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Post by mm67 on Jul 21, 2023 9:12:34 GMT -5
.Agree with the name change to the Coastal Athletic Association .Rather than set up an unfounded straw man as a back door to make another in a long line of political comments why not take Thamel's reason for the name change at his word? Colonial Athletic Conference is dry & meaningless. The schools were not founded in the colonial era. Coastal Athletic Conference is indeed more modern and attractive. As to joining a conference with state universities Maine, UNH, Stonybrook, Albany & URI & Fordham? Huh? Don't get it at all. PL is by far a better fit & superior brand. Summer is drawing to an end. Getting ready to watch some football. GoCrossGo
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Post by Ignutz on Jul 21, 2023 10:57:23 GMT -5
With regard to our conference affiliation, I agree completely. We are nothing like UNH, UMass, Maine URI or any of the others - academically or by enrollment. Frankly, I'd like to find a more appropriate school to take the place of BU, and maybe even American. The PL core of HC, Colgate, Bucknell, Lehigh and Lafayette represent ideal partners based on size and academics. Fordham and Georgetown could be size exceptions to the core group, but only if they're all-sports members - which I don't see happening. Without those two, I think we're left to consider the Fairfields and Merrimacks. What other appropriate schools are in the current Boston-to-DC footprint?
An aside: How is it that Navy doesn't have a D-1 Men's Ice Hockey program?
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Post by sader1970 on Jul 21, 2023 11:48:07 GMT -5
Oh, I never heard the Crusaders referred to as the "Buster Douglas" of non-revenue collegiate athletics.
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Post by longsuffering on Jul 21, 2023 13:31:13 GMT -5
Oh, I never heard the Crusaders referred to as the "Buster Douglas" of non-revenue collegiate athletics. Chuck Wepner the "Bayonne Bleeder?"🙂 The HC minor sport ship will come in some day.
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Post by hcpride on Jul 21, 2023 15:12:04 GMT -5
With regard to our conference affiliation, I agree completely. We are nothing like UNH, UMass, Maine URI or any of the others - academically or by enrollment. Frankly, I'd like to find a more appropriate school to take the place of BU, and maybe even American. The PL core of HC, Colgate, Bucknell, Lehigh and Lafayette represent ideal partners based on size and academics. Fordham and Georgetown could be size exceptions to the core group, but only if they're all-sports members - which I don't see happening. Without those two, I think we're left to consider the Fairfields and Merrimacks. What other appropriate schools are in the current Boston-to-DC footprint? An aside: How is it that Navy doesn't have a D-1 Men's Ice Hockey program? We're a polyglot conference between two service academies, Georgetown (football), Fordham (football), BU, American, Loyola, and a few smaller (secular and religious) liberal arts/generally undergraduate colleges. Part of the attraction for some. I know they're happy in the CAA but with BU a PL member, maybe Northeastern would be a good all-sports addition.
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Post by Ignutz on Jul 21, 2023 15:38:35 GMT -5
With regard to our conference affiliation, I agree completely. We are nothing like UNH, UMass, Maine URI or any of the others - academically or by enrollment. Frankly, I'd like to find a more appropriate school to take the place of BU, and maybe even American. The PL core of HC, Colgate, Bucknell, Lehigh and Lafayette represent ideal partners based on size and academics. Fordham and Georgetown could be size exceptions to the core group, but only if they're all-sports members - which I don't see happening. Without those two, I think we're left to consider the Fairfields and Merrimacks. What other appropriate schools are in the current Boston-to-DC footprint? An aside: How is it that Navy doesn't have a D-1 Men's Ice Hockey program? We're a polyglot conference between two service academies, Georgetown (football), Fordham (football), BU, American, Loyola, and a few smaller (secular and religious) liberal arts/generally undergraduate colleges. Part of the attraction for some. I know they're happy in the CAA but with BU a PL member, maybe Northeastern would be a good all-sports addition. But they, like BU, don't play football! And they're probably over 10x our size.
