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Post by Ray on Apr 5, 2022 15:52:42 GMT -5
Will be interesting to see how this commitment from alums/friends translates into on-court results:
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Post by Sons of Vaval on Apr 5, 2022 15:58:28 GMT -5
I wonder what this group of donors thinks of Jay Young as Fairfield's head coach (37-55, 23-35) moving forward.
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Post by longsuffering on Apr 5, 2022 16:52:48 GMT -5
Will be interesting to see how this commitment from alums/friends translates into on-court results:
For Fairfield's sake I hope it doesn't do the same as adding a practice court and upgraded facilities did for our on-court results. The increased budgets will help I guess. If HC was being cheap in recruiting and operating budgets, that hole could be filled, but I don't recall anyone alleging we are more frugal than the rest of the league in those categories.
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Post by bfoley82 on Apr 9, 2022 6:23:18 GMT -5
Will be interesting to see how this commitment from alums/friends translates into on-court results:
For Fairfield's sake I hope it doesn't do the same as adding a practice court and upgraded facilities did for our on-court results. The increased budgets will help I guess. If HC was being cheap in recruiting and operating budgets, that hole could be filled, but I don't recall anyone alleging we are more frugal than the rest of the league in those categories. Well Fairfield has a new arena that I was told by them will be ready in the fall.
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Post by mm67 on Apr 9, 2022 9:01:55 GMT -5
Re Fairfield facility. IMO. Don't know the seating capacity but it sure looks a hell of a lot better than the Hart. IMO. HC spent all that money and all it got was a crappy glorified HS gym.
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Post by bison137 on Apr 9, 2022 9:09:18 GMT -5
Re Fairfield facility. IMO. Don't know the seating capacity but it sure looks a hell of a lot better than the Hart. IMO. HC spent all that money and all it got was a crappy glorified HS gym. Seating capacity is 3500. It is supposed to be ready in November, although they have almost no room for any construction delays. The original plan said it would take 18 to 24 months to build it. But the groundbreaking was delayed by three months, so now the construction time will have to be 16 months if it is to be ready for the opener.
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Post by trimster on Apr 9, 2022 9:48:08 GMT -5
Re Fairfield facility. IMO. Don't know the seating capacity but it sure looks a hell of a lot better than the Hart. IMO. HC spent all that money and all it got was a crappy glorified HS gym. The Hart Center should have been built bigger but once it was in place, I think it would have cost a lot of money to make it bigger and what was the need to for the last 42 years? We could fit the average crowd into one of the large hs gyms in the area.
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Post by timholycross on Apr 9, 2022 10:08:03 GMT -5
Re Fairfield facility. IMO. Don't know the seating capacity but it sure looks a hell of a lot better than the Hart. IMO. HC spent all that money and all it got was a crappy glorified HS gym. The Hart Center should have been built bigger but once it was in place, I think it would have cost a lot of money to make it bigger and what was the need to for the last 42 years? We could fit the average crowd into one of the large hs gyms in the area. The roof is the problem. Very little additional can be fit in that footprint. Offers to at least design it so it could be larger at some point; if not larger to begin with. Rejected by the lone (make no mistake about that, right or wrong) man in charge. Then again, before the Hart Center we played in a sh*tty facility (outdated and inadequate for basketball) off campus, and weren't treated all that well by the people running it.
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Post by mm67 on Apr 9, 2022 10:28:16 GMT -5
Roof is indeed the problem. It is more than the seating. It is the sub optimal look of the place, the bench HS style seating, the HS scoreboards fit snugly on a wall - higher roof, more space, more room for some college level arena style seat back chairs, a more attractive airy space for upper level seating, a center court scoreboard, a more attractive roomy entry with increased seating . Also, what the heck is it with the ugly brown amoeba on the center court floor? Attendance at the games would have been a lot more attractive event. And. it would not have hurt recruiting. Ultimately the gym is a result of poor planning, a lack of vision. Obviously one could point to other crappy basketball gyms with successful teams - St. Peter's, Harvard and others. But, basketball is HC's traditional marquee sports. The school deserved better.
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Apr 9, 2022 10:50:20 GMT -5
The idea of expanding seating at the Hart Court was discussed at length on this board. To expand seating capacity, one would have had to blow out the north and east walls, create a larger footprint, re-position the placement of the court, and raise the roof. This is not that different from what might be done for the rink. It would be a costly undertaking without even reasonable assurances one could fill the seats.
The usually cited reference model was St. Joe's and what they did with their old 'gym'. The old 'gym' had a seating capacity of 3,200. Hagan, which rebuilt and expanded the old 'gym', added 1,000 seats and cost $25 million (in 2009).
