|
Post by joe on Feb 2, 2019 19:09:31 GMT -5
My point being it seems like very good coaches come and go at HC and fail to win, when they have won before, and win after. Chesney may be an upgrade but there was no rationale explanation why Gilmore could not win, nor many other coaches. This is on the school. Gilmore will have Lehigh going head to head with HC. Bank on it. Should be a very interesting and maybe even a real rivalry.
|
|
|
Post by efg72 on Feb 2, 2019 19:50:52 GMT -5
We all wish TG well and success, but no guarantees for success in sports anymore
|
|
|
Post by timholycross on Feb 2, 2019 20:10:12 GMT -5
Not to disparage Tom GIlmore, but who has HC dumped (not taken another job) that's resurfaced elsewhere and become a big winner? And I don't mean former head coach who went to a winning program as a right hand man either (Blaney).
Football: Boisture (had a good career but as a front office guy), Whitton,Wheelwright, Vaas; Doherty and Allen were more of a health situation than anything else.
Basketball: Donahue (Olympic coach, I'll give you that one, but it wasn't at a college or pro level, something entirely different); Raynor, Kearney, Milan Brown.
|
|
|
Post by jkh67 on Feb 2, 2019 20:45:28 GMT -5
Watch A-10 or Big East games as you can see the difference in athletes compared to Patriot League players. That's why the notion of getting to the Big East or even the A-10 is a big time stretch. For anyone who thinks otherwise, wake up. YOU CAN'T MOVE UP WITHOUT QUALITY PERSONNEL AND WE APPARENTLY DON'T HAVE QUALITY PERSONNEL FOR THE MOST PART. UNTIL YOU HAVE QUALITY PERSONNEL, THE MEDIOCRE RESULTS WILL BE THE SAME, REGARDLESS OF WHO THE COACH IS. This board having apparently gone politically correct recently, let me hasten to add that this is no "dis" on the current roster. I'm sure they all try as hard as they can, but the results speak for themselves.
|
|
|
Post by jkh67 on Feb 2, 2019 21:04:47 GMT -5
We all wish TG well and success, but no guarantees for success in sports anymore I don't wish "TG well and success"...especially against HC. Overall, he was a disaster for HC football who should have been let go years before Pine finally pulled the plugged. He's had "loser" written over him for many years...anyone remember that fiasco against Fordham...Fordham for God's sake, a school that had given up on football for several decades!...at Yankee Stadium a few years back!?! His overall record speaks for itself, his only success occurring when he lucked into an outstanding QB a decade ago. I've never met him, but I accept that he's a nice guy. But a good football coach, N-O, no.
|
|
|
Post by jkh67 on Feb 2, 2019 21:08:03 GMT -5
My point being it seems like very good coaches come and go at HC and fail to win, when they have won before, and win after. Chesney may be an upgrade but there was no rationale explanation why Gilmore could not win, nor many other coaches. This is on the school. Gilmore will have Lehigh going head to head with HC. Bank on it. Should be a very interesting and maybe even a real rivalry. I agree. "This is on the school" until the school decides that winning in its two marquee sports -- football and men's basketball -- is important. I wouldn't hold my breath, if I were you!
|
|
|
Post by jkh67 on Feb 2, 2019 21:09:42 GMT -5
You can't quit what you don't start. Did you see the 1st 10 minutes of this game?One of our players, nameless of course, committed 5 fouls in 3 minute of playing time. Why is this player "nameless of course"!?!
|
|
|
Post by efg72 on Feb 2, 2019 21:09:51 GMT -5
I would say the board is mindful and respectful of a current situation as opposed to politically correct-it should not prevent people from speaking out.
|
|
|
Post by efg72 on Feb 2, 2019 21:13:27 GMT -5
We all wish TG well and success, but no guarantees for success in sports anymore I don't wish "TG well and success"...especially against HC. Overall, he was a disaster for HC football who should have been let go years before Pine finally pulled the plugged. He's had "loser" written over him for many years...anyone remember that fiasco against Fordham...Fordham for God's sake, a school that had given up on football for several decades!...at Yankee Stadium a few years back!?! His overall record speaks for itself, his only success occurring when he lucked into an outstanding QB a decade ago. I've never met him, but I accept that he's a nice guy. But a good football coach, N-O, no. Wishing an individual well and success is the way you welcomed him and the way you should let him go. Success means many things that have little or nothing to do with football.
|
|
|
Post by Ignutz on Feb 2, 2019 22:30:31 GMT -5
I’m not giving up or giving in. These guys work too hard, and I’m sure that they’re more frustrated than any of us could be. I’m a Holy Cross fan, and I want to see wins, but these guys falling short won’t change my commitment. What will change my commitment is the team quitting, and I’m not at all worried that that will happen.