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Post by hcpride on Jul 21, 2023 16:15:21 GMT -5
We're a polyglot conference between two service academies, Georgetown (football), Fordham (football), BU, American, Loyola, and a few smaller (secular and religious) liberal arts/generally undergraduate colleges. Part of the attraction for some. I know they're happy in the CAA but with BU a PL member, maybe Northeastern would be a good all-sports addition. But they, like BU, don't play football! And they're probably over 10x our size. They don't? LOL. Didn't know you were talking football only. If you are only looking for a 3K-sized school in our geographic footprint with FCS football the NEC might have a member willing to leave.
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Post by cruskater31 on Jul 21, 2023 16:45:30 GMT -5
I do understand the academic and "like-minded" argument about who are our peers. I like Colonial Williamsburg and visited there a couple times when I loved in VA. Wouldn't mind having Bill and Mary in our conference even if geography does not add up. Nova, Fordham, Gtown (in sports other than football), Colgate, Cuse, Pitt, UVA, Duke, BC fit the bill to me more than most of the NEC. Maybe one could make an argument about Merrimack.
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hc69
Crusader Century Club
Posts: 224
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Post by hc69 on Jul 21, 2023 19:17:53 GMT -5
Pitt, UVA, and Duke are large AAU research universities. We're a small, undergraduate, liberal arts college. They would have no more interest in being in a FB conference with us than we should have in being in a FB conference with them.
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Post by longsuffering on Jul 21, 2023 19:47:34 GMT -5
I like HC's current five and sometimes six OOC games and think the Athletic Dept. is using them well. The gradual climb in FBS competition from UConn to Buffalo to BC and Army is well planned and coincides with when Coach Chesney probably started making a strong contribution to scheduling.
I just wish Georgetown would either hire a transformative coach who could turn the FB program around and/or add some number of scholarships to be more competitive. GU is surely the most elite and selective of the seven PL FB schools so they might be able to compete with forty or so scholarships if they can leverage admissions and financial aid along the lines of the Ivies. They aren't an Ivy but still a very prestigious university.
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Post by hcpride on Jul 22, 2023 7:08:00 GMT -5
I just wish Georgetown would either hire a transformative coach who could turn the FB program around and/or add some number of scholarships to be more competitive. GU is surely the most elite and selective of the seven PL FB schools so they might be able to compete with forty or so scholarships if they can leverage admissions and financial aid along the lines of the Ivies. They aren't an Ivy but still a very prestigious university. I think Georgetown views football like we do baseball and are content to have a team that participates in the PL sport. Picking their spots within the athletic program and certainly saving $’s.
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Post by longsuffering on Jul 22, 2023 18:11:31 GMT -5
Fordham got to the playoffs last year in a multiple bid league with 3/7 Jesuit schools, the other four all private like they are and a more compact geography than the CAA. I don't think they're going anywhere.
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Post by longsuffering on Jul 22, 2023 18:15:29 GMT -5
St. Francis of the NEC took Akron to overtime last year. ?!
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Post by DFW HOYA on Jul 22, 2023 18:46:45 GMT -5
Fordham got to the playoffs last year in a multiple bid league with 3/7 Jesuit schools, the other four all private like they are and a more compact geography than the CAA. I don't think they're going anywhere. I'm not so sure. The Coastal Athletic Association (or so they say) is built on the "too big to fail" model: expand, expand, expand. The next exit candidate is 2-3 years away: Delaware, unhappy at the relative mediocrity in Blue Hen Football, eager to be associated with the JMU's and Old Dominions of the region rather than Monmouth and Hampton. With that, the CAA will push for one or two more schools and get to 16, either two from the south (e.g., Mercer, West Florida) or the north. If they look north, Fordham will be considered. The trade off between playing Bucknell, Lafayette and Georgetown versus a CAA northern division with annual games with Albany, Stony Brook, UNH, URI, Maine, Monmouth, and Villanova would attract interest from a school which sees its ambitions above the PL, which is why they left in the first place. Fordham has a CAA-sized budget already and could convert to 63 scholarships and open recruiting literally overnight.
