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Post by jaredcurry on Mar 4, 2023 9:17:48 GMT -5
“Him getting fired after year 5 has nothing to do with the current potential major mistake of bringing Nelson back for a 5th year” -White guy. Some people seem to be missing the point of what jaredcurry and Ray are bringing up (as they often miss mine). Guys that are loyal to Coach Brown are “pissed” and they have every right to be. First loyalty to their coach. More importantly BN has been an abject failure in so many ways. The in game coaching is horrible, so many of the players that he has recruited hand left the team or the College and he’s a terrible representative of the school. No interaction with with anyone plus he has the demeanor of an unsympathetic funeral director. If they let Coach Brown go, 4 or 5 years not being a relevant factor, this guy should be gone. And for whatever my opinion is worth, using the criteria I set forth above, Coach Brown was a much better coach and representative of our College. Exactly.
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Post by nycrusader2010 on Mar 4, 2023 9:27:10 GMT -5
I don't disagree with the decision to move on from Brown after 4,5 or however many years it was. His record AT THAT TIME was clearly below expectation for Holy Cross.
However, Nelson has lowered the bar beyond anyone's wildest imagination. The fact that a move has yet to be made is mind-boggling, if indeed he is going to be retained for another season.
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Post by WorcesterGray on Mar 4, 2023 9:37:48 GMT -5
Maybe overthinking this a bit. Likely that Nelson is coming back and that he and Kit are just knocking noggins to tweak next year's OOC schedule, knowing what a sore spot that has been for some.
Among other opponents being considered are a Biddy Ball club from Springfield and a traveling team of bad-ass Carmelite nuns, starting a rivalry that TPTB believes will become habit-forming for the six souls remaining in the fan base (no, we will not be wearing the black unis for that one).
Let's WIN!
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Post by jaredcurry on Mar 4, 2023 9:38:01 GMT -5
I don't disagree with the decision to move on from Brown after 4,5 or however many years it was. His record AT THAT TIME was clearly below expectation for Holy Cross. However, Nelson has lowered the bar beyond anyone's wildest imagination. The fact that a move has yet to be made is mind-boggling, if indeed he is going to be retained for another season. It is mind boggling, and we all need to begin to act. With that said, 20+ ex players and myself, are currently putting together a letter as well as daily phone, and email correspondence.
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Post by Sons of Vaval on Mar 4, 2023 9:43:44 GMT -5
This is what’s needed ^
ADKH needs to feel the pressure from alums and basketball alums. A bombardment of emails and calls directed at him needs to happen. He needs to know that without a move being made, just about every supporter of the program will turn their back (save for DiMarz).
This is a big test for him.
He should not be scrambling to get this done. He’s had more than a year to prepare for this knowing this day was right around the corner.
Plus, if he’s a good manager / boss, none of this should be coming as a surprise to Nelson. I assume there’s a standing weekly meeting they have. The awful performance and what could be coming should have been at the forefront.
Let’s see what you’re made of here, ADKH.
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Post by newfieguy74 on Mar 4, 2023 9:51:24 GMT -5
I don't think the following is true, but I've sometimes wondered if Crossports is perceived by some as a group of mostly older, cranky, over sensitive, nit-picking alums whose unremitting scrutiny of HC sports is not representative of alums as a whole. I like KH--a lot-- so I don't think he would have this mindset.
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Post by bigfan on Mar 4, 2023 9:53:03 GMT -5
Is it possible that ADKH does not have the power to fire BN?
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Post by HC92 on Mar 4, 2023 9:58:40 GMT -5
The only thing I could think of as a possible explanation for why it might take us until next week to announce a change is that this is a very busy weekend for the athletic dept. Baseball is in NC. Softball is in FL. We’re hosting two lax games. Hockey is in the playoffs in Springfield. Track has the ECAC Championships. It’s a horribly weak excuse but maybe they want to hit the ground running with a full staff to make the announcement and handle whatever comes next. Seems somewhat more plausible than the lost contract theory. And I can’t bring myself to even consider the notion that we’re not actually going to make a move.
