|
Post by hceconhist on Nov 27, 2021 20:33:41 GMT -5
Left the game with about 7 minutes left. It was a long day after the football win and while I had hope that we'd do better and show improvement against UNH, we didn't. Here's the bottom line and sorry that it happens to be a Crossports cliche but "we just don't shoot it well" I'm not talking about contested shots, I'm talking about wide open shots that, unfortunately, every team we play, even D-3 teams, make pretty consistently. We have no outside shooters though I thought maybe Luc was one. Martindale is streaky but not on today (unless he was after I left). With no outside threat, UNH could pack it in on Louth and Gates inside. I, too noticed that loose 50/50 balls seem to be 90/10 for the opponents we play. Bottom line: no discernable progress. Wonder it there is a certain number of wins that the Nelson supporters who think he will turn things around will agree that maybe he isn't the right guy. Like 5 or fewer? That, knowing he already has 2 against D-3 teams. I'm agnostic on Coach Nelson right now, and I think that this start is putrid. That said, if he gets at least 8 wins in the PL, this set of games will be rightly forgotten.
|
|
|
Post by trimster on Nov 27, 2021 20:34:12 GMT -5
I just worry that a losing culture is taking deep roots. Even the positive ending to last season seems distant. Regarding today, just one question from me: why is it taking so long to get Townsel in the game? I dont get it - he works his tail off, and can actually make some plays offensively. Makes no sense to me. The positive ending to last season was largely due to the unreal play of Austin Butler.
|
|
|
Post by Sons of Vaval on Nov 27, 2021 20:34:43 GMT -5
I just worry that a losing culture is taking deep roots. Even the positive ending to last season seems distant. Regarding today, just one question from me: why is it taking so long to get Townsel in the game? I dont get it - he works his tail off, and can actually make some plays offensively. Makes no sense to me. At 8-45, how can losing not be permeating throughout the program? Attack and Serve doesn’t mean anything when the record is what it is. We had everyone back, at home, against a middling America East program and got absolutely whacked.
|
|
|
Post by sader1970 on Nov 27, 2021 20:35:01 GMT -5
trim, not saying it will happen, I'm saying it should happen. If he wins only 5 games this season (I'm expecting as bad as things are we will win more than that), that'd be:
1st season (full) 3 wins 2nd season (partial) 5 wins 3rd season (full) 5 or fewer wins (2 of which were against D-3 teams)
That's be 13 wins in 3 seasons (2.5 if you prefer).
|
|
|
Post by trimster on Nov 27, 2021 20:36:22 GMT -5
Left the game with about 7 minutes left. It was a long day after the football win and while I had hope that we'd do better and show improvement against UNH, we didn't. Here's the bottom line and sorry that it happens to be a Crossports cliche but "we just don't shoot it well" I'm not talking about contested shots, I'm talking about wide open shots that, unfortunately, every team we play, even D-3 teams, make pretty consistently. We have no outside shooters though I thought maybe Luc was one. Martindale is streaky but not on today (unless he was after I left). With no outside threat, UNH could pack it in on Louth and Gates inside. I, too noticed that loose 50/50 balls seem to be 90/10 for the opponents we play. Bottom line: no discernable progress. Wonder it there is a certain number of wins that the Nelson supporters who think he will turn things around will agree that maybe he isn't the right guy. Like 5 or fewer? That, knowing he already has 2 against D-3 teams. I'm agnostic on Coach Nelson right now, and I think that this start is putrid. That said, if he gets at least 8 wins in the PL, this set of games will be rightly forgotten. We’ll be fortunate to win 4.
|
|
|
Post by bfoley82 on Nov 27, 2021 20:41:15 GMT -5
I just worry that a losing culture is taking deep roots. Even the positive ending to last season seems distant. Regarding today, just one question from me: why is it taking so long to get Townsel in the game? I dont get it - he works his tail off, and can actually make some plays offensively. Makes no sense to me. At 8-45, how can losing not be permeating throughout the program? Attack and Serve doesn’t mean anything when the record is what it is. We had everyone back, at home, against a middling America East program and got absolutely whacked. Middling usually but they have been very competitive against Marquette and Providence. So maybe they are just good this year for the first time in their history.