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Post by longsuffering on Jul 22, 2023 20:23:04 GMT -5
Fordham got to the playoffs last year in a multiple bid league with 3/7 Jesuit schools, the other four all private like they are and a more compact geography than the CAA. I don't think they're going anywhere. I'm not so sure. The Coastal Athletic Association (or so they say) is built on the "too big to fail" model: expand, expand, expand. The next exit candidate is 2-3 years away: Delaware, unhappy at the relative mediocrity in Blue Hen Football, eager to be associated with the JMU's and Old Dominions of the region rather than Monmouth and Hampton. With that, the CAA will push for one or two more schools and get to 16, either two from the south (e.g., Mercer, West Florida) or the north. If they look north, Fordham will be considered. The trade off between playing Bucknell, Lafayette and Georgetown versus a CAA northern division with annual games with Albany, Stony Brook, UNH, URI, Maine, Monmouth, and Villanova would attract interest from a school which sees its ambitions above the PL, which is why they left in the first place. Fordham has a CAA-sized budget already and could convert to 63 scholarships and open recruiting literally overnight. Then should the PL beat the CAA to the punch and let UNH, Maine, URI, Albany, Stony Brook, Villanova and Delaware know the PL is open to a 12 team, two division or something similar FB conference? I'd favor a six game league schedule, one out of division game, five division games, with five OOC games, but if say HC and UNH want to play each other and that game is not the league out of division game they both can use an OOC slot for that game and it won't count in the league standings. That is if we can't keep Fordham "down on the farm" as they say.
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Post by longsuffering on Jul 22, 2023 20:25:17 GMT -5
What would Fordham have to pay the PL to leave, ten bucks? How much to join the CAA, a million?
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Post by bfoley82 on Jul 23, 2023 6:36:53 GMT -5
I like HC's current five and sometimes six OOC games and think the Athletic Dept. is using them well. The gradual climb in FBS competition from UConn to Buffalo to BC and Army is well planned and coincides with when Coach Chesney probably started making a strong contribution to scheduling. I just wish Georgetown would either hire a transformative coach who could turn the FB program around and/or add some number of scholarships to be more competitive. GU is surely the most elite and selective of the seven PL FB schools so they might be able to compete with forty or so scholarships if they can leverage admissions and financial aid along the lines of the Ivies. They aren't an Ivy but still a very prestigious university. Chesney probably didn't even make the schedule the last few seasons as those deals are signed years in advance. BC signed a deal with Alabama ten years in advance bceagles.com/news/2021/6/9/football-bc-announces-future-series-with-alabamaBC and Holy Cross game in 2023 was announced in 2019 so ya Chesney did that deal. fbschedules.com/boston-college-adds-games-against-army-and-holy-cross-to-future-football-schedules/amp/
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Post by mm67 on Jul 23, 2023 7:54:33 GMT -5
Georgetown is committed to the BE. More bang for the buck. PL football is an add-on.
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Post by nycrusader2010 on Jul 23, 2023 19:24:04 GMT -5
Fordham got to the playoffs last year in a multiple bid league with 3/7 Jesuit schools, the other four all private like they are and a more compact geography than the CAA. I don't think they're going anywhere. I'm not so sure. The Coastal Athletic Association (or so they say) is built on the "too big to fail" model: expand, expand, expand. The next exit candidate is 2-3 years away: Delaware, unhappy at the relative mediocrity in Blue Hen Football, eager to be associated with the JMU's and Old Dominions of the region rather than Monmouth and Hampton. With that, the CAA will push for one or two more schools and get to 16, either two from the south (e.g., Mercer, West Florida) or the north. If they look north, Fordham will be considered. The trade off between playing Bucknell, Lafayette and Georgetown versus a CAA northern division with annual games with Albany, Stony Brook, UNH, URI, Maine, Monmouth, and Villanova would attract interest from a school which sees its ambitions above the PL, which is why they left in the first place. Fordham has a CAA-sized budget already and could convert to 63 scholarships and open recruiting literally overnight. Fordham ain't leaving the A-10 anytime in the next 5 years. And the CAA doesn't need football affiliates. If Delaware leaves in a few years, they'll be replaced by an all-sports member. Only football-only affiliate that would make sense for the CAA to bring in is UMass.