Hang in there guys!!
|
|
|
Post by Sons of Vaval on Feb 2, 2019 23:39:53 GMT -5
This program is toeing the very dangerous line of fans / alums becoming apathetic. People are (maybe they already have) losing interest, and there’s just no reason to really pay attention anymore.
What a mess Nate Pine left our winter sports programs.
|
|
|
Post by bringbackcaro on Feb 3, 2019 1:30:45 GMT -5
We all wish TG well and success, but no guarantees for success in sports anymore I don't wish "TG well and success"...especially against HC. Overall, he was a disaster for HC football who should have been let go years before Pine finally pulled the plugged. He's had "loser" written over him for many years...anyone remember that fiasco against Fordham...Fordham for God's sake, a school that had given up on football for several decades!...at Yankee Stadium a few years back!?! His overall record speaks for itself, his only success occurring when he lucked into an outstanding QB a decade ago. I've never met him, but I accept that he's a nice guy. But a good football coach, N-O, no. Absolutely ridiculous post. 1) If you want to find a “loser” look for the carpet bagger who took off for Colorado Springs and left HC’s athletic programs in shambles. 2) Aside from Ralph Willard, Tom Gilmore was one of the few bright spots at HC over the last ~20+ years.. He took a program that was on a straight course for nowhere and had 7 consecutive winning seasons from year two on. Trying to penalize him for recruiting Don Randolph is asinine. It’s truly sad to think that minus the new tweets, emojis, and hype videos, we would have been the same or better if Dick Regan and Milan Brown had just stuck around. Just atrocious management of the College from the cluelesss Fr.B.
|
|
|
Post by bringbackcaro on Feb 3, 2019 1:38:12 GMT -5
American started a freshman today who scored more points (17) than the whole two-man HC freshmen class has scored all year (10).
Time to blow the whole thing up.
|
|
|
Post by bigfan on Feb 3, 2019 7:55:17 GMT -5
Nate Pine did all he could to improve the athletic program. The fault lies with the administration.
|
|
|
Post by sader87 on Feb 3, 2019 7:57:11 GMT -5
I don't wish "TG well and success"...especially against HC. Overall, he was a disaster for HC football who should have been let go years before Pine finally pulled the plugged. He's had "loser" written over him for many years...anyone remember that fiasco against Fordham...Fordham for God's sake, a school that had given up on football for several decades!...at Yankee Stadium a few years back!?! His overall record speaks for itself, his only success occurring when he lucked into an outstanding QB a decade ago. I've never met him, but I accept that he's a nice guy. But a good football coach, N-O, no. Absolutely ridiculous post. 1) If you want to find a “loser” look for the carpet bagger who took off for Colorado Springs and left HC’s athletic programs in shambles. 2) Aside from Ralph Willard, Tom Gilmore was one of the few bright spots at HC over the last ~20+ years.. He took a program that was on a straight course for nowhere and had 7 consecutive winning seasons from year two on. Trying to penalize him for recruitiyng Don Randolph is asinine. It’s truly sad to think that minus the new tweets, emojis, and hype videos, we would have been the same or better if Dick Regan and Milan Brown had just stuck around. Just atrocious management of the College from the cluelesss Fr.B.
|
|
|
Post by sader87 on Feb 3, 2019 9:03:16 GMT -5
Absolutely ridiculous post. 1) If you want to find a “loser” look for the carpet bagger who took off for Colorado Springs and left HC’s athletic programs in shambles. 2) Aside from Ralph Willard, Tom Gilmore was one of the few bright spots at HC over the last ~20+ years.. He took a program that was on a straight course for nowhere and had 7 consecutive winning seasons from year two on. Trying to penalize him for recruitiyng Don Randolph is asinine. It’s truly sad to think that minus the new tweets, emojis, and hype videos, we would have been the same or better if Dick Regan and Milan Brown had just stuck around. Just atrocious management of the College from the cluelesss Fr.B. I assume you mean Father Burroughs? While he needs to fix this mess before the school loses what it has left of its identity, this to me is fully on Father Brooks. I don’t mean to speak ill of the deceased, but he was so wrong it pains me. This is a continuation of the mess he put in motion. I guess he thought we should lose our sports identity and immediately rise in the rankings to become the next Williams College. If Bucknell and Colgate can win, we can. I’m sick of losing! Fix this!!
