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Post by bison137 on Aug 9, 2024 22:00:53 GMT -5
If I remember the conversation with Coach Paulson at the District last fall, this is about what he said the schedule would look like. He wanted a few home games, and bus trip games to help manage his budget. Overnight games that are not pay games cost a lot of money from his budget… My comment to that would be double or triple the budget We are a college athletic program so do it right and stop the insanity by being so cheap One more buy game would cover the expenses for several other away games. Having said that, what I don’t understand is why not home-and-home games versus mid majors as opposed to playing D3 teams. it shouldn’t be remotely hard for HC to find New England home and home opponents.
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Post by longsuffering on Aug 9, 2024 23:23:28 GMT -5
At this stage of HC's on-court performance and student/community intetest, the number of home games is less important than getting better by playing the nearby D-1 teams a bus ride away.
There must be a hidden cost to playing two D-3 opponents with players not learning certain techniques don't work against D-1 competition when players are rewarded with points and stats when that technique does work against a shorter and slower D-3 opponent.
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Post by timholycross on Aug 10, 2024 8:49:05 GMT -5
I can see coming back from a break and playing what amounts to a scrimmage against some lower team. Regis fits that description. Mitchell does not.
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Post by Tom on Aug 10, 2024 17:27:57 GMT -5
If I remember the conversation with Coach Paulson at the District last fall, this is about what he said the schedule would look like. He wanted a few home games, and bus trip games to help manage his budget. Overnight games that are not pay games cost a lot of money from his budget… My comment to that would be double or triple the budget We are a college athletic program so do it right and stop the insanity by being so cheap Assuming HC doesn't have a budget surplus lying around somewhere, that would mean reducing the budget of a different department or increasing revenue. Easier to say double the budget than actually doing it
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Post by efg72 on Aug 10, 2024 18:58:32 GMT -5
As I said please reduce the budgets for other departments and invest to deliver success and additional revenues for athletics. Get rid of 15 athletic programs that deliver nothing more than a brief emotional lift and make those club sports. Faculty that doesn't deliver 4x their salary in grants can be eliminated, Administrative staff is often redundant so eliminate that group by 50%. Reduce the size of the BOT by 50%and make it relevant and effective with people that care about the total mission, tradition, and history of our great institution.
Sounds obnoxious I know, but we are at a watershed moment when it comes to our future, and I fear we are in deep trouble as an institution. We were built to promote the academic, athletic and spiritual mission the Jesuits worked so hard to achieve, and over the last few decades I fear the academic and spiritual mission have suffered, and the athletics is screaming for an identity.
We have a voice yet I think we have accepted being voiceless, in the name of political correctness. Time for us to step up and challenge the process and status quo.
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Aug 10, 2024 19:20:44 GMT -5
Are there many schools where faculty members secure 4X their compensation in grants?
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Post by efg72 on Aug 10, 2024 21:29:22 GMT -5
To me it make sense to turn tenure into a business proposition where you deliver or tenure is off the table
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Post by nycrusader2010 on Aug 11, 2024 5:26:51 GMT -5
Ohio St isn't coming back to the Hart Center No reason why we can not resume the Iona, Fordham, St. Peter's, Manhattan matchups on a regular basis Iona and/or Fairfield - yes Fordham - won't play us on the road St. Peter's - yawn Manhattan - yawn Wait, what am I yawning about, we're hosting 2 bad DIII teams. I'd rather drive 20 minutes to a game at Draddy in Riverdale than watch 5 minutes of the Mitchell game on ESPN+.
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Post by trimster on Aug 11, 2024 6:14:00 GMT -5
The fact that a team we had a long history with in hoops and is a football rival thru the PL, either won’t play us in hoops or will but only on their terms, really bothers me.