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Post by hceconhist on Mar 4, 2023 10:00:54 GMT -5
I can tell you for a fact: his former players are INCENSED over the double standard. Milan Brown had 5 years, and inherited a much better program than Nelson (1 year removed from RW). Milan has a 12-year track record as a head coach and it’s very clear what he is — a below .500 head coach. “You are what your record says you are.” Him getting fired after year 5 has nothing to do with the current potential major mistake of bringing Nelson back for a 5th year. Neither is a good fit to be the head coach at Holy Cross. We were also making a big mistake in allowing Carmody to return for a 5th year. This handling of this program has been completely botched every which way by the ADs and TPTB since the day RW left for Louisville. If you don’t see a double standard, you don’t understand how he was treated. If he was nearly as bad as Nelson, he wouldn’t have gotten a Year 4 - let alone a Year 5.
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Post by thecrossisback on Mar 4, 2023 10:01:08 GMT -5
This is frustrating!
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Post by spenser on Mar 4, 2023 10:03:16 GMT -5
Is it possible that ADKH does not have the power to fire BN? Not if it’s going to cost between 350 and 700k.
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Post by HC92 on Mar 4, 2023 10:03:42 GMT -5
I don't think the following is true, but I've sometimes wondered if Crossports is perceived by some as a group of mostly older, cranky, over sensitive, nit-picking alums whose unremitting scrutiny of HC sports is not representative of alums as a whole. I like KH--a lot-- so I don't think he would have this mindset. We’re definitely not representative of alums as a whole because we actually still care about HC sports. Most alums have long since given up on men’s basketball. But we’re hanging in there trying to advocate in some small way for change that will help move the program and the school as a whole forward.
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Post by nycrusader2010 on Mar 4, 2023 10:12:39 GMT -5
I don't think the following is true, but I've sometimes wondered if Crossports is perceived by some as a group of mostly older, cranky, over sensitive, nit-picking alums whose unremitting scrutiny of HC sports is not representative of alums as a whole. I like KH--a lot-- so I don't think he would have this mindset. I would opine that yes it is perceived that way by some for sure.
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Post by A Clock Tower Purple on Mar 4, 2023 10:13:17 GMT -5
Radio silence to this point means get ready for the "results were not what fans deserve and we're already working hard to improve next season" note signed by Nelson but penned by someone else coming to your inbox by Monday.
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Post by trimster on Mar 4, 2023 10:14:38 GMT -5
I don't think the following is true, but I've sometimes wondered if Crossports is perceived by some as a group of mostly older, cranky, over sensitive, nit-picking alums whose unremitting scrutiny of HC sports is not representative of alums as a whole. I like KH--a lot-- so I don't think he would have this mindset. We’re definitely not representative of alums as a whole because we actually still care about HC sports. Most alums have long since given up on men’s basketball. But we’re hanging in there trying to advocate in some small way for change that will help move the program and the school as a whole forward. Maybe there just aren't enough of us who think a more successful athletic program, done in the right way, promotes Holy Cross.
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Post by gks on Mar 4, 2023 10:16:53 GMT -5
Could it just be that the administration has determined basketball isn't a priority anymore?
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Post by hceconhist on Mar 4, 2023 10:18:47 GMT -5
Could it just be that the administration has determined basketball isn't a priority anymore? Yes
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Post by Bleed Purple on Mar 4, 2023 10:27:19 GMT -5
It is now spring break. Most team members are off campus. If we "pull the trigger" next week, how would the team be informed? Zoom meeting? Need to wait until the week of March 13 when they are back on campus? They had a 3 day window (Wed, Thur, Fri of this week) to get this done and missed it.
