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Army (M)
Jan 19, 2017 8:16:47 GMT -5
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Post by ncaam on Jan 19, 2017 8:16:47 GMT -5
I may have missed it here on the board but does anyone know what the exact injury is to RC and how long he will not be at 100% Heard a rumor that it's a bone spur in a foot. Have to ask NHT if cortisone will work or surgery is needed.
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Post by purplehaze on Jan 19, 2017 8:17:32 GMT -5
agree that this is not a win to get all excited about, except for the way it happened. anytime you come from 17 down in the 2nd half on the road, it qualifies as a very good win. can someone tell me when was the last time we scored 50 points in a half ?
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Post by hc6774 on Jan 19, 2017 8:38:22 GMT -5
can you have a great come back, a good win [on the road] in a bad game?? re PO pace: I believe I saw a stat that AWP 18 secs per shot; HC 17 sec per shot...
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Army (M)
Jan 19, 2017 8:40:12 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by ncaam on Jan 19, 2017 8:40:12 GMT -5
We did not run the p o in the second half.
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Post by hchoops on Jan 19, 2017 8:44:17 GMT -5
We played up tempo since Army pressed and we attacked it. the rare times we did set up, we were running the PO, the only man offense we have. Rarely do teams change their offensive systems halfway through a season. CBC has played the PO for years now, he is not changing
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Post by nhteamer on Jan 19, 2017 8:45:07 GMT -5
Nice win
W
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Jan 19, 2017 8:45:13 GMT -5
It seems to me that we get in a hole early in majority of games lately and maybe time to start Benzan both halves and have At off the bench again . In one recent season--don't recall if it was last year or during Coach Brown's tenure, we had discussed the same thing and a quick study of our games showed that was indeed the case: we got behind at the start of most games. I took a few minutes to look at the play-by-play for our PL games this year to determine our advantage or deficit . Listed below are the advantage/deficit for the (1) first 5 minutes of game, (2) remaining 15 minutes of first half, (3) first 5 minutes of second half, (4) remaining 15 of second half Boston U= (2), +1, +1, (6)= lost this game as we were outscored at the end Navy= +3, (6), E, +4= outscored Navy at beginning and end of game to win Colgate= +11, (6), +3, (2)= Got off to a fantastic start which helped us prevail despite a couple of Colgate runs Bucknell= (3), (5), (2), (9)= outplayed by a better team throughout the game Lafayette= +5, +15, +7, (10) = HC dominated the scoring and then gave back some points when the game was in hand :Lehigh= (2), +3, (8), (10)= looked great in the first half but then we could not stop Lehigh in second half Army= (10), E, +7, +22= this appears to be the one game where we got off to a terrible start and had to dig out of a hole Composite= +2, +1, +8, (9)
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Post by cmo on Jan 19, 2017 8:46:59 GMT -5
Getting back to serious basketball. cf I agree. Coach blanched when cls took and missed that deep three after his scoring run. Hopefully coach realizes we blanch too at those heaves with 3 or fewer seconds on the shot clock. We must lead the nation with such shots. Anyone have a stat? Not sure of the exact numbers, but CMB's teams hold the all time record for end of shot clock heaves.
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Post by Sons of Vaval on Jan 19, 2017 9:36:43 GMT -5
agree that this is not a win to get all excited about, except for the way it happened. anytime you come from 17 down in the 2nd half on the road, it qualifies as a very good win. can someone tell me when was the last time we scored 50 points in a half ? We beat a top 200 team (at the time) on the road. That, in and of itself, makes it a nice win. This is a game in which we lost many times before under BBC's lord and savior Ralph Willard. My best guess for the last time we score 50 in a half: San Francisco during the 2008-09 season.
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Post by WCHC Sports on Jan 19, 2017 9:40:35 GMT -5
It seems to me that we get in a hole early in majority of games lately and maybe time to start Benzan both halves and have At off the bench again . In one recent season--don't recall if it was last year or during Coach Brown's tenure, we had discussed the same thing and a quick study of our games showed that was indeed the case: we got behind at the start of most games. I took a few minutes to look at the play-by-play for our PL games this year to determine our advantage or deficit . Listed below are the advantage/deficit for the (1) first 5 minutes of game, (2) remaining 15 minutes of first half, (3) first 5 minutes of second half, (4) remaining 15 of second half Boston U= (2), +1, +1, (6)= lost this game as we were outscored at the end Navy= +3, (6), E, +4= outscored Navy at beginning and end of game to win Colgate= +11, (6), +3, (2)= Got off to a fantastic start which helped us prevail despite a couple of Colgate runs Bucknell= (3), (5), (2), (9)= outplayed by a better team throughout the game Lafayette= +5, +15, +7, (10) = HC dominated the scoring and then gave back some points when the game was in hand :Lehigh= (2), +3, (8), (10)= looked great in the first half but then we could not stop Lehigh in second half Army= (10), E, +7, +22= this appears to be the one game where we got off to a terrible start and had to dig out of a hole Composite= +2, +1, +8, (9)
Very interesting stats here. This would support my statement for most of the season-- that a team with a very short rotation will have tired legs late in the game, and perhaps fade down the stretch. Also, weak FT shooting will hurt us late in games as well.