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Post by nycrusader2010 on Aug 11, 2024 6:52:28 GMT -5
The fact that a team we had a long history with in hoops and is a football rival thru the PL, either won’t play us in hoops or will but only on their terms, really bothers me. Remember, Fordham is in the A-10, we're in the Patriot League. URI doesn't come to the Hart Center either. Maybe they came to the DCU once in the last 15 years? Fordham, because a lot of opponents don't mind coming to NYC for limited guarantee $$$, doesn't have to do home-and-homes with low majors. They don't seem to have a problem getting small conference opponents to come to Rose Hill without a return game.
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Post by timholycross on Aug 11, 2024 8:12:00 GMT -5
The fact that a team we had a long history with in hoops and is a football rival thru the PL, either won’t play us in hoops or will but only on their terms, really bothers me. Remember, Fordham is in the A-10, we're in the Patriot League. URI doesn't come to the Hart Center either. Maybe they came to the DCU once in the last 15 years? Fordham, because a lot of opponents don't mind coming to NYC for limited guarantee $$$, doesn't have to do home-and-homes with low majors. They don't seem to have a problem getting small conference opponents to come to Rose Hill without a return game. I wouldn't want HC to swallow its pride completely and commit to an annual trip to the Fenway Park of college gyms. But going SOMEWHERE around there annually seems like is still worth something to the program and its supporters; although probably not as much as it was in my stay on the hill.
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Post by Non Alum Dave on Aug 11, 2024 8:29:30 GMT -5
I restate my earlier question: why go to the bother of getting in a MTE if you are going to end using the 2 bonus games to play D-3 teams? Who knows, maybe someone double crossed them, but I would like to ask one of you kind retirees with time on your hands to look at the final schedules of these schools, and see who they are playing on the dates of the Regis and Mitchell games: UMass Lowell, Stonehill, Northeastern, Dartmouth, Bryant, Fairfield, Yale, Marist, Albany, Princeton, St. Peter's, FDU, Stony Brook, Hofstra, Columbia, Iona, Manhattan, Wagner, LIU, and St Francis Brooklyn. Once we have that info, we will be in a better position to ask some pointed questions on Coaches Night.
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Post by sader1970 on Aug 11, 2024 11:32:55 GMT -5
What's this "we" stuff, NAD? I've already got a bad enough reputation with the questions I ask of staff and you've established yourself as the guy who gets under the coaches' skins at these Q&As with your questions. Change that "we" to "I," please. As a total aside, just got back from brunch with a guy whose grandson is a junior on the Brown football team. We were comparing football schedules and apparently Brown is playing many of the same teams as HC does (URI, Bryant, Georgetown, Harvard, Yale) and he asked me, "then why doesn't Holy Cross play Brown?" My snappy comeback was "well, we are going to play Brown in basketball."
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Post by hchoops on Aug 11, 2024 11:56:40 GMT -5
I restate my earlier question: why go to the bother of getting in a MTE if you are going to end using the 2 bonus games to play D-3 teams? Who knows, maybe someone double crossed them, but I would like to ask one of you kind retirees with time on your hands to look at the final schedules of these schools, and see who they are playing on the dates of the Regis and Mitchell games: UMass Lowell, Stonehill, Northeastern, Dartmouth, Bryant, Fairfield, Yale, Marist, Albany, Princeton, St. Peter's, FDU, Stony Brook, Hofstra, Columbia, Iona, Manhattan, Wagner, LIU, and St Francis Brooklyn. Once we have that info, we will be in a better position to ask some pointed questions on Coaches Night. St. Francis of Brooklyn no longer sponsors athletics.