|
|
|
Post by rgs318 on Feb 3, 2019 9:22:01 GMT -5
sader87, I do not agree it is "fully on Father Brooks." I am also sick of losing, but what Father Brooks did he did for what he believed was action in the best interests of Holy Cross. He quite correctly pointed out how so much of modern college athletics was becoming a swamp. However, his attempt at a solution did not have the desired effect on HC sports or on the overall college program. Plus, I feel you need to give him a pass on not doing much since he ended his time at Holy Cross log ago and he has done nothing one way or the other since his death. The "Devil Theory" of history is an interesting theory which does provide easy scape goats for anything that is wrong. But, if you really believe that today's problems at HC are the fault of Father Brooks, why stop there? Perhaps it is Bishop Fenwick's fault since he did so little in setting up an athletic program on the Hill. No? Well perhaps it is time to give this mantra about the "fault" of Father Brooks a rest.
|
|
|
Post by rgs318 on Feb 3, 2019 9:27:21 GMT -5
Basketball Confessional: I am truly heart broken about this team. I expected so much more from them. I had high hopes for this team.The players are good and fine young men, too. The coach is good with a fine reputation. They started out doing very well with success in the OOC sked. I do not understand why they have regressed during this season. I do not know what happened with this team. In my ignorance I hesitate to criticize the players too harshly. After all they are fellow Crusaders, part of a brotherhood/sisterhood soon to join us in the ranks of fellow alums. Coach Carmody? The bottom line is that this team is playing terrible basketball. They have regressed during the season.They look confused on the court. Defense and rebounding (which are the hallmarks of determination and heart as much as anything else) have been terrible and getting worse. Is it x's and o's? Is it merely a failure to game plan and make adjustments? Is it a failure to execute? Is it lack of talent? What is it? I feel terrible and very upset for the players, the students, the coaches, the fans( faculty & administrators included) and yes the proud, loving alums especially those alums who tirelessly post on this board. All of us share in the pain of this lost season. LoveHC Well, it is not quite "lost" just yet. There can always be hope...as all fans know. After all, I know many fans of the '69 NY Mets, the Brooklyn Dodgers and Chicago Cubs who believed things could get better. Their belief was finally rewarded.
|
|
|
Post by efg72 on Feb 3, 2019 9:32:15 GMT -5
Basketball Confessional: I am truly heart broken about this team. I expected so much more from them. I had high hopes for this team.The players are good and fine young men, too. The coach is good with a fine reputation. They started out doing very well with success in the OOC sked. I do not understand why they have regressed during this season. I do not know what happened with this team. In my ignorance I hesitate to criticize the players too harshly. After all they are fellow Crusaders, part of a brotherhood/sisterhood soon to join us in the ranks of fellow alums. Coach Carmody? The bottom line is that this team is playing terrible basketball. They have regressed during the season.They look confused on the court. Defense and rebounding (which are the hallmarks of determination and heart as much as anything else) have been terrible and getting worse. Is it x's and o's? Is it merely a failure to game plan and make adjustments? Is it a failure to execute? Is it lack of talent? What is it? I feel terrible and very disappointed for the players, the students, the coaches, the fans and yes, the loving alumni who tirelessly post on this board.All of us share in the terrible pain of this lost season. LoveHC I couldn’t agree more, but I honestly believe the team started to fall apart and no longer play as a team when it focused on featuring Floyd on offense and protecting him on defense. The offense isn’t designed for one player to go 1-1 and leave the rest of the team standing and watching. It makes us look totally lost on offense, with the exception of a momentary surge. Sure the other teams knew how to attack ourdefefense and slow our cuts, but execution beats strategy every day. With no disrespect directed to anybody, there is no leadership on the floor. This should be Green’s team, even as a sophomore. Benzan and Butler try and take that role, but I think the level of play would improve significantly if this becomes Green’s team. This will help make Butler, Grandison and Green that much more productive Defensively we need to play whatever zone or man that uses the talent on the roster. While I defer to the coaches, but really don’t like the 1-3-1 with this current group unless it is used to change a look for a 2-3 minute stretch. ‘And they need to find a way to use Copeland and Hargis, with Faw hurting and Niego out.
|
|
|
Post by trimster on Feb 3, 2019 9:43:28 GMT -5
I think they will only get better when enough people or the right people as in the Board of Trustees, demand the sinking ship our athletic program has become, be righted. Let me add, I say that in terms of wins and losses only. I know there are many outstanding people that are fine representatives of HC, in the athletic program. The sport I follow most closely, the men’s hoop program, for the most part has been a dumpster fire since 1985, That is a long time. There have been some exceptions such as most of the Willard era and the last 4-5 years of the Blaney era, but we have seen a lot of bad basketball for 35 years. Enough already with losing and the accompanying lack of interest in the program that I think many alums and fans view as the college’s marquee sport.