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Post by A Clock Tower Purple on Jan 19, 2017 9:40:57 GMT -5
Getting back to serious basketball. cf I agree. Coach blanched when cls took and missed that deep three after his scoring run. Hopefully coach realizes we blanch too at those heaves with 3 or fewer seconds on the shot clock. We must lead the nation with such shots. Anyone have a stat? Not sure of the exact numbers, but CMB's teams hold the all time record for end of shot clock heaves. Without question.
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Post by WCHC Sports on Jan 19, 2017 9:41:26 GMT -5
Getting back to serious basketball. cf I agree. Coach blanched when cls took and missed that deep three after his scoring run. Hopefully coach realizes we blanch too at those heaves with 3 or fewer seconds on the shot clock. We must lead the nation with such shots. Anyone have a stat? Not sure of the exact numbers, but CMB's teams hold the all time record for end of shot clock heaves. RW had his share of them too. There were plenty of stretches where we were praying for some offensive firepower or at a minimum, a more efficient system.
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Post by Tom on Jan 19, 2017 10:07:29 GMT -5
It looks to me that we have three "bands" of teams: Bucknell (solid, deep, no surprises), Lehigh (Kempton and more), and Boston U (talented) fighting for the top with quite a gap to the next band of Navy (resurgent), Holy Cross, Army and Loyola. Then we have Colgate (moribund), American (likely to improve?) and Lafayette (woeful) in the bottom three spots. Well, I'm excited about last night Assuming the above breakdown is basically accurate, only one team in the middle third will host a quarter-final game. On the flip side, one team in the middle third will be thinking about four games in March instead of three. A road win against another middle third school is a big step towards getting that home quarter-final It's easy to say "we're still in this", "keep playing hard", or "we can do this". It's another to actually believe it. Once you actually prevail against adversity, it's a big confidence boost. A win like this, the ability to say. "we've been here before and won" is a big piece of the puzzle that turns 15 kids into a winning team
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Post by hchoops on Jan 19, 2017 10:22:59 GMT -5
There may be more than 3 tiers. Perhaps Bucknell is in a tier of its own, The way Lehigh and BU have played recently may put them back, at least a bit, maybe one of them to the 3rd tier.
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Post by cfrivals on Jan 19, 2017 10:26:44 GMT -5
Yes it was Army, yes we were down 17pts to them, but I saw us abandon the PO and go with more uptempo. We scored almost 50 pts in 15 min. That never happens with our going nowhere 30 sec running around the three point line offense. The passing lane and ball defense was excellent in the second half. So for that fact, I can say CBC saw that things were not working and did make an adjustment, heck CLS played and produced. With that said, I think the PO has got to go, it doesn't work any longer because of the shorter shot clock. We need to develop an offense that can score and rebound. Plain and simple. If we don't, then wins against Army and Colgate will be talked about as huge!! I can remember hearing much the same thing about the 1-3-1 before last year's PL tournament. How did that work?i I agree that the Princeton offense does not work in every case, especially when the defense packs in the lane forcing outside shots (and those shots do not hit!). However, abandoning it may be like throwing the baby out with the bath water. If the team now can run the p.o., it makes sense to have a "plan B" for those times. HC had some trouble with the late-game press on a few games, but when Army tried it, they made the cadets pay (leading in one case to a beautiful pass down court to KC leading to a basket). I guess experienced coaches can teach some things during the season. I have been to every home game and seen every game on TV or the internet. What you want to call the PO on this team its just a stall offense. There is no movement, we just burn clock and end up heaving a rush 3 point shot. This have been the remedy for most games. We get blown out by the decent teams because that formula doesn't work unless you light it up from three land. -20 in rebounding stats will equal a loss every time.. Although I loved the 4 games in last March, we are now thinking that will happen every year as we will pull a rabbit out of our hats that no team has ever seen, Don't bank on it! I like CBC and I think he will stabilize the program, but believe as do many others in attendance at the games, he needs to tweek a bit with this team. Was glad to see that last night.
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Post by WorcesterGray on Jan 19, 2017 10:28:15 GMT -5
Not sure of the exact numbers, but CMB's teams hold the all time record for end of shot clock heaves. RW had his share of them too. There were plenty of stretches where we were praying for some offensive firepower or at a minimum, a more efficient system. Many of RW's teams were excruciating to watch at the offensive end. But those teams more than compensated for this deficiency with their superior offensive rebounding and lock-down defenses - neither one of which Holy Cross has had since.