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Post by hcnj on Aug 11, 2024 13:47:31 GMT -5
As I said please reduce the budgets for other departments and invest to deliver success and additional revenues for athletics. Get rid of 15 athletic programs that deliver nothing more than a brief emotional lift and make those club sports. Faculty that doesn't deliver 4x their salary in grants can be eliminated, Administrative staff is often redundant so eliminate that group by 50%. Reduce the size of the BOT by 50%and make it relevant and effective with people that care about the total mission, tradition, and history of our great institution. Sounds obnoxious I know, but we are at a watershed moment when it comes to our future, and I fear we are in deep trouble as an institution. We were built to promote the academic, athletic and spiritual mission the Jesuits worked so hard to achieve, and over the last few decades I fear the academic and spiritual mission have suffered, and the athletics is screaming for an identity. We have a voice yet I think we have accepted being voiceless, in the name of political correctness. Time for us to step up and challenge the process and status quo. you've touched the third rail of the argument between the "purity" of the educational system vs 'efficiency". I don't want to see colleges run like businesses in every sense but have watched tuition R&B rise much more than most other goods and services. Posters are like most alums, avoiding unpleasantness is preferable to a good analysis. BOT's hire their own and unless a college hits a financial crisis threatening everybody's ability to get their share I doubt anything will change. I applaud you for bringing the topic up and agree that the pendulum needs to shift back but am pessimistic.
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Wayne
Climbing Mt. St. James
Posts: 56
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Post by Wayne on Aug 11, 2024 20:34:34 GMT -5
Maybe 8-9 New England teams (HC, Merrimack, SHU, UVM, Maine, UNH, Brown, Dartmouth, Fairfield?) should get together and form a coalition. I get a few overlap in regards to conferences. Nonetheless, they should all share the same mission: We are always going to struggle to get home games, so let's commit to home and homes for the next several years. Figure out the dates, and go.
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Post by mm67 on Aug 11, 2024 22:02:37 GMT -5
As I said please reduce the budgets for other departments and invest to deliver success and additional revenues for athletics. Get rid of 15 athletic programs that deliver nothing more than a brief emotional lift and make those club sports. Faculty that doesn't deliver 4x their salary in grants can be eliminated, Administrative staff is often redundant so eliminate that group by 50%. Reduce the size of the BOT by 50%and make it relevant and effective with people that care about the total mission, tradition, and history of our great institution. Sounds obnoxious I know, but we are at a watershed moment when it comes to our future, and I fear we are in deep trouble as an institution. We were built to promote the academic, athletic and spiritual mission the Jesuits worked so hard to achieve, and over the last few decades I fear the academic and spiritual mission have suffered, and the athletics is screaming for an identity. We have a voice yet I think we have accepted being voiceless, in the name of political correctness. Time for us to step up and challenge the process and status quo. Respectfully, your complaint can trace its roots back to the modern era of post WWII college athletics at HC. In 1949 Bill Osmanski, HC's greatest, most highly decorated, most widely renowned football player was the head football coach at HC.He selected a bumper crop of top flight football players from the Chicago area. The entire group was denied admission due to academics. Many believe this was a turning point. Although in my family's recounting, HC was always known for high quality academics for all its students, athletes & non-athletes.Shortly afterward in the early '50's, HC promulgated what had been as it stated its long standing policy, to wit: student athletes are to reflective academically the entire student body as a whole. The school's policy was in effect prior to the announcement of an official Ivy League with much the same standards as HC. The college's sttement was more than a policy for athletic scholarships. It was a foundational cornerstone for HC. It reflects an academics first philosophy in all areas of the college's activities. It served as the basis for admissions, budgeting decisions, academic offerings , etc. This is the tradition of HC. The school simply will not adopt the changes you suggest. I recognize and truly admire your love for HC. There is nothing obnoxious. You are a loyal alum who loves HC. I do not suck up with feel good niceties. It's not my style. Truthfully, we all are truly the better for your input.
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Post by longsuffering on Aug 11, 2024 23:34:26 GMT -5
My comment to that would be double or triple the budget We are a college athletic program so do it right and stop the insanity by being so cheap One more buy game would cover the expenses for several other away games. Having said that, what I don’t understand is why not home-and-home games versus mid majors as opposed to playing D3 teams. it shouldn’t be remotely hard for HC to find New England home and home opponents. Not saying I agree with it but both Coaches Nelson and Paulsen may have concluded that one or two wins against D-3 teams are a constructive part of turning the program around. Maybe they are or maybe they aren't. We've played the games and the program isn't turned around.