|
|
|
Post by hceconhist on Nov 27, 2021 20:44:52 GMT -5
I'm agnostic on Coach Nelson right now, and I think that this start is putrid. That said, if he gets at least 8 wins in the PL, this set of games will be rightly forgotten. We’ll be fortunate to win 4. At this rate, you may be right.
|
|
|
Post by hc80 on Nov 27, 2021 21:09:30 GMT -5
Sorry but I think Nelson is the problem. Not to be too judgmental but when the coach at Holy Cross tells alums and season ticket holders that his players will sit in the front of the class and not wear a hat - well, he just does not belong at Holy Cross. Not a fit.
Plus, he was at Marquette- with Wojo - who was bloody awful. Happy to let Nelson go to Creighton - I think he is a fraud. Where has a really been a success???
Happy to be told - “told you so” - but doubtful it will ever happen
|
|
|
UNH Game
Nov 27, 2021 21:14:48 GMT -5
via mobile
hc80 likes this
Post by Sons of Vaval on Nov 27, 2021 21:14:48 GMT -5
Much like most of us thought Milan Brown was a fish out of water, it’s becoming painfully clear that Brett Nelson is a fish out of water at HC.
|
|
|
Post by KY Crusader 75 on Nov 27, 2021 21:26:34 GMT -5
They play hard but it appears they're just not very good. Need to start questioning whether the level of talent is good enough. May be good athletes but not good basketball players. Hope I'm wrong but so far they haven't really been competitive against mid level D1 opposition. The whole appears to be less than the sum of the parts. Bingo. Here's something that bothers me and as a caveat I frequently state that I admit I am no basketball expert. In past years, going back to the Willard regime, we often had players, including some starters, where I concluded "this guy is not a really talented player -he's not very good". Yet we were able to win. Yes, we did have guys, real talents, like JM, TT, TC, Dudz, Keith S, KHam, etc. But we had many "role players" as well. Incontrast, I look at our current roster and I don't see many guys where I make that same "not talented" conclusion. So I ask what else could be the reason why we are getting pummeled by mediocre teams? I think Ralph would have loved to have some of our current guys on his teams.
|
|
|
Post by hceconhist on Nov 27, 2021 21:27:19 GMT -5
To your larger point, SoV, I think its very clear that coaching at HC is much more akin to coaching at a selective D3 school than a top-tier D1 program. I don't think it's a coincidence that Paulsen was the best PL coach this past decade+.
|
|
|
Post by WorcesterGray on Nov 27, 2021 21:36:27 GMT -5
Regarding today, just one question from me: why is it taking so long to get Townsel in the game? I dont get it - he works his tail off, and can actually make some plays offensively. Makes no sense to me. Townsel is shooting a team-best 66% from the floor, is 75% from the line, and has a free-throw rate of 55% (also team-best).
|
|
|
UNH Game
Nov 27, 2021 21:51:11 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by Ignutz on Nov 27, 2021 21:51:11 GMT -5
Left the game with about 7 minutes left. It was a long day after the football win and while I had hope that we'd do better and show improvement against UNH, we didn't. Here's the bottom line and sorry that it happens to be a Crossports cliche but "we just don't shoot it well" I'm not talking about contested shots, I'm talking about wide open shots that, unfortunately, every team we play, even D-3 teams, make pretty consistently. We have no outside shooters though I thought maybe Luc was one. Martindale is streaky but not on today (unless he was after I left). With no outside threat, UNH could pack it in on Louth and Gates inside. I, too noticed that loose 50/50 balls seem to be 90/10 for the opponents we play. Bottom line: no discernable progress. Wonder it there is a certain number of wins that the Nelson supporters who think he will turn things around will agree that maybe he isn't the right guy. Like 5 or fewer? That, knowing he already has 2 against D-3 teams. I'm agnostic on Coach Nelson right now, and I think that this start is putrid. That said, if he gets at least 8 wins in the PL, this set of games will be rightly forgotten. Eight wins in the PL?? Against teams that are beating and taking Rutgers to OT, beating Syracuse, and beating Navy? I don’t see us having a snowball’s chance in hell of getting to eight total wins.