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Post by Tom on Mar 4, 2023 10:34:41 GMT -5
I have to believe BN is going to be fired. In his four years even mediocrity has proven elusive, let alone excellence. KH understands, TPTB understand. Maybe they're negotiating a buy-out. Money can't be used as a justification to keep a coach who has failed like BN has. I am assuming that if HC wants to fire him, they have to pay his full salary. Does anyone know whether a typical head coaching contract allows him to take another coaching job without reduction of this payout? Would that be the reason for some sort of negotiation? I would assume that no coach can coach someplace other than their employer while under contract. That is why there are buy outs. You might recall that Coach Kearney waited until his contract expired before taking a job on the Colorado basketball staff. He did some radio stuff but was not associated with any basketball program. If a school wants to move in another direction, they can relieve a coach of all responsibilities, but that coach would still be an employee of the school for the duration of the contract. Many times both parties can agree to end the contract early for mutual benefit. The coach can get another job in his field rather than sit home and twiddle his thumbs and the school gets a discount
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Post by jaredcurry on Mar 4, 2023 10:40:02 GMT -5
It is now spring break. Most team members are off campus. If we "pull the trigger" next week, how would the team be informed? Zoom meeting? Need to wait until the week of March 13 when they are back on campus? They had a 3 day window (Wed, Thur, Fri of this week) to get this done and missed it. Speaking from only my perspective, the basketball team did not have a spring break. I doubt that still is the case, which is truly unbelievable in terms of how bad this has been F’d up.
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Post by HC92 on Mar 4, 2023 10:41:06 GMT -5
It is now spring break. Most team members are off campus. If we "pull the trigger" next week, how would the team be informed? Zoom meeting? Need to wait until the week of March 13 when they are back on campus? They had a 3 day window (Wed, Thur, Fri of this week) to get this done and missed it. One thing we may be missing here is that it’s possible the team and Coach Nelson have been told he’s not coming back but the school is delaying the announcement for some reason.
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Post by Ray on Mar 4, 2023 10:54:09 GMT -5
In this day and age, I don’t think that secret could be kept for long.
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Post by alum on Mar 4, 2023 11:06:47 GMT -5
I am assuming that if HC wants to fire him, they have to pay his full salary. Does anyone know whether a typical head coaching contract allows him to take another coaching job without reduction of this payout? Would that be the reason for some sort of negotiation? I would assume that no coach can coach someplace other than their employer while under contract. That is why there are buy outs. You might recall that Coach Kearney waited until his contract expired before taking a job on the Colorado basketball staff. He did some radio stuff but was not associated with any basketball program. If a school wants to move in another direction, they can relieve a coach of all responsibilities, but that coach would still be an employee of the school for the duration of the contract. Many times both parties can agree to end the contract early for mutual benefit. The coach can get another job in his field rather than sit home and twiddle his thumbs and the school gets a discount This was my thought. Perhaps he and his agent are trying to assess his ability to get an assistant job before agreeing on a price. Or, maybe Kit is keeping him🤔
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Post by bringbackcaro on Mar 4, 2023 11:12:04 GMT -5
Milan Brown had 5 years, and inherited a much better program than Nelson (1 year removed from RW). Milan has a 12-year track record as a head coach and it’s very clear what he is — a below .500 head coach. “You are what your record says you are.” Him getting fired after year 5 has nothing to do with the current potential major mistake of bringing Nelson back for a 5th year. Neither is a good fit to be the head coach at Holy Cross. We were also making a big mistake in allowing Carmody to return for a 5th year. This handling of this program has been completely botched every which way by the ADs and TPTB since the day RW left for Louisville. If you don’t see a double standard, you don’t understand how he was treated. If he was nearly as bad as Nelson, he wouldn’t have gotten a Year 4 - let alone a Year 5. Coach 1 5 years complete 1 year remaining on contract (~$300K) AD: Pine President: Burroughs Coach 2 4 years complete (including COVID year) 2 years remaining on contract (~$700K) AD: Hughes President: Rougeau Assuming the contract terms above are correct, can you please be very clear on what the double standard is? I see two different situations with different stakeholders involved.
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Post by Pakachoag Phreek on Mar 4, 2023 11:23:38 GMT -5
I don't think the following is true, but I've sometimes wondered if Crossports is perceived by some as a group of mostly older, cranky, over sensitive, nit-picking alums whose unremitting scrutiny of HC sports is not representative of alums as a whole. I like KH--a lot-- so I don't think he would have this mindset. I would opine that yes it is perceived that way by some for sure. The original board was basketball centric, with football a distant second in interest. That board was begun during the RW era, and IIRC, it sprung up about the same time that HC (and the PL) restored scollies for basketball, and HC led the pack in ramping up (which helped RW's recruiting). If there was a de novo board created last year, it very likely would be football-centric.
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