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MLB 2021
Nov 8, 2021 22:02:32 GMT -5
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Post by nycrusader2010 on Nov 8, 2021 22:02:32 GMT -5
Certainly Not in New York, Chicago, LA Possibly not in Boston either. Or Cleveland when they sold out a million games in a row.
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MLB 2021
Nov 8, 2021 22:22:33 GMT -5
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Post by longsuffering on Nov 8, 2021 22:22:33 GMT -5
Even if you speed up the time between pitches, you still have more pitches than you used to have fivethirtyeight.com/features/foul-balls-are-the-pace-of-play-problem-nobodys-talking-about/And a foul ball often necessitates a delay that the pitch clock won't solve (fielders go after the ball, getting a new ball in play, etc.). It also ramps up the pitcher's pitch count and gets them out of the game faster, so there's more pitching changes. I'd like to see in AAA a season where they ban shifts and see if the batters tend to put the ball in play more. Overshifting certainly hasn't resulted in more bunting, going the other way,. etc. A good way to defeat the shift is to dink and dunk it to death and make the defense "cover every inch of grass" as Patriots Mystery man Ernie Adams was quoted as telling Tom Brady to make football defenses do. No audio or photographic evidence of that conversation exists of course.
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Post by alum on Nov 9, 2021 6:21:57 GMT -5
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Post by Tom on Nov 9, 2021 8:31:47 GMT -5
Certainly Not in New York, Chicago, LA Possibly not in Boston either. Or Cleveland when they sold out a million games in a row. The vast majority loves their home team, but back in the 90's pretty much every house with cable was getting the Braves games - more so than the Mets or the Cubs. Also they were really good then. As a result, the Red Sox were king in New England, probably followed by the Yankees (from everyone who thought that DiMaggio still played centerfield), then the Braves. In Chicago, no one cared about the Red Sox. Probably Cubs, White Sox, then Braves in that order. Outside of Atlanta, the Braves weren't the favorite team, but they were probably the #2 or #3 team everywhere
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Post by Tom on Nov 9, 2021 8:41:36 GMT -5
Random rant, that might spark some debate. . .
Vlad Guerrero gets my vote for AL MVP. If I were voting for Most Outstanding Player, I would vote for Ohtani. But, the award is the Most Valuable Player. Ohtani might have been the difference that put the Angels in 2nd to last place in front of the horrible Rangers instead of last place. So what. An MVP has to be from a contender
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Post by alum on Nov 9, 2021 9:07:42 GMT -5
Random rant, that might spark some debate. . . Vlad Guerrero gets my vote for AL MVP. If I were voting for Most Outstanding Player, I would vote for Ohtani. But, the award is the Most Valuable Player. Ohtani might have been the difference that put the Angels in 2nd to last place in front of the horrible Rangers instead of last place. So what. An MVP has to be from a contender So, I'll play along here. So, his team finishing 4th of 5 in the division and tied for tenth in the league as a whole disqualifies a player? What if they were thrid and 9th? Can we vote for him now? I need to know where the line is drawn. The idea that a player puts his team on his back and carries them by himself is overrated in baseball. Maybe in basketball, a scorer can control the game sort of by himself, but in baseball where a hitter only gets to bat every ninth time and a starter gets to pitch every 5th day, I don't think that the impact on the team's success is measurable so I don't think your test is valid. So many things stand out about Ohtani when you look at the stats. He stole 26 bases and tied for the league lead in triples (8). They let him take chances on the basepaths which of necessity involves sliding with its risk of injury. I do like Vlad Jr. more than Ohtani because I like guys that hit for average as well as power. I would have to vote for Ohtani because he was a top fiver hitter in the league and a reasonably good pitcher.
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Post by hchoops on Nov 9, 2021 14:09:41 GMT -5
Ohtani did something that no one since Ruth has even tried to accomplish. He was Valuable as a pitcher who threw many innings, as a hitter who had many at bats and as a base runner as alum has noted
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Post by nycrusader2010 on Nov 12, 2021 7:14:28 GMT -5
Ohtani should be hands down MVP. Full stop.
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Post by Tom on Nov 12, 2021 11:56:33 GMT -5
Random rant, that might spark some debate. . . Vlad Guerrero gets my vote for AL MVP. If I were voting for Most Outstanding Player, I would vote for Ohtani. But, the award is the Most Valuable Player. Ohtani might have been the difference that put the Angels in 2nd to last place in front of the horrible Rangers instead of last place. So what. An MVP has to be from a contender So, I'll play along here. So, his team finishing 4th of 5 in the division and tied for tenth in the league as a whole disqualifies a player? What if they were thrid and 9th? Can we vote for him now? I need to know where the line is drawn. The idea that a player puts his team on his back and carries them by himself is overrated in baseball. Maybe in basketball, a scorer can control the game sort of by himself, but in baseball where a hitter only gets to bat every ninth time and a starter gets to pitch every 5th day, I don't think that the impact on the team's success is measurable so I don't think your test is valid. So many things stand out about Ohtani when you look at the stats. He stole 26 bases and tied for the league lead in triples (8). They let him take chances on the basepaths which of necessity involves sliding with its risk of injury. I do like Vlad Jr. more than Ohtani because I like guys that hit for average as well as power. I would have to vote for Ohtani because he was a top fiver hitter in the league and a reasonably good pitcher. My line is drawn that the team has to be in a reasonable hunt for the post season. The Angels really weren't in a pennant race. There are exceptions, but the MVP usually goes to someone on a team in the hunt. Heck Ted Williams won two triple crowns and wasn't the MVP in either season. The Cy Young award is for the best pitcher. The MVP is for the most valuable. As people frequently say on the basketball board "We can lose with you, we can lose without you" -
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Post by KY Crusader 75 on Nov 12, 2021 14:51:12 GMT -5
What a shame that the best player of this generation, Mike Trout, was injured for most of the year. The Angels would be formidable with him back in the lineup with Ohtani.
Ohtani basically had a Harmon Killebrew type of season at the plate....and added a 9-2 WL record as a pitcher on top of that. As great as Vlad was--and he could end up being "one for the ages'--my vote would go to Ohtani.
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MLB 2021
Nov 12, 2021 14:53:18 GMT -5
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Post by nycrusader2010 on Nov 12, 2021 14:53:18 GMT -5
Didn't AROD win the MVP for the last place Texas Rangers?
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Post by Tom on Nov 12, 2021 15:25:18 GMT -5
Didn't AROD win the MVP for the last place Texas Rangers? You are correct, 18 years ago AROD won the award. I said there are exceptions. Mike Trout has won a couple times on teams that weren't in contention. One could certainly make an argument if there was ever a player deserving of an exception, Ohtani is the guy. I'm not a fan of these exceptions. Is Ohani really valuable if he made a horrible team into a bad team? I suppose this is what happens when you have writers voting. Most years the player has to be a valuable member of a team that was realistically in the pennant race, but then there's an occasional year it goes to the best player even if he didn't help his team into contention. Not overly consistent.
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