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Post by hchoops on Jan 19, 2017 10:42:42 GMT -5
I can remember hearing much the same thing about the 1-3-1 before last year's PL tournament. How did that work?i I agree that the Princeton offense does not work in every case, especially when the defense packs in the lane forcing outside shots (and those shots do not hit!). However, abandoning it may be like throwing the baby out with the bath water. If the team now can run the p.o., it makes sense to have a "plan B" for those times. HC had some trouble with the late-game press on a few games, but when Army tried it, they made the cadets pay (leading in one case to a beautiful pass down court to KC leading to a basket). I guess experienced coaches can teach some things during the season. I have been to every home game and seen every game on TV or the internet. What you want to call the PO on this team its just a stall offense. There is no movement, we just burn clock and end up heaving a rush 3 point shot. This have been the remedy for most games. We get blown out by the decent teams because that formula doesn't work unless you light it up from three land. -20 in rebounding stats will equal a loss every time.. Although I loved the 4 games in last March, we are now thinking that will happen every year as we will pull a rabbit out of our hats that no team has ever seen, Don't bank on it! I like CBC and I think he will stabilize the program, but believe as do many others in attendance at the games, he needs to tweek a bit with this team. Was glad to see that last night. The PO is not just a stall offense. When the players execute it well, it produces back cuts for layups, quick post ups and open 3s. It is an offense vs man defenses only. When it is not run effectively, it results in last second rushed shots or turnovers, that are at least dead ball turnovers which do not result in transition opportunities. Pete Carrill's and now CBC's PO worked when they have the correct personnel to run it.
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Post by cfrivals on Jan 19, 2017 10:45:08 GMT -5
Two things to think about 1-we don't have the personnel to run it effectively 2- 35 sec to 30 sec clock is a huge factor to running the offense to it's best potential
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Post by ncaam on Jan 19, 2017 10:53:13 GMT -5
How about using both from time to time.
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Post by hchoops on Jan 19, 2017 10:57:33 GMT -5
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Post by Sons of Vaval on Jan 19, 2017 11:26:10 GMT -5
The PO is not just a stall offense. When the players execute it well, it produces back cuts for layups, quick post ups and open 3s. It is an offense vs man defenses only. When it is not run effectively, it results in last second rushed shots or turnovers, that are at least dead ball turnovers which do not result in transition opportunities. Pete Carrill's and now CBC's PO worked when they have the correct personnel to run it. Chris Mooney and JT3 don't run the PO in its traditional sense, but use its principles. Both Richmond's and Georgetown's offenses are hardly "stall offenses." Georgetown's adjusted tempo ranks as the 87th fastest, while Richmond is 108th.
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Post by hc811215 on Jan 19, 2017 11:32:14 GMT -5
I had to work last evening and only got to turn on the last 12 minutes or so. Wow! They really looked great on both ends down the stretch. Great road win! CLS looks like a real contributor. So much for those who say this team doesn't give maximum effort. It would have been very easy to let up when down 17 with 16 minutes to go. while Army is not bucknell or BU, a PL road win is good to have and more Ws in conference will guarantee us a home playoff game. I hope they can start a winning streak from here.
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Jan 19, 2017 11:42:17 GMT -5
RW had his share of them too. There were plenty of stretches where we were praying for some offensive firepower or at a minimum, a more efficient system. Many of RW's teams were excruciating to watch at the offensive end. But those teams more than compensated for this deficiency with their superior offensive rebounding and lock-down defenses - neither one of which Holy Cross has had since. Here's where the CRW teams ranked in PL play in (1) Offensive Rebounding Pctg, (2) Defense: effective FG Pctg, (3) Defense: creating turnovers, (4) Defensive Efficiency. Then you'll see our record in PL regular season and Playoffs. The KenPom site (what a bargain that subscription Is if this stuff interests you) starts with the 2001-2002 season 2001-02= 2--1--2--1 9-5 and 3-0 2002-03= 1--1--4--1 13-1 and 3-0 2003-04= 1--1--2--2 7-7 and 0-1 Strange season: in PL reg season won 7 games by average of 24 points (not a typo) and lost 7 games by average of 7 points. Lost by 6 in PL tournamanet 2004-05= 3--1--1--1 13-1 and 2-1 2005-06= 4--1--3-2 11-3 and 2-1 2006-07= 1--2--1--1 13-1 and 3-0 2007-08= 1--4--7--4 5-9 and 0-1 2008-09= 1--3--2--2 11-3 and 2-1
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Post by rgs318 on Jan 19, 2017 11:45:15 GMT -5
Agreed, hc811215. I was impressed by the poise the team showed over the last 17 minutes. They showed "quiet confidence" throughout. More than once AT or PB would catch teammate by his uniform and quickly make a point.
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Post by rgs318 on Jan 19, 2017 11:48:45 GMT -5
KY, I thought HC was leading the PL in defense. I believe in many ways they are the equal of RW's teams. CBC is certainly getting all these players have in that regard. However, rebounding has been (and may continue to be) a real issue/problem. I hope there is a solution to be found.
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