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Post by longsuffering on Apr 9, 2022 10:56:23 GMT -5
Roof is indeed the problem. It is more than the seating. It is the sub optimal look of the place, the bench HS style seating, the HS scoreboards fit snugly on a wall - higher roof, more space, more room for some college level arena style seat back chairs, a more attractive airy space for upper level seating, a center court scoreboard, a more attractive roomy entry with increased seating . Also, what the heck is it with the ugly brown amoeba on the center court floor? Attendance at the games would have been a lot more attractive event. And. it would not have hurt recruiting. Ultimately the gym is a result of poor planning, a lack of vision. Obviously one could point to other crappy basketball gyms with successful teams - St. Peter's, Harvard and others. But, basketball is HC's traditional marquee sports. The school deserved better. Make the check out to "The College of the Holy Cross"🙂. Regarding the lone man at the top, Father Brooks, he had creditors to pay. I understand HC had to do short term borrowing to get through some years before Father Brooks as "the lone man" was logically the one person most responsible for HC growing it's endowment to a Billion dollars. We certainly didn't get there by outperforming our peers in investment return. It was from giving by people proud of Holy Cross. Father Brooks was the front man for better or worse.
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Post by trimster on Apr 9, 2022 10:56:24 GMT -5
Roof is indeed the problem. It is more than the seating. It is the sub optimal look of the place, the bench HS style seating, the HS scoreboards fit snugly on a wall - higher roof, more space, more room for some college level arena style seat back chairs, a more attractive airy space for upper level seating, a center court scoreboard, a more attractive roomy entry with increased seating . Also, what the heck is it with the ugly brown amoeba on the center court floor? Attendance at the games would have been a lot more attractive event. And. it would not have hurt recruiting. Ultimately the gym is a result of poor planning, a lack of vision. Obviously one could point to other crappy basketball gyms with successful teams - St. Peter's, Harvard and others. But, basketball is HC's traditional marquee sports. The school deserved better. The man who could have given the OK to what you describe apparently had no interest in doing so. I know you are a big fan of his and I respect what he did for the college but he certainly didn’t do HC hoops any favors.
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Post by Non Alum Dave on Apr 9, 2022 11:05:35 GMT -5
I still think the Hart is a great place to watch a game. The games being watched are where upgrades are needed, imho.
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Post by rgs318 on Apr 9, 2022 12:55:47 GMT -5
That is a great point, Dave. IMO, those who call the Hart center "a high school gym" will never be convinced it is anything else until HC spends millions to create more seats where they are not needed...and, even with the team improving, will not be needed for some time.
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Post by bfoley82 on Apr 9, 2022 14:24:03 GMT -5
That is a great point, Dave. IMO, those who call the Hart center "a high school gym" will never be convinced it is anything else until HC spends millions to create more seats where they are not needed...and, even with the team improving, will not be needed for some time. Look at what Bryant did with their high school gym and what it looks like now. It just has a better look even though it is the same place.
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Post by thecrossisback on Apr 9, 2022 14:29:47 GMT -5
Roof is indeed the problem. It is more than the seating. It is the sub optimal look of the place, the bench HS style seating, the HS scoreboards fit snugly on a wall - higher roof, more space, more room for some college level arena style seat back chairs, a more attractive airy space for upper level seating, a center court scoreboard, a more attractive roomy entry with increased seating . Also, what the heck is it with the ugly brown amoeba on the center court floor? Attendance at the games would have been a lot more attractive event. And. it would not have hurt recruiting. Ultimately the gym is a result of poor planning, a lack of vision. Obviously one could point to other crappy basketball gyms with successful teams - St. Peter's, Harvard and others. But, basketball is HC's traditional marquee sports. The school deserved better. You say this and then on the other hand say the PL is where HC should be? Who is the PL has a better basketball arena?
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Post by mm67 on Apr 9, 2022 14:42:12 GMT -5
As I wrote, it is more than the seating. Don't want to repeat the rest. It's the look of the place. Look, I came from the era of band box hs gyms, snake pits. We were on top of the action, great, great sight lines, pointing fingers, chanting you, you, you. I get it. After the games my ears were ringing. It was great CHSAA basketball in hs gyms. Money is always the determining factor. But , the school shelled around $90 million for Louth and the remodeled Hart is all they could come up with for our marquee sport? Does the Hart truly present as a Div.1 facility? Actually, as someone pointed out. The appearance & seating capacity of the Hart is moot as long as the place is almost empty for games. However, call me a cockeyed optimist, I do believe that once again, the Hart will be a hot bed, filled with screaming maniac students when HC puts fun to watch, winning teams on the court. Then, HS gym or not, none of us will give a damn. Peace & great affection. MM
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Post by mm67 on Apr 9, 2022 14:45:47 GMT -5
Roof is indeed the problem. It is more than the seating. It is the sub optimal look of the place, the bench HS style seating, the HS scoreboards fit snugly on a wall - higher roof, more space, more room for some college level arena style seat back chairs, a more attractive airy space for upper level seating, a center court scoreboard, a more attractive roomy entry with increased seating . Also, what the heck is it with the ugly brown amoeba on the center court floor? Attendance at the games would have been a lot more attractive event. And. it would not have hurt recruiting. Ultimately the gym is a result of poor planning, a lack of vision. Obviously one could point to other crappy basketball gyms with successful teams - St. Peter's, Harvard and others. But, basketball is HC's traditional marquee sports. The school deserved better. You say this and then on the other hand say the PL is where HC should be? Who is the PL has a better basketball arena? Who in the PL has a better basketball arena? Bucknell. Navy, West Point to name three which come to mind. Glad you used the word arena. The Hart is most clearly a gym, not an arena by a long shot. Peace.