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Post by longsuffering on Jul 23, 2023 19:59:14 GMT -5
How many obituaries for UMass' venture into FBS have been written during recent years? They are as stubborn as a mule up thar in Amherst. UMass wanted to become an FBS school in the worst way possible. And they did.
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Post by nycrusader2010 on Jul 23, 2023 20:11:47 GMT -5
How many obituaries for UMass' venture into FBS have been written during recent years? They are as stubborn as a mule up thar in Amherst. UMass wanted to become an FBS school in the worst way possible. And they did. They waffled for a handful of years before making the ill-advised jump. UMass totally misread the landscape of FBS and did not anticipate the Big East split. They thought Bob Kraft's influence was going to get them into the Big East and that said conference would continue to play football. Total fail. Complete opposite of JMU who considered FBS overtures from multiple leagues over the course of 5-10 years and then actually made the jump to the right place at the right time.
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Post by nhteamer on Jul 24, 2023 7:07:43 GMT -5
I think Kamala Harris is moderating this thread
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Post by nycrusader2010 on Jul 24, 2023 7:13:09 GMT -5
I like HC's current five and sometimes six OOC games and think the Athletic Dept. is using them well. The gradual climb in FBS competition from UConn to Buffalo to BC and Army is well planned and coincides with when Coach Chesney probably started making a strong contribution to scheduling. I just wish Georgetown would either hire a transformative coach who could turn the FB program around and/or add some number of scholarships to be more competitive. GU is surely the most elite and selective of the seven PL FB schools so they might be able to compete with forty or so scholarships if they can leverage admissions and financial aid along the lines of the Ivies. They aren't an Ivy but still a very prestigious university. I don't think Chesney is responsible for scheduling FBS $$ games, that would be our ADs past and present. But I'm glad he's the one responsible for out-coaching these opponents come game day! We were also supposed to play BC in 2020 before the pandemic hit.
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Post by timholycross on Jul 24, 2023 9:09:22 GMT -5
How many obituaries for UMass' venture into FBS have been written during recent years? They are as stubborn as a mule up thar in Amherst. UMass wanted to become an FBS school in the worst way possible. And they did. They waffled for a handful of years before making the ill-advised jump. UMass totally misread the landscape of FBS and did not anticipate the Big East split. They thought Bob Kraft's influence was going to get them into the Big East and that said conference would continue to play football. Total fail. Complete opposite of JMU who considered FBS overtures from multiple leagues over the course of 5-10 years and then actually made the jump to the right place at the right time. "We'll be horrible for a few years and compound that by playing games a hundred miles from campus in; even on a good day, a half empty stadium; in a league (MAC) that very few students or alumni care or have even a clue about. Then move back to a place that has all the charm of Boston's City Hall Plaza". What could possibly go wrong with that plan? But the press box, etc. is a lot nicer!
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Post by longsuffering on Jul 24, 2023 10:06:05 GMT -5
Somehow UMass managed to go from the original Yankee Conference consisting of six land grant state universities that are the primary state university in their state to the MAC consisting of almost all secondary state universities. And then managed to drop lower than that as an FBS independent.
Still, the right coach could start a turn around and it will be a heck of a story if it happens. Coach Brown improved the 130th ranked FBS defense to the 55th ranked defense in his first year. Maybe the turn around has begun.
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