|
|
|
Post by hcpride on Feb 3, 2019 9:52:31 GMT -5
Last year we had 12 wins. Not much lost to graduation (a plus) and nothing gained via recruits (a minus) . Similar schedule and same coach. The largest group of prognosticators (by far) picked 17-19 wins. HC fans so that optimism is understandable. We're at 12 wins now. We've still got a shot at nearly meeting that widely-held expectation. (Note: The second largest group picked 14-16 wins.)
|
|
|
Post by DiMarz on Feb 3, 2019 10:03:50 GMT -5
I watched the game closely yesterday and came away with a few observations...
The players need to shoot the ball with much more confidence..Too many drives to the hoop and missed layups..They need to go strong and finish, too many shots seemed to be tossed up trying to avoid a block...
On offense, the first 3 or 4 passes don't seem to do anything, they don't move the zone. Teams are defending the offense very well. Very few back-cuts for hoops in league play, and teams are doubling JF and taking away his drive..There were quite a few instances of players driving the baseline and then stopping under the hoop..not good individual play..
The defense, players are always running at the ball, rather than getting to the ball on the pass..And nobody stepped in to stop penetration..
I believe the team as a whole needs to get more aggressive..Both ends of the floor..Commit a few more fouls and shoot more free throws..Become more physical in all aspects of the game...They need to get their swagger back..
|
|
|
Post by joe on Feb 3, 2019 10:15:59 GMT -5
On a purely personal indirectly related note. I think that the remodeled gym stinks. $90million+ gets HC a glorified HS gym with roll back bleacher seating for the school's signature sport. It is not an attractive lure for future prospects and there are more attractive, better facilities within the PL. Go figure! Still, LoveHC Could not agree more. Unless you’re Harvard, you can’t be taken seriously with a gym like this. Look at Bucknell and Navy. If we took basketball seriously we’d be in a serious league and we’d use the DCU as our home court, like Seton Hall, St. John’s, and others.
|
|
|
Post by efg72 on Feb 3, 2019 10:17:52 GMT -5
I watched the game closely yesterday and came away with a few observations... The players need to shoot the ball with much more confidence..Too many drives to the hoop and missed layups..They need to go strong and finish, too many shots seemed to be tossed up trying to avoid a block... On offense, the first 3 or 4 passes don't seem to do anything, they don't move the zone. Teams are defending the offense very well. Very few back-cuts for hoops in league play, and teams are doubling JF and taking away his drive..There were quite a few instances of players driving the baseline and then stopping under the hoop..not good individual play.. The defense, players are always running at the ball, rather than getting to the ball on the pass..And nobody stepped in to stop penetration.. I believe the team as a whole needs to get more aggressive..Both ends of the floor..Commit a few more fouls and shoot more free throws..Become more physical in all aspects of the game...They need to get their swagger back.. Agree They are not patient enough with the offense leading to lazy passes that all ow the defense to step into lanes or just wait for cutters. This frequently results in dribble penetration to dead spots or tossing the ball into a 1-1 post up. Our cuts are soft and often behind the defender allowing for them to step into passing/cutting lanes and make a play. defensively we are left with Grandison and Butler matched up in the post with the opponent’s big-they fight hard but it is very much a mismatch.
|
|
|
Post by efg72 on Feb 3, 2019 10:18:05 GMT -5
I watched the game closely yesterday and came away with a few observations... The players need to shoot the ball with much more confidence..Too many drives to the hoop and missed layups..They need to go strong and finish, too many shots seemed to be tossed up trying to avoid a block... On offense, the first 3 or 4 passes don't seem to do anything, they don't move the zone. Teams are defending the offense very well. Very few back-cuts for hoops in league play, and teams are doubling JF and taking away his drive..There were quite a few instances of players driving the baseline and then stopping under the hoop..not good individual play.. The defense, players are always running at the ball, rather than getting to the ball on the pass..And nobody stepped in to stop penetration.. I believe the team as a whole needs to get more aggressive..Both ends of the floor..Commit a few more fouls and shoot more free throws..Become more physical in all aspects of the game...They need to get their swagger back.. Agree They are not patient enough with the offense leading to lazy passes that all ow the defense to step into lanes or just wait for cutters. This frequently results in dribble penetration to dead spots or tossing the ball into a 1-1 post up. Our cuts are soft and often behind the defender allowing for them to step into passing/cutting lanes and make a play. defensively we are left with Grandison and Butler matched up in the post with the opponent’s big-they fight hard but it is very much a mismatch.
|
|