" from jobs and economic activity when another college expands and/or upgrades but losing some taxes, probably much less than they gained from the Becker closure. If one opens MIT's 2021 'Town and Gown Report' [annually required by the city of Cambridge] ogcr.mit.edu/towngownand goes to the end, p. 57 in the text, pdf p. 60, one will see how much MIT paid the city in taxes and fees in the fiscal year ending June 30, 2021. $70.3 million in real estate property taxes, alone. That's because MIT owns so much commercial property. MIT does not pay real estate taxes on property used for institutional purposes, e.g., academic buildings, residence halls, etc. Illustratively, If Holy Cross sold the HoJo's lot in fee simple to a private party for development, the developer holding title to the land, would pay real estate taxes to the city for whatever was built, and for the land. This would be a tax boon to the city. Or if HC executed a ground lease for a period of years, then (1) HC would pay real estate taxes to the city for the value of the land only. or (2) the lessee developer would also pay the property taxes for the land, and that would be factored into the 'rent' amount. The larger point is that either HC or the developer will be paying taxes on the land, which heretofore was non-taxable. |
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Post by newfieguy74 on Mar 6, 2022 11:04:44 GMT -5
I read HC's application and think it's very well done. It's important for such an application to have the right tone. Atty. Smith effectively addresses all the relevant criteria and shows a light touch with the Dover Amendment (the statute that limits the application of some municipal restrictions on educational and religious institutions). One doesn't want to unnecessarily ignite any neighborhood or City Hall objections. There's a lot of law and a bit of artful persuasion in these documents.
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Mar 16, 2022 20:00:23 GMT -5
Took my drone out the other day for an overhead view of the Upper Campus.  |
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Post by longsuffering on Mar 16, 2022 22:01:45 GMT -5
Took my drone out the other day for an overhead view of the Upper Campus. Your drone has been called up for service in Ukraine. |
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Post by Crucis#1 on Mar 16, 2022 22:43:44 GMT -5
Anyone notice, and I have before, that Prior Performing Arts Center has been designed in the shape of “The Cross”. A very distinct aerial landmark and appropriate for “ The College”.
And yes, I also thought that PP’s drone may be deployed to another Theatre other than Prior.
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