|
|
|
Post by sader81 on Nov 27, 2021 21:51:39 GMT -5
I watched half of the first half, and one comment from the announcers struck me. UNH had a frosh in the game, and he was the only underclassman expected to see playing time, according to the announcers. Let that sink in, as opposed to HC’s lineup. That’s huge at this level. Let’s see what happens.
|
|
|
UNH Game
Nov 27, 2021 21:52:38 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by Ignutz on Nov 27, 2021 21:52:38 GMT -5
Left the game with about 7 minutes left. It was a long day after the football win and while I had hope that we'd do better and show improvement against UNH, we didn't. Here's the bottom line and sorry that it happens to be a Crossports cliche but "we just don't shoot it well" I'm not talking about contested shots, I'm talking about wide open shots that, unfortunately, every team we play, even D-3 teams, make pretty consistently. We have no outside shooters though I thought maybe Luc was one. Martindale is streaky but not on today (unless he was after I left). With no outside threat, UNH could pack it in on Louth and Gates inside. I, too noticed that loose 50/50 balls seem to be 90/10 for the opponents we play. Bottom line: no discernable progress. Wonder it there is a certain number of wins that the Nelson supporters who think he will turn things around will agree that maybe he isn't the right guy. Like 5 or fewer? That, knowing he already has 2 against D-3 teams. I'm agnostic on Coach Nelson right now, and I think that this start is putrid. That said, if he gets at least 8 wins in the PL, this set of games will be rightly forgotten. Eight wins in the PL?? Against teams that are beating and taking Rutgers to OT, beating Syracuse, and beating Virginia? I don’t see us having a snowball’s chance in hell of getting to eight total wins.
|
|
|
Post by hceconhist on Nov 27, 2021 21:57:09 GMT -5
Not saying its likely, but that would be a marker of improvement.
|
|
|
Post by sader1970 on Nov 27, 2021 22:17:34 GMT -5
In case it didn't make it to the ESPN+ streaming, Torey was sitting courtside at the game tonight.
|
|
|
UNH Game
Nov 27, 2021 22:22:53 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by crusader1970 on Nov 27, 2021 22:22:53 GMT -5
It is so hard for me to understand how anyone, even a diehard Crusader hoop fan, can watch this team perform and still hold out hope that given more time Nelson will turn this program into a winner.
Really? Are you watching the same games I am?
There is a major problem here. We aren’t losing by a few points and showing improvement each game. We are getting embarrassed by very mediocre competition.
I can’t figure out yet if the problem is the talent or the coach….or both.
The CCSU game may provide some more clarity. They are the weakest remaining team on our schedule.
Another poor performance and even the most pessimistic projected win totals for the season should probably be adjusted down.
|
|
|
Post by timholycross on Nov 27, 2021 22:26:27 GMT -5
At 8-45, how can losing not be permeating throughout the program? Attack and Serve doesn’t mean anything when the record is what it is. We had everyone back, at home, against a middling America East program and got absolutely whacked. Middling usually but they have been very competitive against Marquette and Providence. So maybe they are just good this year for the first time in their history. They looked like they had a decent team, picked 3rd in that league. Not the Men of Gerry Friel from yesteryear.
|
|
|
Post by unhfan on Nov 27, 2021 22:28:06 GMT -5
Just got back in from the game and your team played hard and hit some threes which kept them in it and made the score more respectable. I was surprised with the lack of physical size for Holy Cross, it seemed that UNH players looked to be more physical. I know a lot of you love your Cross and I hope they do well in the PL. Best of luck the rest of the way.