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Post by sader1970 on Aug 12, 2024 5:26:22 GMT -5
Fixed it for you.
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Post by rgs318 on Aug 12, 2024 7:03:30 GMT -5
OK, it is not yet "turned" around and at its destination BUT it is "turning" around and is improving. This team is now deeper and is playing better ball than I have seen in some years (far too many). I believe HCDP and staff have a definite plan than is moving ahead and in the right direction. Only time will tell.
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Post by Sons of Vaval on Aug 12, 2024 8:41:33 GMT -5
I hate one non-D1 game on the schedule. Can't get on board with it. But, I do recognize this has become commonplace for a lot of mid and low-major teams to play a non-D1. Still don't like it.
Two games, however -- absolutely inexcusable. To NAD's point, unless some school really screwed us and left us in a bind, there's no good reason we should be playing Regis and Mitchell. We'd get more out of a difficult practice / intrasquad scrimmage than we do these games.
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Post by sader1970 on Aug 12, 2024 9:06:01 GMT -5
To clarify the thumbs up AND down: Means I agree but don't like it. Just an FYI.
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Post by CHC8485 on Aug 12, 2024 9:08:33 GMT -5
When I first read the schedule I somehow did not see the Mitchell game and thought one D3 is a good for this team, especially coming off Christmas break. Two D3 games is not acceptable - especially in my season ticket package! I think we need to establish a few scheduling principle where we can veer outside the principles, but stay as close as possible each year. Mine would look something like this - Keep games east of the Mississippi and north of (including) NC & TN. (i.e. flights under 3 hours, preferably under 2)
- 2 Buy Games (focus on Big East, ACC, Big 10, A-10 and Missouri Valley)
- 1 Multi-Team Event - in years without an MTE, take another buy game.
- 8 games (home & home) against any combination of America East, MAAC, NEC, Ivy, Northern CAA, Other CAA, Horizon, MEAC, MAC, Ohio Valley, SoCon (preference to the Bolded Conferences).
There are 91 schools in those 10 conferences in the last bullet. Start with this or a similar framework and begin scheduling to it so that, in 2 - 3 years as contracts run out for us and the other schools listed, we can have a complete D1 schedule every year.
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Post by efg72 on Aug 12, 2024 9:25:58 GMT -5
When I first read the schedule I somehow did not see the Mitchell game and thought one D3 is a good for this team, especially coming off Christmas break. Two D3 games is not acceptable - especially in my season ticket package! I think we need to establish a few scheduling principle where we can veer outside the principles, but stay as close as possible each year. Mine would look something like this - Keep games east of the Mississippi and north of (including) NC & TN. (i.e. flights under 3 hours, preferably under 2)
- 2 Buy Games (focus on Big East, ACC, Big 10, A-10 and Missouri Valley)
- 1 Multi-Team Event - in years without an MTE, take another buy game.
- 8 games (home & home) against any combination of America East, MAAC, NEC, Ivy, Northern CAA, Other CAA, Horizon, MEAC, MAC, Ohio Valley, SoCon (preference to the Bolded Conferences).
There are 91 schools in those 10 conferences in the last bullet. Start with this or a similar framework and begin scheduling to it so that, in 2 - 3 years as contracts run out for us and the other schools listed, we can have a complete D1 schedule every year.
Agree with the approach but would remove travel restrictions and would add two buy games- it guarantees a much better schedule for players and fans.
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Post by longsuffering on Aug 12, 2024 9:39:39 GMT -5
HC is not the customer in a buy game, we are the seller. The stronger team is the buyer so HC has to sell them on buying us for a game over all their other options. DP is probably a better salesperson than BN, but HC can't just order buy games off a menu. The teams buying the games have the menu. We have to look good on the dessert cart.
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