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Post by longsuffering on Apr 9, 2022 16:26:42 GMT -5
It does have one snack bar. Just sayin'.
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Post by bison137 on Apr 9, 2022 17:08:50 GMT -5
Roof is indeed the problem. It is more than the seating. It is the sub optimal look of the place, the bench HS style seating, the HS scoreboards fit snugly on a wall - higher roof, more space, more room for some college level arena style seat back chairs, a more attractive airy space for upper level seating, a center court scoreboard, a more attractive roomy entry with increased seating . Also, what the heck is it with the ugly brown amoeba on the center court floor? Attendance at the games would have been a lot more attractive event. And. it would not have hurt recruiting. Ultimately the gym is a result of poor planning, a lack of vision. Obviously one could point to other crappy basketball gyms with successful teams - St. Peter's, Harvard and others. But, basketball is HC's traditional marquee sports. The school deserved better. You say this and then on the other hand say the PL is where HC should be? Who is the PL has a better basketball arena? Bucknell, Navy, Lafayette, Army
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Post by Crucis#1 on Apr 9, 2022 17:13:08 GMT -5
Place of Combat
The word arena originally meant "place of combat," and it's sometimes still used this way. Its root is harena, a kind of sand that was supposedly used on the floor during ancient Roman battles to soak up spilled blood. Definitions of arena.
Wonder if any of our posters attended a game in the old Philadelphia Arena? If was located next to the old WFIL TV Station, original home of “ ABC TV’s American Bandstand”. I remember attending a game between the 76ers vs the Knicks in the Philadelphia Arena in 1965. 😁
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Post by hc87 on Apr 9, 2022 17:17:27 GMT -5
The Hart Centah was outdated when it opened in the mid-1970s...ironically, for basketball, it fits HC for the 2020s....probably too big now actually.
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Post by timholycross on Apr 9, 2022 17:44:25 GMT -5
Place of CombatThe word arena originally meant "place of combat," and it's sometimes still used this way. Its root is harena, a kind of sand that was supposedly used on the floor during ancient Roman battles to soak up spilled blood. Definitions of arena. Wonder if any of our posters attended a game in the old Philadelphia Arena? If was located next to the old WFIL TV Station, original home of “ ABC TV’s American Bandstand”. I remember attending a game between the 76ers vs the Knicks in the Philadelphia Arena in 1965. 😁 That was their backup arena, right? alchetron.com/Philadelphia-ArenaTheir primary home, which I remember a lot better. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philadelphia_Convention_Hall_and_Civic_CenterHad a very small lower seating bowl, kind of like the Worcester Auditorium. The upper deck went way, way, back; however, and I'm sure it didn't have anything like the WAud's overhang.
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Apr 9, 2022 18:09:31 GMT -5
Place of CombatThe word arena originally meant "place of combat," and it's sometimes still used this way. Its root is harena, a kind of sand that was supposedly used on the floor during ancient Roman battles to soak up spilled blood. Definitions of arena. Wonder if any of our posters attended a game in the old Philadelphia Arena? If was located next to the old WFIL TV Station, original home of “ ABC TV’s American Bandstand”. I remember attending a game between the 76ers vs the Knicks in the Philadelphia Arena in 1965. 😁 That was their backup arena, right? alchetron.com/Philadelphia-ArenaTheir primary home, which I remember a lot better. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philadelphia_Convention_Hall_and_Civic_CenterHad a very small lower seating bowl, kind of like the Worcester Auditorium. The upper deck went way, way, back; however, and I'm sure it didn't have anything like the WAud's overhang. You are correct about the Convention Hall. It was near Franklin Field. The Spectrum, which replaced it, was way down in South Philadelphia, on South Market St, and nowhere near as convenient and accessible as the Convention Center complex. American Bandstand's studio was very near West Catholic High school, at around 46th or 47th and Market.
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Post by Crucis#1 on Apr 9, 2022 19:11:21 GMT -5
Yes.
The Arena was at 46th and Market.
Convention Hall was the primary venue.
I saw Wilt Chamberlain in his return to Philly playing with the Globetrotters after he left Kansas University at the Arena. I was sitting behind the basket on the north side of the building. At the end of that season that he was not eligible to play in the NBA, he wa selected through territory draft to play for the Philadelphia Warriors.
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