|
|
|
Post by bringbackcaro on Nov 27, 2021 22:46:21 GMT -5
I can’t understand the extent of the apologists on this thread. Isn’t it patently obvious? It’s time to move on. Blame the quality of the recruiting? Yes. Question the preparation? Yes. Sorry, but wanting to give a guy more than 27 months (including a global pandemic) to turn around a dumpster fire handed to him by a guy who was semi-retired his entire 4-year tenure does not make one an “apologist.” Changing coaches and losing a significant chunk of the returning roster to transfers would set us back another 3-4+ years. Oh, and who are you going to hire? Sorry, but SOV’s guy from Skidmore isn’t going to magically turn things around overnight having to build a roster from scratch after never having recruited a scholarship roster before. Our best chance is Nelson figuring out how to turn things around over the next 15 months. I recommend doing some research on Matt Langel and Wes Miller. If the AD’s at Colgate and UNC Greensboro were as patient as you, those programs would likely still be in the sh*tter.
|
|
|
Post by unhfan on Nov 27, 2021 22:54:30 GMT -5
It is so hard for me to understand how anyone, even a diehard Crusader hoop fan, can watch this team perform and still hold out hope that given more time Nelson will turn this program into a winner. Really? Are you watching the same games I am? There is a major problem here. We aren’t losing by a few points and showing improvement each game. We are getting embarrassed by very mediocre competition. I can’t figure out yet if the problem is the talent or the coach….or both. The CCSU game may provide some more clarity. They are the weakest remaining team on our schedule. Another poor performance and even the most pessimistic projected win totals for the season should probably be adjusted down. I'm not sure why the comment about mediocre competition. UNH was picked to finish 3rd in America East and has played two Big East Teams very tough. I believe Holy Cross was picked 9th in the PL but I could be wrong. It's the one thing I don't get about this board the putting down of your opponents like Holy Cross is so much better than them and how could they possible lose to these schools. I understand loving your school but how about a little human decency and respecting every opponent on your schedule. Now some people on this board do that but so many are arrogant and full of it talking down any opponent that isn't from a P5. Come on be a better fan.
|
|
|
Post by nycrusader2010 on Nov 27, 2021 22:57:24 GMT -5
At 8-45, how can losing not be permeating throughout the program? Attack and Serve doesn’t mean anything when the record is what it is. We had everyone back, at home, against a middling America East program and got absolutely whacked. Middling usually but they have been very competitive against Marquette and Providence. So maybe they are just good this year for the first time in their history. UNH basketball has been on the up for 4 or 5 years now. Used to be one of the worst DI programs. Never thought I'd see the day when Holy Cross basketball would be aspiring to play at the level of Colgate and New Hampshire. But here we are. Happy for you guys.
|
|
|
UNH Game
Nov 27, 2021 22:57:36 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by HC92 on Nov 27, 2021 22:57:36 GMT -5
I watched the game on replay. I actually thought we did more good things than I’d seen in our previous D1 games. It’s possible my expectations are just so low that anything remotely positive seems good. One thing we should be able to agree on is that RJ and Luc give us a really good PL backcourt for the next three years.
|
|
|
Post by hc87 on Nov 27, 2021 22:59:41 GMT -5
It is so hard for me to understand how anyone, even a diehard Crusader hoop fan, can watch this team perform and still hold out hope that given more time Nelson will turn this program into a winner. Really? Are you watching the same games I am? There is a major problem here. We aren’t losing by a few points and showing improvement each game. We are getting embarrassed by very mediocre competition. I can’t figure out yet if the problem is the talent or the coach….or both. The CCSU game may provide some more clarity. They are the weakest remaining team on our schedule. Another poor performance and even the most pessimistic projected win totals for the season should probably be adjusted down. I'm not sure why the comment about mediocre competition. UNH was picked to finish 3rd in America East and has played two Big East Teams very tough. I believe Holy Cross was picked 9th in the PL but I could be wrong. It's the one thing I don't get about this board the putting down of your opponents like Holy Cross is so much better than them and how could they possible lose to these schools. I understand loving your school but how about a little human decency and respecting every opponent on your schedule. Now some people on this board do that but so many are arrogant and full of it talking down any opponent that isn't from a P5. Come on be a better fan. We coulda been in the Big East ya' know......
|
|